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Possible draft day info

Stars_and_stripes : 4/22/2024 5:46 pm
Came into some information recently and will try and share it exactly how it was disseminated.

Was at a very large get together up in North Jersey and a guy I met is apparently a blood relative of someone high up in the front office. Multiple people at the party attested to this fact.

A few drinks in a bunch of us were talking Giants . We went inside and after a few shots he pulled me and my friend aside as we were talking Giants and the draft with him the most knowledgably and intently.

Here's how he layed it out as best I remember: Parameters between Cards, Giants and Pats have been agreed to for a while if draft goes chalk in top 2.

Though front office opinions on Maye vary quite a bit... Enough teams feel Maye is either a top 2 or top 3 QB in this draft and would be QB1 in most others.

Pats boxed out on the guys they have the highest grade on. Lukewarm on Maye do like McCarthy quite a bit . I asked about all the recent rumors saying they favor Maye and he replied if they truly loved Maye you wouldn't hear all this open for business proclamations from the organization period. Are Chicago and Washington doing this?

Went on to say its very true that both Minny and Giants have been negotiating with Pats most heavily and target is Maye. All other media stuff just white noise. Both teams have Maye as significantly higher than any other QB not named Daniels or Williams.

Giants have the high hand though once it became clear that they can deliver what Pats want most and that would also entail getting the Cards involved. Cards want the blue chip WR and Pats want McCarthy most. Pats get some jingle and McCarthy is how he put it. Also said Pats didn't throw their hat in the ring for a near 9 digit deal with Ridley to pair him with Brisset.

Said Cards are loaded but recognize they can get essentially free picks and still end up with the blue chip after the QB slots thin out.

Oh yeah said Burns deal way back was consummated clearly knowing what Pats wanted most and was explained as when QB is a need for your team it takes precedence over everything including pass rusher.

Ultimately said they have parameters as a 3 way trade as well as double trade up. Not sure which way they go as each permutation is slightly different. Might be a surprise player included going to the Patriots.
Makes sense  
armstead98 : 4/22/2024 5:50 pm : link
Who knows if info is good but it works as long as cards feel like they get enough to miss out on MHJ
What sucks  
Jaenyg : 4/22/2024 5:50 pm : link
Is we couldn’t pull any of this shit in 2020 when we picked 4th.

Chargers and Dolphins got to just sit pat.
If all this is true  
Jaenyg : 4/22/2024 5:51 pm : link
Can’t we sit tight?
 
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/22/2024 5:52 pm : link
‘A few drinks in us.’ Liquid courage!

Thanks for info though.
Way too logical!  
BigTymer : 4/22/2024 5:52 pm : link
I kid but really this would all make way more sense than some of the other stuff we’ve been hearing. Long wait.

I’d still prefer Nabers but have no qualms with JS having convictions as they know more than me! Thanks for sharing.
So  
regischarlotte : 4/22/2024 5:53 pm : link
what number would Maye be wearing in big blue?
Sounds very legit.  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 5:55 pm : link
I actually suggested this multiple times and was told this never happens. I guess if they really love Maye then it's safer to do this than risk Minnesota getting him at 4 or something. Would be nice if we just had a deal setup with AZ and NE took JJM at 4, but that's not how life works for the NYG.
You sir have been added to the asshat roundup  
widmerseyebrow : 4/22/2024 5:57 pm : link
in my BBI profile.
Pick 70 and 2025 2nd to AZ,  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 5:58 pm : link
Pick 47 to NE? I wonder how Schoen could get this done without 2025 1st. No way to avoid trading 47 and 2025 1st.
Surprise player going to Pats  
Breeze_94 : 4/22/2024 5:59 pm : link
Wonder who…maybe Azeez? Seems to be almost logical. Second guess would be Slayton but I’m not sure that helps NE as they have a bunch of #2/#3 types.
RE: If all this is true  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:00 pm : link
In comment 16480101 Jaenyg said:
Quote:
Can’t we sit tight?


Minnesota could trade with LAC then AZ or direct with AZ. If they love Maye then this would be the way to secure him, unfortunately.
RE: Pick 70 and 2025 2nd to AZ,  
widmerseyebrow : 4/22/2024 6:00 pm : link
In comment 16480115 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
Pick 47 to NE? I wonder how Schoen could get this done without 2025 1st. No way to avoid trading 47 and 2025 1st.


According to GoDeep they really want to keep 47 and 2025 1st is off the table completely.

This guy is saying a surprise NYG player could be involved.
RE: …  
BigBlueShock : 4/22/2024 6:01 pm : link
In comment 16480102 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
‘A few drinks in us.’ Liquid courage!

Thanks for info though.

I have a coworker like that. Get a few drinks in him and he starts telling state secrets. Every single time. If you tell that dude anything in confidence, you’re a freakin moron, lol
Ridley?  
Woodstock : 4/22/2024 6:01 pm : link
.
also why can’t high ranking NFL execs  
Breeze_94 : 4/22/2024 6:01 pm : link
Keep a secret
RE: Surprise player going to Pats  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:01 pm : link
In comment 16480116 Breeze_94 said:
Quote:
Wonder who…maybe Azeez? Seems to be almost logical. Second guess would be Slayton but I’m not sure that helps NE as they have a bunch of #2/#3 types.


KT? Hyatt? Slayton? Neal? If we traded KT we could potentially do this all for pick 6, 70 2025 2nd and KT. 6, 70 and 2025 2nd to AZ
, then KT to NE. We could then make a move for Aiyuk with 47 and conditional 4th/3rd 2025 pick.
Never mind  
Woodstock : 4/22/2024 6:03 pm : link
I understand
RE: Ridley?  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:03 pm : link
In comment 16480123 Woodstock said:
Quote:
.


Asshat communication going down like ewoks communicating.

Sounds like Woodstock might have not be disagreeing with this.
RE: also why can’t high ranking NFL execs  
widmerseyebrow : 4/22/2024 6:04 pm : link
In comment 16480124 Breeze_94 said:
Quote:
Keep a secret


This handle is 04/24 so could be more disinformation or nothing at all. I'm enjoying it either way.
RE: So  
Gman11 : 4/22/2024 6:04 pm : link
In comment 16480105 regischarlotte said:
Quote:
what number would Maye be wearing in big blue?


8
RE: Never mind  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:04 pm : link
In comment 16480127 Woodstock said:
Quote:
I understand


So this isn't far fetched to you then, Woody?
RE: also why can’t high ranking NFL execs  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/22/2024 6:04 pm : link
In comment 16480124 Breeze_94 said:
Quote:
Keep a secret


Alcohol.
RE: RE: also why can’t high ranking NFL execs  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:05 pm : link
In comment 16480130 widmerseyebrow said:
Quote:
In comment 16480124 Breeze_94 said:


Quote:


Keep a secret



This handle is 04/24 so could be more disinformation or nothing at all. I'm enjoying it either way.


I dont think Woodstock wouldn't have posted like he did if it was disinformation..
RE: If all this is true  
Sean : 4/22/2024 6:06 pm : link
In comment 16480101 Jaenyg said:
Quote:
Can’t we sit tight?

No, because it's the only way to box out the Vikings and guarantee Maye. This makes sense although don't love someone slamming down shots and having loose lips.
RE: RE: If all this is true  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:07 pm : link
In comment 16480140 Sean said:
Quote:
In comment 16480101 Jaenyg said:


Quote:


Can’t we sit tight?


No, because it's the only way to box out the Vikings and guarantee Maye. This makes sense although don't love someone slamming down shots and having loose lips.


It's the brother of an executive, what can you do? I guess not tell your brother.
RE: RE: Pick 70 and 2025 2nd to AZ,  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:10 pm : link
In comment 16480121 widmerseyebrow said:
Quote:
In comment 16480115 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


Pick 47 to NE? I wonder how Schoen could get this done without 2025 1st. No way to avoid trading 47 and 2025 1st.



According to GoDeep they really want to keep 47 and 2025 1st is off the table completely.

This guy is saying a surprise NYG player could be involved.


Yeah, would have to be someone worth a 2nd round pick I think. That reduces it to just KT or maybe Hyatt.

Maybe AZ complies for pick 107 and 2025 2nd, then NE takes Hyatt and gets the guy Kraft wants. Would be sad to see Hyatt or KT go, but saving that pick 47 could help us net Aiyuk which would help a lot for any rookie QB to have a vet security blanket like that.
This  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 6:11 pm : link
is no more plausible or implausible than everything else we've heard. A three-way deal was always possible, but we've also heard from several asshats that the Giants don't want to give up their #1 next year in any trade. But they can't get to #3 without doing so. PrettyRickey213, who was all over the Burns trade, has also said that the Vikings and Cardinals have had "productive talks." Why would that be happening if this three-way deal was already in place? So which is it? We'll find out in a few days.
RE: This  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:13 pm : link
In comment 16480146 AcidTest said:
Quote:
is no more plausible or implausible than everything else we've heard. A three-way deal was always possible, but we've also heard from several asshats that the Giants don't want to give up their #1 next year in any trade. But they can't get to #3 without doing so. PrettyRickey213, who was all over the Burns trade, has also said that the Vikings and Cardinals have had "productive talks." Why would that be happening if this three-way deal was already in place? So which is it? We'll find out in a few days.


If Kayvon was involved, NYG could potentially get this done for just 2025 2nd and pick 70 or 107 to AZ then KT to NE (who would be getting the guy they would take at 3 anyways plus Kayvon for their trouble).

This is what the dd in Mass poster has said as well  
Sean : 4/22/2024 6:14 pm : link
He's talked about a 3 team trade essentially. I think this makes the most sense.

NYG - Maye
NE - McCarthy (plus picks)
ARI - Harrison/Nabers (plus picks)

It will be the most expensive for NYG.
RE: RE: Pick 70 and 2025 2nd to AZ,  
Capt. Don : 4/22/2024 6:15 pm : link
In comment 16480121 widmerseyebrow said:
Quote:
In comment 16480115 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


Pick 47 to NE? I wonder how Schoen could get this done without 2025 1st. No way to avoid trading 47 and 2025 1st.



According to GoDeep they really want to keep 47 and 2025 1st is off the table completely.

This guy is saying a surprise NYG player could be involved.


I really hope it isn't Hyatt. I like Slayton but that would be fine by me.
RE: So  
Blue21 : 4/22/2024 6:15 pm : link
In comment 16480105 regischarlotte said:
Quote:
what number would Maye be wearing in big blue?
10 Hasn't he been working with Eli too?
RE: This is what the dd in Mass poster has said as well  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:16 pm : link
In comment 16480150 Sean said:
Quote:
He's talked about a 3 team trade essentially. I think this makes the most sense.

NYG - Maye
NE - McCarthy (plus picks)
ARI - Harrison/Nabers (plus picks)

It will be the most expensive for NYG.


True dd in Mass said he knows some Pats family people and said the same thing about a deal with NYG, AZ and NE that was held up by AZ's demands.
RE: This  
widmerseyebrow : 4/22/2024 6:17 pm : link
In comment 16480146 AcidTest said:
Quote:
PrettyRickey213, who was all over the Burns trade, has also said that the Vikings and Cardinals have had "productive talks." Why would that be happening if this three-way deal was already in place? So which is it? We'll find out in a few days.


MIN and ARI could just have a conditional deal in place in case Maye gets to #4. Every deal has to be conditional until Williams and Daniels picks are official.
RE: RE: RE: Pick 70 and 2025 2nd to AZ,  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:17 pm : link
In comment 16480152 Capt. Don said:
Quote:
In comment 16480121 widmerseyebrow said:


Quote:


In comment 16480115 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


Pick 47 to NE? I wonder how Schoen could get this done without 2025 1st. No way to avoid trading 47 and 2025 1st.



According to GoDeep they really want to keep 47 and 2025 1st is off the table completely.

This guy is saying a surprise NYG player could be involved.



I really hope it isn't Hyatt. I like Slayton but that would be fine by me.


Slayton wouldn't carry much value, maybe a 6th. Hyatt could be seen as a 2025 2nd in value potentially. Kayvon would be like a 2025 1st in value. It would have to be Kayvon or Hyatt if you ask me, no one else I could think of with enough value.
.  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 4/22/2024 6:18 pm : link
Quote:
if they truly loved Maye you wouldn't hear all this open for business proclamations from the organization period. Are Chicago and Washington doing this?


I’ve wondered about this too recently. If the Pats were completely locked into whichever of the top three QBs drops, why would any of the “open for business” talk be happening? It makes no sense, although I expect the Pats to eventually take whichever one of those guys is left.

If there’s a scenario in which there’s a trade to be made with the Cardinals, I’m not sure how the Giants would be outbid. The sixth pick has real value with Nabers and Odunze possibly available.
Damnit !!!  
Bob in Vt : 4/22/2024 6:18 pm : link
I read this and now I have renewed hope for a potential franchise QB being drafted. I had just about convinced myself that this was unattainable. Now I am not so sure.
Argh !!
3 way draft day trades are tough in NFL  
ZogZerg : 4/22/2024 6:18 pm : link
I'm sure they have happened, but I can't recall the last time one has.
I proposed this a while back  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 6:19 pm : link
It makes too much sense. Several people said wouldn’t happen because 3 way trades don’t happen. But again, it makes perfect sense for the three teams. It’s a win win win.
Probably nothing but ESPN and CBS depth charts  
widmerseyebrow : 4/22/2024 6:20 pm : link
have Eluemunor at RT and Stinnie at G. Evan Neal on the bench.
RE: 3 way draft day trades are tough in NFL  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:21 pm : link
In comment 16480162 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
I'm sure they have happened, but I can't recall the last time one has.


Technically this could be done as just trading up twice, not really a 3 way trade. I've mentioned this as a likely scenario for a while now, but everytime I was told 0 chance it doesn't happen period end of story.
RE: RE: This  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 6:22 pm : link
In comment 16480148 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480146 AcidTest said:


Quote:


is no more plausible or implausible than everything else we've heard. A three-way deal was always possible, but we've also heard from several asshats that the Giants don't want to give up their #1 next year in any trade. But they can't get to #3 without doing so. PrettyRickey213, who was all over the Burns trade, has also said that the Vikings and Cardinals have had "productive talks." Why would that be happening if this three-way deal was already in place? So which is it? We'll find out in a few days.



If Kayvon was involved, NYG could potentially get this done for just 2025 2nd and pick 70 or 107 to AZ then KT to NE (who would be getting the guy they would take at 3 anyways plus Kayvon for their trouble).


I'd be stunned and pretty pissed if we traded KT. With Burns we now have a plausible pass rush, something that was basically nonexistent last year. Trading him would be idiotic. But I'm fine trading Neal and Ojulari.
Who would you rather keep: Hyatt or Wandale?  
widmerseyebrow : 4/22/2024 6:22 pm : link
?
RE: I proposed this a while back  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 4/22/2024 6:22 pm : link
In comment 16480164 UberAlias said:
Quote:
It makes too much sense. Several people said wouldn’t happen because 3 way trades don’t happen. But again, it makes perfect sense for the three teams. It’s a win win win.


Ending with the Giants at 4, Cards at 5, and Chargers at 6?
mark  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 6:22 pm : link
another asshat checkmark in the Maye column.

RE: I proposed this a while back  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:23 pm : link
In comment 16480164 UberAlias said:
Quote:
It makes too much sense. Several people said wouldn’t happen because 3 way trades don’t happen. But again, it makes perfect sense for the three teams. It’s a win win win.


I think we were the only ones saying this could be a likely scenario and everyone told us no chance lol. I wouldn't love this as it would be costly, but if they love Maye this much then you'd have to be enthusiastic about their conviction.
RE: RE: So  
Capt. Don : 4/22/2024 6:23 pm : link
In comment 16480132 Gman11 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480105 regischarlotte said:


Quote:


what number would Maye be wearing in big blue?



8


I lolled
Than why the fuck trade at all????????  
George from PA : 4/22/2024 6:25 pm : link
Patriots draft JLL
Arizona draft MHJ

And we get Maye.

Schoen will be a fool if he gives up premium picks.
RE: Than why the fuck trade at all????????  
widmerseyebrow : 4/22/2024 6:26 pm : link
In comment 16480176 George from PA said:
Quote:
Patriots draft JLL
Arizona draft MHJ

And we get Maye.

Schoen will be a fool if he gives up premium picks.


You're hoping then that Minnesota or someone else doesn't trade up with Arizona or LAC and take Maye.
Actually this seems too complicated to not have some validity to it  
Blue21 : 4/22/2024 6:26 pm : link
.
RE: Surprise player going to Pats  
Optimus-NY : 4/22/2024 6:27 pm : link
In comment 16480116 Breeze_94 said:
Quote:
Wonder who…maybe Azeez? Seems to be almost logical. Second guess would be Slayton but I’m not sure that helps NE as they have a bunch of #2/#3 types.


Evan Neal? Hyatt?
RE: Than why the fuck trade at all????????  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:27 pm : link
In comment 16480176 George from PA said:
Quote:
Patriots draft JLL
Arizona draft MHJ

And we get Maye.

Schoen will be a fool if he gives up premium picks.


Because Minnesota would likely figure out a way to get Maye at 4 or 5 or via their own double trade up. I don't love it, but it makes sense and is what dd in Mass had been saying plus Woodstock seemed like he might be on a similar page too.
RE: Probably nothing but ESPN and CBS depth charts  
Capt. Don : 4/22/2024 6:28 pm : link
In comment 16480167 widmerseyebrow said:
Quote:
have Eluemunor at RT and Stinnie at G. Evan Neal on the bench.


So does Ourlads. Sy, what do you know?
Lonk - ( New Window )
RE: also why can’t high ranking NFL execs  
Optimus-NY : 4/22/2024 6:28 pm : link
In comment 16480124 Breeze_94 said:
Quote:
Keep a secret


Cuz they're mongos.
RE: RE: Surprise player going to Pats  
PatersonPlank : 4/22/2024 6:29 pm : link
In comment 16480125 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480116 Breeze_94 said:


Quote:


Wonder who…maybe Azeez? Seems to be almost logical. Second guess would be Slayton but I’m not sure that helps NE as they have a bunch of #2/#3 types.



KT? Hyatt? Slayton? Neal? If we traded KT we could potentially do this all for pick 6, 70 2025 2nd and KT. 6, 70 and 2025 2nd to AZ
, then KT to NE. We could then make a move for Aiyuk with 47 and conditional 4th/3rd 2025 pick.


Jones?
RE: RE: RE: This  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:29 pm : link
In comment 16480170 AcidTest said:
Quote:
In comment 16480148 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480146 AcidTest said:


Quote:


is no more plausible or implausible than everything else we've heard. A three-way deal was always possible, but we've also heard from several asshats that the Giants don't want to give up their #1 next year in any trade. But they can't get to #3 without doing so. PrettyRickey213, who was all over the Burns trade, has also said that the Vikings and Cardinals have had "productive talks." Why would that be happening if this three-way deal was already in place? So which is it? We'll find out in a few days.



If Kayvon was involved, NYG could potentially get this done for just 2025 2nd and pick 70 or 107 to AZ then KT to NE (who would be getting the guy they would take at 3 anyways plus Kayvon for their trouble).




I'd be stunned and pretty pissed if we traded KT. With Burns we now have a plausible pass rush, something that was basically nonexistent last year. Trading him would be idiotic. But I'm fine trading Neal and Ojulari.


I would be too, but who besides Deonte Banks (not moving), Hyatt, Wandale, and KT have value equal to a 2nd at least?
New England has lots of  
jvm52106 : 4/22/2024 6:30 pm : link
Holes and Giants and Cards could make this deal work..

So it I get the pick set up- Gmen to 3, NE to 4 and AZ to 6..


One thing to keep in Mind, New England has the most cap space in 2024 and projected in 2025.. They can take on salary..

RE: New England has lots of  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 6:31 pm : link
In comment 16480187 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
Holes and Giants and Cards could make this deal work..

So it I get the pick set up- Gmen to 3, NE to 4 and AZ to 6..


One thing to keep in Mind, New England has the most cap space in 2024 and projected in 2025.. They can take on salary..


Daniel Jones type salary?

I kid.
Could the surprise player be Neal? They need oline help.  
Blue21 : 4/22/2024 6:31 pm : link
.
RE: New England has lots of  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:31 pm : link
In comment 16480187 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
Holes and Giants and Cards could make this deal work..

So it I get the pick set up- Gmen to 3, NE to 4 and AZ to 6..


One thing to keep in Mind, New England has the most cap space in 2024 and projected in 2025.. They can take on salary..


No one is taking dj lol
If Neal goes  
widmerseyebrow : 4/22/2024 6:32 pm : link
That would basically mean Bricillo saw the tape and said "Let's not waste our time." I'd be really surprised if they moved him without any practice time with the new coach.
I  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 6:32 pm : link
guess we'd trade with NE and then they would trade with AZ to take JJM. That would vindicate BleedBlue46 and a few others, but again, how do we trade with NE without giving up our #1 next year, which several asshats have said we won't do? And if NE wants JJM, then why trade with them at all? Let them take him, and then trade with AZ for Maye, since doing so would be much cheaper than trading with NE. Are we concerned that if we don't trade with NE that they might trade with MN? MN has likely offered #11, #23, and their #1 and #3 next year for #3. Beating that is going to require #6, #47, our #1 next year, and probably a player or two. How much are we willing to trade to move up for Maye?
RE: Could the surprise player be Neal? They need oline help.  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:33 pm : link
In comment 16480189 Blue21 said:
Quote:
.


Could be, but I'd be surprised if he moved the needle at all.
Yes, Jones could be part  
jvm52106 : 4/22/2024 6:33 pm : link
Of that deal especially if we are paying a good portion of his money but, Pats have cap space.. Jones backing up Brisset for one year let's Pats fill multiple holes..

I suspect Evan Neal and maybe even Waller (to AZ) could be part of a deal..
RE: Than why the fuck trade at all????????  
Sean : 4/22/2024 6:33 pm : link
In comment 16480176 George from PA said:
Quote:
Patriots draft JLL
Arizona draft MHJ

And we get Maye.

Schoen will be a fool if he gives up premium picks.

Not at all. You don't sit around and wait, you go get the QB. The Vikings are aggressively trying to move up.
RE: RE: Than why the fuck trade at all????????  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 6:34 pm : link
In comment 16480177 widmerseyebrow said:
Quote:
In comment 16480176 George from PA said:


Quote:


Patriots draft JLL
Arizona draft MHJ

And we get Maye.

Schoen will be a fool if he gives up premium picks.



You're hoping then that Minnesota or someone else doesn't trade up with Arizona or LAC and take Maye.


I think the assumption is that AZ doesn't want to trade with MN because they would lost out on all of the "big three" WRs. They also already have a ton of draft capital.
RE: I  
Sean : 4/22/2024 6:35 pm : link
In comment 16480193 AcidTest said:
Quote:
guess we'd trade with NE and then they would trade with AZ to take JJM. That would vindicate BleedBlue46 and a few others, but again, how do we trade with NE without giving up our #1 next year, which several asshats have said we won't do? And if NE wants JJM, then why trade with them at all? Let them take him, and then trade with AZ for Maye, since doing so would be much cheaper than trading with NE. Are we concerned that if we don't trade with NE that they might trade with MN? MN has likely offered #11, #23, and their #1 and #3 next year for #3. Beating that is going to require #6, #47, our #1 next year, and probably a player or two. How much are we willing to trade to move up for Maye?

I think they move the 2025-1 if they need to.
Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
Section331 : 4/22/2024 6:36 pm : link
would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.
Just to confirm I followed right, this ends with...  
Blue Dog : 4/22/2024 6:37 pm : link
* Caleb Williams, Bears
* Jayden Daniels, Commanders
* Drake Maye, Giants (boxed out Vikings because of #6)
* J.J. McCarthy, Patriots (took Giants trade because they still get their QB)
* Chargers
* Cardinals (took trade because guaranteed one MHJ/Nabers/Odunze)
RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 6:38 pm : link
In comment 16480204 Section331 said:
Quote:
would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.


Agreed, unless it's because they feel that doing this deal can net them JJM and extra draft picks. That IMO is too risky when they deal involves a QB, but GMs are often stupid.
RE: Just to confirm I followed right, this ends with...  
Sean : 4/22/2024 6:38 pm : link
In comment 16480206 Blue Dog said:
Quote:
* Caleb Williams, Bears
* Jayden Daniels, Commanders
* Drake Maye, Giants (boxed out Vikings because of #6)
* J.J. McCarthy, Patriots (took Giants trade because they still get their QB)
* Chargers
* Cardinals (took trade because guaranteed one MHJ/Nabers/Odunze)

Yep. It makes sense. All would be contingent on Daniels to WSH.
RE: I  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:39 pm : link
In comment 16480193 AcidTest said:
Quote:
guess we'd trade with NE and then they would trade with AZ to take JJM. That would vindicate BleedBlue46 and a few others, but again, how do we trade with NE without giving up our #1 next year, which several asshats have said we won't do? And if NE wants JJM, then why trade with them at all? Let them take him, and then trade with AZ for Maye, since doing so would be much cheaper than trading with NE. Are we concerned that if we don't trade with NE that they might trade with MN? MN has likely offered #11, #23, and their #1 and #3 next year for #3. Beating that is going to require #6, #47, our #1 next year, and probably a player or two. How much are we willing to trade to move up for Maye?


I'm envisioning it as a trade up with AZ first for pick 70 or 107 plus 2025 2nd, then flipping a player to NE to move up one spot. I don't see Neal having enough value, only players that could make sense to me would be Hyatt or Thibs.

And I know people would wonder, why trade up with NE after getting to pick 4? All I can think of is honoring your word and maybe Wolf telling Schoen he really wants Maye, but Kraft wants JJM so at least he can get a good player to hedge Kraft's bet?
RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
Blue Dog : 4/22/2024 6:39 pm : link
In comment 16480204 Section331 said:
Quote:
would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.


Because the Giants and Vikings are fighting over the QB they don't want and offering big price tags.
RE: RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:40 pm : link
In comment 16480208 AcidTest said:
Quote:
In comment 16480204 Section331 said:


Quote:


would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.



Agreed, unless it's because they feel that doing this deal can net them JJM and extra draft picks. That IMO is too risky when they deal involves a QB, but GMs are often stupid.


It wouldn't be risky if we traded up with AZ first, then NE.
RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
Sean : 4/22/2024 6:40 pm : link
In comment 16480204 Section331 said:
Quote:
would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.

Because they very well might get an additional first next year.
RE: Actually this seems too complicated to not have some validity to it  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 6:41 pm : link
In comment 16480179 Blue21 said:
Quote:
.


My thought exactly.
Waller  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 6:42 pm : link
is not going to be part of any deal. He is basically retired and therefore untradeable.
RE: RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:42 pm : link
In comment 16480215 Sean said:
Quote:
In comment 16480204 Section331 said:


Quote:


would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.


Because they very well might get an additional first next year.


Or Kayvon or at minimum Hyatt. I still think Schoen could get this done without trading 2025 1st or pick 47, but you're going to lose a promising young player.
RE: RE: RE: This  
bw in dc : 4/22/2024 6:43 pm : link
In comment 16480170 AcidTest said:
Quote:


I'd be stunned and pretty pissed if we traded KT. With Burns we now have a plausible pass rush, something that was basically nonexistent last year. Trading him would be idiotic. But I'm fine trading Neal and Ojulari.


Everyone not named Andrew Thomas should be expendable and available to trade.

KT is not LT.
BTW  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 6:43 pm : link
Pauline is on with Schmeelk and saying the same thing we've heard. Maye has to sit a season or you can "ruin" him. Pauline is saying this is what he's being told about Maye. But his upside is tremendous if you are patient for one season.
RE: RE: I proposed this a while back  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 6:43 pm : link
In comment 16480172 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480164 UberAlias said:


Quote:


It makes too much sense. Several people said wouldn’t happen because 3 way trades don’t happen. But again, it makes perfect sense for the three teams. It’s a win win win.



Ending with the Giants at 4, Cards at 5, and Chargers at 6?
Giants get Maye at 3, Pats get JJM at 4, and Az gets MHJ or Nabers at 6.
Pauline  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 6:44 pm : link
is saying Pats open to small trade down.
this is interesting  
Eric on Li : 4/22/2024 6:45 pm : link
complicated maybe but honestly makes sense all around - but only if NE and NYG are sure of who the other is picking.

i'd imagine it's something like 1 day 2 pick to each team, maybe 2 to ARI?

2 contributed by NYG (1x to each),
1 contributed by NE (to ARI).
RE: Waller  
jvm52106 : 4/22/2024 6:45 pm : link
In comment 16480217 AcidTest said:
Quote:
is not going to be part of any deal. He is basically retired and therefore untradeable.


Is he or is he trying to force his way out of NY.
Pauline  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 6:46 pm : link
says Denver really wants J.J. McCarthy.
RE: Could the surprise player be Neal? They need oline help.  
mfsd : 4/22/2024 6:46 pm : link
In comment 16480189 Blue21 said:
Quote:
.


I thought the same

I also agree with the poster above…if true, way too many loose lips in this org
RE: What sucks  
Mayo2JZ : 4/22/2024 6:47 pm : link
In comment 16480098 Jaenyg said:
Quote:
Is we couldn’t pull any of this shit in 2020 when we picked 4th.

Chargers and Dolphins got to just sit pat.


What sucks is that this kind of information is disseminated after a few drinks from some wahoo in the Giants organization. I don't want to know anything until they pick at 6. It just pisses me off that this information is getting out.
RE: RE: What sucks  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:48 pm : link
In comment 16480230 Mayo2JZ said:
Quote:
In comment 16480098 Jaenyg said:


Quote:


Is we couldn’t pull any of this shit in 2020 when we picked 4th.

Chargers and Dolphins got to just sit pat.



What sucks is that this kind of information is disseminated after a few drinks from some wahoo in the Giants organization. I don't want to know anything until they pick at 6. It just pisses me off that this information is getting out.


It's supposedly some wahoo brother of an executive lol, not the executive himself.
RE: This is what the dd in Mass poster has said as well  
Optimus-NY : 4/22/2024 6:49 pm : link
In comment 16480150 Sean said:
Quote:
He's talked about a 3 team trade essentially. I think this makes the most sense.

NYG - Maye
NE - McCarthy (plus picks)
ARI - Harrison/Nabers (plus picks)

It will be the most expensive for NYG.


Makes sense.
RE: RE: RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 6:50 pm : link
In comment 16480219 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480215 Sean said:


Quote:


In comment 16480204 Section331 said:


Quote:


would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.


Because they very well might get an additional first next year.



Or Kayvon or at minimum Hyatt. I still think Schoen could get this done without trading 2025 1st or pick 47, but you're going to lose a promising young player.


If you don't want to trade #47 or our #1 next year, we'd have to trade KT, Neal, Hyatt, and at least our #2 next year. I guess if we traded that many players, we'd be very attractive to UDFAs after the draft.
If the Giants really believe in Maye  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 6:51 pm : link
this makes sense, but just keep in mind that that will likely make this a 2 player draft.
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/22/2024 6:51 pm : link
Watch Neal get traded & becomes an all Pro. It'd be so fitting.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:52 pm : link
In comment 16480237 AcidTest said:
Quote:
In comment 16480219 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480215 Sean said:


Quote:


In comment 16480204 Section331 said:


Quote:


would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.


Because they very well might get an additional first next year.



Or Kayvon or at minimum Hyatt. I still think Schoen could get this done without trading 2025 1st or pick 47, but you're going to lose a promising young player.



If you don't want to trade #47 or our #1 next year, we'd have to trade KT, Neal, Hyatt, and at least our #2 next year. I guess if we traded that many players, we'd be very attractive to UDFAs after the draft.


I think we could give AZ pick 70 or 107 and 2035 2nd, then NE Kayvon for their trouble. It's basically a free cheap quality edge rusher for 2-3 years and they get the same QB Kraft would have had them draft anyways.

We don't have to trade up with NE first, we could just trade up twice: once to 4 then to 3.
RE: If the Giants really believe in Maye  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/22/2024 6:52 pm : link
In comment 16480239 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
this makes sense, but just keep in mind that that will likely make this a 2 player draft.


in which case @ least the hamster will be able to rest after a busy Thursday night.
RE: If the Giants really believe in Maye  
jvm52106 : 4/22/2024 6:53 pm : link
In comment 16480239 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
this makes sense, but just keep in mind that that will likely make this a 2 player draft.


If we include players maybe not.. This trade would move NE and AZ back one pick each, Gmen jump up 2..

I am willing to give up what I need to for Maye..
RE: If the Giants really believe in Maye  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:53 pm : link
In comment 16480239 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
this makes sense, but just keep in mind that that will likely make this a 2 player draft.


This could theoretically be done for pick 6, 70, 2025 2nd and Kayvon.
It jives well with all the other asshats  
widmerseyebrow : 4/22/2024 6:55 pm : link
EXCEPT GoDeep and Peppers (maybe). And even the Peppers tidbit could just be the fact that Maye is not unanimous at Giants HQ. What a crazy year.

Then factor in that GoDeep admits he was authorized.

My gut is telling me it's been Maye all along.
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/22/2024 6:55 pm : link
KT? I don't see that. Even EA wouldn't include Osi in the Eli trade & Thibs has shown much more than Osi had @ that juncture.
I seriously  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 6:55 pm : link
doubt Thibodeaux is on the table.
RE: RE: 3 way draft day trades are tough in NFL  
Blue Dog : 4/22/2024 6:55 pm : link
In comment 16480168 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480162 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


I'm sure they have happened, but I can't recall the last time one has.



Technically this could be done as just trading up twice, not really a 3 way trade. I've mentioned this as a likely scenario for a while now, but everytime I was told 0 chance it doesn't happen period end of story.


Since the Patriots need the Cardinals involved it is still one trade up. So the Patriots would end up with Giants draft picks and the Cardinals would end up with Patriot draft picks. Patriots are going down then back up, they're the ones moving twice.
RE: ...  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:56 pm : link
In comment 16480251 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
KT? I don't see that. Even EA wouldn't include Osi in the Eli trade & Thibs has shown much more than Osi had @ that juncture.


I wouldn't love it, but if they want Maye and maybe Aiyuk for Maye plus their 2025 1st. Then they gotta do what they gotta do.
 
ryanmkeane : 4/22/2024 6:57 pm : link
Giants saw Maye play 6 times in 2023. He’s the pick if the Pats want to trade down.
RE: I seriously  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:57 pm : link
In comment 16480253 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
doubt Thibodeaux is on the table.


I hope Hyatt and Kayvon are both off the table. I'd like to see Hyatt with a competent QB and Kayvon with Burns.
I knew it!  
leatherneck570 : 4/22/2024 6:58 pm : link
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/22/2024 6:58 pm : link
Well, if KT is the price for getting a potential franchise QB, I wouldn't be opposed to it. But I don't see that happening. How about we give them Jack Stroud to the Patriots version of BBI?
RE: RE: RE: 3 way draft day trades are tough in NFL  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 6:59 pm : link
In comment 16480254 Blue Dog said:
Quote:
In comment 16480168 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480162 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


I'm sure they have happened, but I can't recall the last time one has.



Technically this could be done as just trading up twice, not really a 3 way trade. I've mentioned this as a likely scenario for a while now, but everytime I was told 0 chance it doesn't happen period end of story.



Since the Patriots need the Cardinals involved it is still one trade up. So the Patriots would end up with Giants draft picks and the Cardinals would end up with Patriot draft picks. Patriots are going down then back up, they're the ones moving twice.


That's the 3 way trade route, I was suggesting the double trade up.

3 way trade could look like this:

NYG receives pick 3
NE receives pick 4 and Evan Neal/Slayton (really I think it would have to be Kayvon or Neal and Hyatt)
AZ receives pick 6, 70 and 2025 2nd from NYG
RE: If the Giants really believe in Maye  
Optimus-NY : 4/22/2024 7:04 pm : link
In comment 16480239 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
this makes sense, but just keep in mind that that will likely make this a 2 player draft.


It'll be worth it if they fins their franchise QB and the NYG get out of QB Hell---which is where thy are now.
Kayvon  
Toth029 : 4/22/2024 7:05 pm : link
And his potential is top caliber.

Hyatt is untapped and has a lot of room to improve. I don't know why Daboll would be willing to lose him so quickly.

Just gotta think, Thibs is a 1st value in return, Hyatt can be a 2nd and Neal is the big one who can be great but has struggled to live up to his draft status. I don't see Thibs being included if they're throwing other high picks in.
RE: Kayvon  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 7:07 pm : link
In comment 16480284 Toth029 said:
Quote:
And his potential is top caliber.

Hyatt is untapped and has a lot of room to improve. I don't know why Daboll would be willing to lose him so quickly.

Just gotta think, Thibs is a 1st value in return, Hyatt can be a 2nd and Neal is the big one who can be great but has struggled to live up to his draft status. I don't see Thibs being included if they're throwing other high picks in.


3 way trade could look like this:

NYG receives pick 3
NE receives pick 4 and Evan Neal/Slayton (really I think it would have to be Kayvon or Neal and Hyatt)
AZ receives pick 6, 70 and 2025 2nd from NYG
RE: RE: RE: What sucks  
crooza172 : 4/22/2024 7:09 pm : link
In comment 16480233 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480230 Mayo2JZ said:


Quote:


In comment 16480098 Jaenyg said:


Quote:


Is we couldn’t pull any of this shit in 2020 when we picked 4th.

Chargers and Dolphins got to just sit pat.



What sucks is that this kind of information is disseminated after a few drinks from some wahoo in the Giants organization. I don't want to know anything until they pick at 6. It just pisses me off that this information is getting out.



It's supposedly some wahoo brother of an executive lol, not the executive himself.


Agree but if it is true and this is already agreed to, who cares who knows. No one can do anything about. It’s a checkmate.
RE: RE: RE: RE: 3 way draft day trades are tough in NFL  
jvm52106 : 4/22/2024 7:09 pm : link
In comment 16480266 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480254 Blue Dog said:


Quote:


In comment 16480168 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480162 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


I'm sure they have happened, but I can't recall the last time one has.



Technically this could be done as just trading up twice, not really a 3 way trade. I've mentioned this as a likely scenario for a while now, but everytime I was told 0 chance it doesn't happen period end of story.



Since the Patriots need the Cardinals involved it is still one trade up. So the Patriots would end up with Giants draft picks and the Cardinals would end up with Patriot draft picks. Patriots are going down then back up, they're the ones moving twice.



That's the 3 way trade route, I was suggesting the double trade up.

3 way trade could look like this:

NYG receives pick 3
NE receives pick 4 and Evan Neal/Slayton (really I think it would have to be Kayvon or Neal and Hyatt)
AZ receives pick 6, 70 and 2025 2nd from NYG



By us keeping 47, we can actually move back off 47 to get a few extra picks (say bottom 2 or top 3 and a 4th rd pick).

Sweating bricks  
Snorkels : 4/22/2024 7:10 pm : link
If I am kind of high up in the Giants org and have a blood relative who went to a party in NJ on the weekend I'd be sweating bricks. My job could be very much at risk if anyone else can connect the docs. Fortunately for that guy though this sounds pretty much like BS. Not that such a trade might or might not happen but that someone in the Giants org passed on that level of detail about their inner workings just before the draft is pretty unlikely. But chatter away.
RE: ...  
Optimus-NY : 4/22/2024 7:13 pm : link
In comment 16480240 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
Watch Neal get traded & becomes an all Pro. It'd be so fitting.


All-Pro at what? Flippin cheese burgers?
RE: Sweating bricks  
jvm52106 : 4/22/2024 7:16 pm : link
In comment 16480293 Snorkels said:
Quote:
If I am kind of high up in the Giants org and have a blood relative who went to a party in NJ on the weekend I'd be sweating bricks. My job could be very much at risk if anyone else can connect the docs. Fortunately for that guy though this sounds pretty much like BS. Not that such a trade might or might not happen but that someone in the Giants org passed on that level of detail about their inner workings just before the draft is pretty unlikely. But chatter away.



Umm we don't say that..
Sorry, Sweating Rocks..
RE: Sweating bricks  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 7:17 pm : link
In comment 16480293 Snorkels said:
Quote:
If I am kind of high up in the Giants org and have a blood relative who went to a party in NJ on the weekend I'd be sweating bricks. My job could be very much at risk if anyone else can connect the docs. Fortunately for that guy though this sounds pretty much like BS. Not that such a trade might or might not happen but that someone in the Giants org passed on that level of detail about their inner workings just before the draft is pretty unlikely. But chatter away.


Pretty sure it's shitting bricks and sweating bullets. Also, I think the guy said upstate (meaning upstate NY). And if some wahoo brother gets wind of his brothers professional workings so be it, it was presented as a done deal so who cares anyways. No harm, no foul.

Also, this lines up with what dd in Mass said and Woodstock chimed in making it sound like this wasn't some made up story.
Again...why?  
George from PA : 4/22/2024 7:19 pm : link
If NE wants JJM....where are they going? They can't trade with the Vikings.

If Arizona wants one of the top 2 WRs....where are they going? They can go down any further than 8 and that would be risky.

If this is true....our GM is blinking....the Giants must draft smart...not scared.

Now it does sound like his mentor....no one will care if Maye hits and he will be fired if he doesn't hit.
seems overly  
blueblood : 4/22/2024 7:19 pm : link
comlicated to me.
Do we have multiple New England asshats  
The Dude : 4/22/2024 7:20 pm : link
that are aligned about JJM?
RE: Again...why?  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 7:21 pm : link
In comment 16480307 George from PA said:
Quote:
If NE wants JJM....where are they going? They can't trade with the Vikings.

If Arizona wants one of the top 2 WRs....where are they going? They can go down any further than 8 and that would be risky.

If this is true....our GM is blinking....the Giants must draft smart...not scared.

Now it does sound like his mentor....no one will care if Maye hits and he will be fired if he doesn't hit.


They have no way of knowing if Minnesota could jump to 5 then 4 or direct to 4 then AZ jumps back up for WR. If you believe in the qb, you don't want to leave anything up to chance.
Thanks for the info but it might be easier to just  
ThomasG : 4/22/2024 7:26 pm : link
actually develop Lock or DeVito.
RE: Again...why?  
Sean : 4/22/2024 7:32 pm : link
In comment 16480307 George from PA said:
Quote:
If NE wants JJM....where are they going? They can't trade with the Vikings.

If Arizona wants one of the top 2 WRs....where are they going? They can go down any further than 8 and that would be risky.

If this is true....our GM is blinking....the Giants must draft smart...not scared.

Now it does sound like his mentor....no one will care if Maye hits and he will be fired if he doesn't hit.

Easy for you to say. You seem to be content with Jones and building the team. I wouldn't risk losing Maye/McCarthy because LAC traded down with the Vikings.
RE: RE: I proposed this a while back  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 7:36 pm : link
In comment 16480174 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480164 UberAlias said:


Quote:


It makes too much sense. Several people said wouldn’t happen because 3 way trades don’t happen. But again, it makes perfect sense for the three teams. It’s a win win win.



I think we were the only ones saying this could be a likely scenario and everyone told us no chance lol. I wouldn't love this as it would be costly, but if they love Maye this much then you'd have to be enthusiastic about their conviction.
Yep. I remember that. It's always made sense if we believe this is who they all want.
RE: RE: Kayvon  
Stars_and_stripes : 4/22/2024 7:42 pm : link
In comment 16480286 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480284 Toth029 said:


Quote:


And his potential is top caliber.

Hyatt is untapped and has a lot of room to improve. I don't know why Daboll would be willing to lose him so quickly.

Just gotta think, Thibs is a 1st value in return, Hyatt can be a 2nd and Neal is the big one who can be great but has struggled to live up to his draft status. I don't see Thibs being included if they're throwing other high picks in.



3 way trade could look like this:

NYG receives pick 3
NE receives pick 4 and Evan Neal/Slayton (really I think it would have to be Kayvon or Neal and Hyatt)
AZ receives pick 6, 70 and 2025 2nd from NYG


Spent quite a bit of time scheming up plausible scenarios based on what he told me above:

One guess....
Cards trade 4 for 6 and a 2025 1st. They already are loaded for bear for this draft and a 1 sets them up nicely next year if they consider moving on from Kyler.

Pats trade us 3 for 4 , 70 , 2025 3rd and Neal

Or kinda vice versa

Cards trade 4 for 6, 70 and 2025 3rd

Pats trade 3 for 4 , for 2025 1st and Neal

*NYG tries to keep 47 for the WR drafted or via trade or for CB2

It certainly won't be cheap in draft capital but if they somehow finished this offseason with Edge1 , QB1 and WR1 or CB2, that would be a master class by Joe Schoen.
RE: If the Giants really believe in Maye  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 7:43 pm : link
In comment 16480239 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
this makes sense, but just keep in mind that that will likely make this a 2 player draft.


Of course. It's basically whatever cost it would have taken you to get to 3, except allocated to 2 teams instead of 1. Our #6 and 2nd rounder this year, and our 1 next year. Maybe some smaller picks as sweeteners, something like that.

The other thing is that virtually everyone agrees Maye needs to sit. So there is is a ton of downside. But if the vision is that Daboll sees the next Herbert in Maye after getting his hands on him, you do that in a second.

Josh Allen wasn't wholly Josh Allen until year 3, if you remember. But they are legitimate contenders every year at this point. That's what this is about.
RE: Yes, Jones could be part  
Blue21 : 4/22/2024 7:50 pm : link
In comment 16480195 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
Of that deal especially if we are paying a good portion of his money but, Pats have cap space.. Jones backing up Brisset for one year let's Pats fill multiple holes..

I suspect Evan Neal and maybe even Waller (to AZ) could be part of a deal..
Didnt someone on BBI mention Waller playing the retirement game to force a trade to a West coast team.? Don't want to mention who it was because I could be wrong. But Waller to Cards? Would also explain why Giants aren't acting like they are in a rush for an answer from him.
RE: RE: RE: Kayvon  
section125 : 4/22/2024 7:54 pm : link
In comment 16480338 Stars_and_stripes said:
Quote:
In comment 16480286 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480284 Toth029 said:


Quote:


And his potential is top caliber.

Hyatt is untapped and has a lot of room to improve. I don't know why Daboll would be willing to lose him so quickly.

Just gotta think, Thibs is a 1st value in return, Hyatt can be a 2nd and Neal is the big one who can be great but has struggled to live up to his draft status. I don't see Thibs being included if they're throwing other high picks in.



3 way trade could look like this:

NYG receives pick 3
NE receives pick 4 and Evan Neal/Slayton (really I think it would have to be Kayvon or Neal and Hyatt)
AZ receives pick 6, 70 and 2025 2nd from NYG



Spent quite a bit of time scheming up plausible scenarios based on what he told me above:

One guess....
Cards trade 4 for 6 and a 2025 1st. They already are loaded for bear for this draft and a 1 sets them up nicely next year if they consider moving on from Kyler.

Pats trade us 3 for 4 , 70 , 2025 3rd and Neal

Or kinda vice versa

Cards trade 4 for 6, 70 and 2025 3rd

Pats trade 3 for 4 , for 2025 1st and Neal

*NYG tries to keep 47 for the WR drafted or via trade or for CB2

It certainly won't be cheap in draft capital but if they somehow finished this offseason with Edge1 , QB1 and WR1 or CB2, that would be a master class by Joe Schoen.


We are not trading from 6 to 4 with a 2025 #1 - it is basically our #3 this year. And Schoen said the are not trading 2025 #1.
Probably our #3 and maybe 2025 #3 or #2.
RE: RE: Yes, Jones could be part  
BH28 : 4/22/2024 7:56 pm : link
In comment 16480359 Blue21 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480195 jvm52106 said:


Quote:


Of that deal especially if we are paying a good portion of his money but, Pats have cap space.. Jones backing up Brisset for one year let's Pats fill multiple holes..

I suspect Evan Neal and maybe even Waller (to AZ) could be part of a deal..

Didnt someone on BBI mention Waller playing the retirement game to force a trade to a West coast team.? Don't want to mention who it was because I could be wrong. But Waller to Cards? Would also explain why Giants aren't acting like they are in a rush for an answer from him.


They have Trey McBride. They are set at TE
I can see this scenario  
AROCK1000 : 4/22/2024 7:57 pm : link
As one that's been discussed between the trams...but it will never happen
RE: RE: Again...why?  
Stars_and_stripes : 4/22/2024 8:01 pm : link
In comment 16480314 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480307 George from PA said:


Quote:


If NE wants JJM....where are they going? They can't trade with the Vikings.

If Arizona wants one of the top 2 WRs....where are they going? They can go down any further than 8 and that would be risky.

If this is true....our GM is blinking....the Giants must draft smart...not scared.

Now it does sound like his mentor....no one will care if Maye hits and he will be fired if he doesn't hit.



They have no way of knowing if Minnesota could jump to 5 then 4 or direct to 4 then AZ jumps back up for WR. If you believe in the qb, you don't want to leave anything up to chance.


Minny certainly seems to be the main reason the price is higher. NYG needs to box Minny out of the equation. This path may have been the only way for checkmate. Seems like they are all in and willing to pay big for Maye.
KT  
bc4life : 4/22/2024 8:05 pm : link
not getting traded. The whole point of getting Burns was to have a weapon on either edge.
RE: RE: RE: Kayvon  
Blue Dog : 4/22/2024 8:07 pm : link
In comment 16480338 Stars_and_stripes said:
Quote:
In comment 16480286 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480284 Toth029 said:


Quote:


And his potential is top caliber.

Hyatt is untapped and has a lot of room to improve. I don't know why Daboll would be willing to lose him so quickly.

Just gotta think, Thibs is a 1st value in return, Hyatt can be a 2nd and Neal is the big one who can be great but has struggled to live up to his draft status. I don't see Thibs being included if they're throwing other high picks in.



3 way trade could look like this:

NYG receives pick 3
NE receives pick 4 and Evan Neal/Slayton (really I think it would have to be Kayvon or Neal and Hyatt)
AZ receives pick 6, 70 and 2025 2nd from NYG



Spent quite a bit of time scheming up plausible scenarios based on what he told me above:

One guess....
Cards trade 4 for 6 and a 2025 1st. They already are loaded for bear for this draft and a 1 sets them up nicely next year if they consider moving on from Kyler.

Pats trade us 3 for 4 , 70 , 2025 3rd and Neal

Or kinda vice versa

Cards trade 4 for 6, 70 and 2025 3rd

Pats trade 3 for 4 , for 2025 1st and Neal

*NYG tries to keep 47 for the WR drafted or via trade or for CB2

It certainly won't be cheap in draft capital but if they somehow finished this offseason with Edge1 , QB1 and WR1 or CB2, that would be a master class by Joe Schoen.


Giants do have some leverage here being at #6 and a double trade up kills them - it is all about the Patriots and Cards getting free picks and best outcome for all three. The Patriots don't want to trade with the Vikings, that means no QB, they would more likely just stay put and then they get no extra picks at all.

By trading directly with the Giants they get free picks and their QB. Same goes for the Cards, they get free Patriots picks by doing it this way. So it all hinges on the Patriots being willing to take lesser value than what they get from the Vikings but still getting their QB, not fleecing the Giants because the Giants could stay there and then it means someone would miss out on their pick trading with the Vikings for more capital or neither gets anything.

The Giants basically just have to give the Patriots more than what they have to give the Cardinals who want enough to justify possibly settling for their second choice.
I threw in about Waller  
jvm52106 : 4/22/2024 8:10 pm : link
As too much with him.seems weird.. It seems really sketchy and more like he wants out.
RE: RE: ...  
Optimus-NY : 4/22/2024 8:10 pm : link
In comment 16480255 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480251 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:


Quote:


KT? I don't see that. Even EA wouldn't include Osi in the Eli trade & Thibs has shown much more than Osi had @ that juncture.



I wouldn't love it, but if they want Maye and maybe Aiyuk for Maye plus their 2025 1st. Then they gotta do what they gotta do.


Can't give up KT. Red line.
RE: RE: RE: Again...why?  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 8:15 pm : link
In comment 16480375 Stars_and_stripes said:
Quote:
In comment 16480314 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480307 George from PA said:


Quote:


If NE wants JJM....where are they going? They can't trade with the Vikings.

If Arizona wants one of the top 2 WRs....where are they going? They can go down any further than 8 and that would be risky.

If this is true....our GM is blinking....the Giants must draft smart...not scared.

Now it does sound like his mentor....no one will care if Maye hits and he will be fired if he doesn't hit.



They have no way of knowing if Minnesota could jump to 5 then 4 or direct to 4 then AZ jumps back up for WR. If you believe in the qb, you don't want to leave anything up to chance.



Minny certainly seems to be the main reason the price is higher. NYG needs to box Minny out of the equation. This path may have been the only way for checkmate. Seems like they are all in and willing to pay big for Maye.


They're all in to pay big for Maye, until they aren't. There is a plan B for MN but they aren't going to turn their heads until they've exhausted all avenues to get their guy. IMO, the price to secure one of the original top 3 QBs was always going to be huge. JJM opens some doors that may not have existed early in the process, but at a price. These men aren't fools. They understand that teams don't look at it as some fans do --hey, there are 6 round 1 QBs, let's settle for one of them. That's not how teams are going to look at this. Their evaluations draw some very significant distinctions.
RE: RE: RE: ...  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 8:23 pm : link
In comment 16480397 Optimus-NY said:
Quote:
In comment 16480255 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480251 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:


Quote:


KT? I don't see that. Even EA wouldn't include Osi in the Eli trade & Thibs has shown much more than Osi had @ that juncture.



I wouldn't love it, but if they want Maye and maybe Aiyuk for Maye plus their 2025 1st. Then they gotta do what they gotta do.



Can't give up KT. Red line.


Exactly. Teams don't stray off their vision unless zero choice. The defense kept us in so many games last year. They invested heavily in Burns in FA to further compliment the assets and build a foundation on that side of the ball --consistent with how this regime views things in terms of positional value. That's why they didn't man up and pay McKinney. This isn't DG running things here. There is a plan and it's not very difficult to follow. KT is a non-starter. He facots heavily into the vision.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: 3 way draft day trades are tough in NFL  
Stars_and_stripes : 4/22/2024 8:24 pm : link
In comment 16480291 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480266 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480254 Blue Dog said:


Quote:


In comment 16480168 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480162 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


I'm sure they have happened, but I can't recall the last time one has.



Technically this could be done as just trading up twice, not really a 3 way trade. I've mentioned this as a likely scenario for a while now, but everytime I was told 0 chance it doesn't happen period end of story.



Since the Patriots need the Cardinals involved it is still one trade up. So the Patriots would end up with Giants draft picks and the Cardinals would end up with Patriot draft picks. Patriots are going down then back up, they're the ones moving twice.



That's the 3 way trade route, I was suggesting the double trade up.

3 way trade could look like this:

NYG receives pick 3
NE receives pick 4 and Evan Neal/Slayton (really I think it would have to be Kayvon or Neal and Hyatt)
AZ receives pick 6, 70 and 2025 2nd from NYG




By us keeping 47, we can actually move back off 47 to get a few extra picks (say bottom 2 or top 3 and a 4th rd pick).


He didnt hint at any players involved but the players that stick out maybe

Waller is leveraging retirement and wants trade to West Coast team

Neal change of scenery and maybe Pats still think he has high end potential as OT or OG. Schoen signed 5 OL this offseason.

Hyatt posted some cryptic tweets a while back and had a 100 yard game vs Pats last year. We know they are after WRs as they tried to sign Ridley.

Slayton is holding out

DJ is 33 mil on cap with 14 mil salary cap savings if traded

Doubt they trade KT

Just my two cents
RE: RE: RE: Again...why?  
Optimus-NY : 4/22/2024 8:24 pm : link
In comment 16480375 Stars_and_stripes said:
Quote:
In comment 16480314 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480307 George from PA said:


Quote:


If NE wants JJM....where are they going? They can't trade with the Vikings.

If Arizona wants one of the top 2 WRs....where are they going? They can go down any further than 8 and that would be risky.

If this is true....our GM is blinking....the Giants must draft smart...not scared.

Now it does sound like his mentor....no one will care if Maye hits and he will be fired if he doesn't hit.



They have no way of knowing if Minnesota could jump to 5 then 4 or direct to 4 then AZ jumps back up for WR. If you believe in the qb, you don't want to leave anything up to chance.



Minny certainly seems to be the main reason the price is higher. NYG needs to box Minny out of the equation. This path may have been the only way for checkmate. Seems like they are all in and willing to pay big for Maye.


+1 Makes sense.
FYI  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 8:24 pm : link
Schmeelk had a guy on his show today who had Maye ranked above Caleb Williams.
RE: RE: RE: Kayvon  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 8:25 pm : link
In comment 16480338 Stars_and_stripes said:
Quote:
In comment 16480286 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480284 Toth029 said:


Quote:


And his potential is top caliber.

Hyatt is untapped and has a lot of room to improve. I don't know why Daboll would be willing to lose him so quickly.

Just gotta think, Thibs is a 1st value in return, Hyatt can be a 2nd and Neal is the big one who can be great but has struggled to live up to his draft status. I don't see Thibs being included if they're throwing other high picks in.



3 way trade could look like this:

NYG receives pick 3
NE receives pick 4 and Evan Neal/Slayton (really I think it would have to be Kayvon or Neal and Hyatt)
AZ receives pick 6, 70 and 2025 2nd from NYG



Spent quite a bit of time scheming up plausible scenarios based on what he told me above:

One guess....
Cards trade 4 for 6 and a 2025 1st. They already are loaded for bear for this draft and a 1 sets them up nicely next year if they consider moving on from Kyler.

Pats trade us 3 for 4 , 70 , 2025 3rd and Neal

Or kinda vice versa

Cards trade 4 for 6, 70 and 2025 3rd

Pats trade 3 for 4 , for 2025 1st and Neal

*NYG tries to keep 47 for the WR drafted or via trade or for CB2

It certainly won't be cheap in draft capital but if they somehow finished this offseason with Edge1 , QB1 and WR1 or CB2, that would be a master class by Joe Schoen.


So we would basically be trading #6, #70, our #1 and #3 next year, and Neal for Maye, a guy who had a subpar last season, and who everyone agrees needs to "sit a year."
RE: FYI  
GFAN52 : 4/22/2024 8:29 pm : link
In comment 16480428 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Schmeelk had a guy on his show today who had Maye ranked above Caleb Williams.


I still have to wonder why the Patriots would pass on Maye by just staying at #3. I just don't see the risk in missing out on him for just a few more assets.
We're guessing some players  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 8:29 pm : link
Who have more value to us than to other teams. I doubt the team has given up on Neal, for example, but his trade value can't be very high. That's not a direction I see NYG going in here.
The  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 8:30 pm : link
"genius" GMs, scouts, coaches, and FO people are wrong far more often than they are right about QBs. And Schoen is the "smartest" guy in that club given his role in signing Jones to that ridiculous contract. Hard pass on all of this.
RE: RE: FYI  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 8:31 pm : link
In comment 16480442 GFAN52 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480428 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


Schmeelk had a guy on his show today who had Maye ranked above Caleb Williams.



I still have to wonder why the Patriots would pass on Maye by just staying at #3. I just don't see the risk in missing out on him for just a few more assets.


The only reason the Patriots would pass on Maye is if they don't think as highly about him as the Giants. It's that simple.

Happens all of the time in the NFL.
Not sure if the Giants  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 8:35 pm : link
would have to give up next year's #1. If Pats don't want to fall below 4 and the Cards don't want to fall below 6, they don't have a lot of leverage to drive up the price.

Really, if this trade were true, this is pretty creative on the part of the Giants.
RE: I seriously  
Rjanyg : 4/22/2024 8:36 pm : link
In comment 16480253 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
doubt Thibodeaux is on the table.


This. I can see Neal though.
Something about this story doesn't make sense  
George from PA : 4/22/2024 8:37 pm : link
1st.Sean and whoever's else...If the Giants want Maye...I want Maye. I justify the picks....will hope it turns out great.

I was joking about the Jones draft year.....as I wanted Josh Allen and Dex and Drew Lock in 2nd....and now have a "Josh Allen like" in Burns with DeX and Lock.

I also fine.....giving up what is needed to give up.

But not fine giving up picks if not needed....

Why include NE? If they want JJM....

Trade with Arizona...not both...if they are concern about the Chargers
RE: Something about this story doesn't make sense  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 8:38 pm : link
In comment 16480465 George from PA said:
Quote:
1st.Sean and whoever's else...If the Giants want Maye...I want Maye. I justify the picks....will hope it turns out great.

I was joking about the Jones draft year.....as I wanted Josh Allen and Dex and Drew Lock in 2nd....and now have a "Josh Allen like" in Burns with DeX and Lock.

I also fine.....giving up what is needed to give up.

But not fine giving up picks if not needed....

Why include NE? If they want JJM....

Trade with Arizona...not both...if they are concern about the Chargers


Because they are trying to box out the Vikings. The Vikings otherwise could screw the Giants.
RE: Not sure if the Giants  
bigbluewillrise : 4/22/2024 8:39 pm : link
In comment 16480457 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
would have to give up next year's #1. If Pats don't want to fall below 4 and the Cards don't want to fall below 6, they don't have a lot of leverage to drive up the price.

Really, if this trade were true, this is pretty creative on the part of the Giants.


dare the pats to go down to 11 and miss out on JJM and all teh WRs....


dont give up a first or neal/thibs.
they can have slayton.
as many 2nd/3rds they want.
RE: Not sure if the Giants  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 8:41 pm : link
In comment 16480457 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
would have to give up next year's #1. If Pats don't want to fall below 4 and the Cards don't want to fall below 6, they don't have a lot of leverage to drive up the price.

Really, if this trade were true, this is pretty creative on the part of the Giants.


I feel the same.
RE: Something about this story doesn't make sense  
Sean : 4/22/2024 8:43 pm : link
In comment 16480465 George from PA said:
Quote:
1st.Sean and whoever's else...If the Giants want Maye...I want Maye. I justify the picks....will hope it turns out great.

I was joking about the Jones draft year.....as I wanted Josh Allen and Dex and Drew Lock in 2nd....and now have a "Josh Allen like" in Burns with DeX and Lock.

I also fine.....giving up what is needed to give up.
In your scenario, the Vikings could trade up with NE and then NE trades back up with Arizona. Now NYG is boxed out. Schoen won't risk that scenario imo.

But not fine giving up picks if not needed....

Why include NE? If they want JJM....

Trade with Arizona...not both...if they are concern about the Chargers
If true  
Snorkels : 4/22/2024 8:43 pm : link
and as I said my BS barometer was going crazy when I read this the first time, kind of blows a hole in the old Joe Schoen's got the Giants war room locked down tighter than a drum. Sounds like its leaking more than the Titanic.
the potential  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 8:43 pm : link
fly in the ointment is the Cards not wanting to lose Harrison to the Chargers (or them telling the Giants that is the problem).
RE: RE: RE: RE: Again...why?  
Stars_and_stripes : 4/22/2024 8:46 pm : link
In comment 16480405 UberAlias said:
Quote:
In comment 16480375 Stars_and_stripes said:


Quote:


In comment 16480314 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480307 George from PA said:


Quote:


If NE wants JJM....where are they going? They can't trade with the Vikings.

If Arizona wants one of the top 2 WRs....where are they going? They can go down any further than 8 and that would be risky.

If this is true....our GM is blinking....the Giants must draft smart...not scared.

Now it does sound like his mentor....no one will care if Maye hits and he will be fired if he doesn't hit.



They have no way of knowing if Minnesota could jump to 5 then 4 or direct to 4 then AZ jumps back up for WR. If you believe in the qb, you don't want to leave anything up to chance.



Minny certainly seems to be the main reason the price is higher. NYG needs to box Minny out of the equation. This path may have been the only way for checkmate. Seems like they are all in and willing to pay big for Maye.



They're all in to pay big for Maye, until they aren't. There is a plan B for MN but they aren't going to turn their heads until they've exhausted all avenues to get their guy. IMO, the price to secure one of the original top 3 QBs was always going to be huge. JJM opens some doors that may not have existed early in the process, but at a price. These men aren't fools. They understand that teams don't look at it as some fans do --hey, there are 6 round 1 QBs, let's settle for one of them. That's not how teams are going to look at this. Their evaluations draw some very significant distinctions.


He mentioned there were a couple permutations. Even though he didn't directly mention a Pats trade down then trade back up to 4. I figure though that must have been discussed and could be possible. However it sure seemed like the deal isn't happening without Pats knowing they get McCarthy one way or another.
RE: RE: FYI  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 8:47 pm : link
In comment 16480442 GFAN52 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480428 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


Schmeelk had a guy on his show today who had Maye ranked above Caleb Williams.



I still have to wonder why the Patriots would pass on Maye by just staying at #3. I just don't see the risk in missing out on him for just a few more assets.


My read is that Kraft demands a QB while the FO recognizes their roster is a disaster, and prioritizes adding picks. If they don't love Maye, and they wouldn't be the only team to feel that way, they have a great opportunity to land their QB and acquire picks, giving everyone what they want.

Neither Az nor Chargers are looking to trade up, and both are open to trading back. Best bet for NE to acquire picks AND get their QB is to deal with NYG, but the risk is someone else trading up to 4 or 5. So NE has a few choices 1) take your QB at 3, which is a big FU to the FO, 2) trade back to 6 or further, which risks pissing off the owner if they miss out on their QB, or 3) something like what's being proposed here or similar trade back and trade up deal that lands them picks and guaratees them their QB.

The only option that satisfies all NE's considerations in #3. They are fully motivated to consider a deal such as this, or a trade back and then trade back up with Az. But...

If they trade back and then up again with Az -- the question becomes --why would Az take that deal over this one? Anything else might take them out of contention for one of the top 3 WRs.
Funny  
Rjanyg : 4/22/2024 8:48 pm : link
I was thinking NYG could possibly get Maye if he fell to 4. This 3 way trade is pretty interesting. Kudos to those that thought this might happen.

You would wonder if Schoen would give up next years 1?

I hope the package is no more than:

6, 70, Slayton and 2025 2nd round picks. Worst case sub 47 and keep 70.

Maybe get a 5th in return?
The Viking can only screw the Giants with the Chargers  
George from PA : 4/22/2024 8:50 pm : link
NE is just going along for the ride the Giants created.....and could have solved by just trading with Arizona. Viking are too far for either NE or Arizona.

I sure hope the Giants are giving up a reasonable ransom.

Someone mentioned it on this Thread....Miami and the Chargers didn't blink....and got their QBs.

They can't trade Daniel Jones....if Neal is rebelling about not playing tackle...could be addition by subtraction.
the way  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 8:51 pm : link
I look at this is this...

Giants get their QB.
Pats get extra pick they wouldn't have gotten.
Cards get extra pick, but could lose out on Harrison (they have most to lose... that's why I'm not sure this happens... it would make sense for them if they have two WRs equal on their board).
RE: The Viking can only screw the Giants with the Chargers  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 8:52 pm : link
In comment 16480495 George from PA said:
Quote:
NE is just going along for the ride the Giants created.....and could have solved by just trading with Arizona. Viking are too far for either NE or Arizona.

I sure hope the Giants are giving up a reasonable ransom.

Someone mentioned it on this Thread....Miami and the Chargers didn't blink....and got their QBs.

They can't trade Daniel Jones....if Neal is rebelling about not playing tackle...could be addition by subtraction.


No George, you're not following this.

The Giants would have the 3rd pick.
RE: the potential  
GFAN52 : 4/22/2024 8:56 pm : link
In comment 16480481 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
fly in the ointment is the Cards not wanting to lose Harrison to the Chargers (or them telling the Giants that is the problem).


That definitely could be the part that makes this whole scenario fall part. AZ is loaded with picks already, and if MHjr is a tier above Nabers/Odunze as some draft analysts have reported, then they could view this as not work the extra draft capital.
RE: If true  
PatersonPlank : 4/22/2024 8:57 pm : link
In comment 16480480 Snorkels said:
Quote:
and as I said my BS barometer was going crazy when I read this the first time, kind of blows a hole in the old Joe Schoen's got the Giants war room locked down tighter than a drum. Sounds like its leaking more than the Titanic.


Actually the OP heard it from NE folks, so thats where the leak is not the NYG
GFAN  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 8:57 pm : link
a team could also trade up with the Chargers to take Harrison (like the Jets).
again  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 8:59 pm : link
if this is true, even if it falls apart, kudos for being creative. This is really a good effort.
Under the parameters of what many believe everyone wants  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 8:59 pm : link
This arrangement is what makes the most sense.

--NYG - Drake Maye
--Kraft - A QB (Presumably JJM)
--NE FO - Extra picks to help build their pathetic roster
--Az - A stud WR (Guaranteed top 2 on their board, including a chance at their #1, MHJ) plus additional picks.
RE: RE: the potential  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 9:00 pm : link
In comment 16480502 GFAN52 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480481 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


fly in the ointment is the Cards not wanting to lose Harrison to the Chargers (or them telling the Giants that is the problem).



That definitely could be the part that makes this whole scenario fall part. AZ is loaded with picks already, and if MHjr is a tier above Nabers/Odunze as some draft analysts have reported, then they could view this as not work the extra draft capital.


Agreed.
RE: Under the parameters of what many believe everyone wants  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:02 pm : link
In comment 16480507 UberAlias said:
Quote:
This arrangement is what makes the most sense.

--NYG - Drake Maye
--Kraft - A QB (Presumably JJM)
--NE FO - Extra picks to help build their pathetic roster
--Az - A stud WR (Guaranteed top 2 on their board, including a chance at their #1, MHJ) plus additional picks.


And in this scenario, I do not want the Giants giving up their #1... because with Maye and few picks, this team isn't getting much better in 2024. That #1 pick in 2025 might be pretty high.

However, if Maye is what he can become, it's worth it. In a normal draft, he could go #1.
I find this a believable scenario  
DonnieD89 : 4/22/2024 9:05 pm : link
I know that the “fly in the ointment“ how much Arizona coats Marvin Harrison, Jr. If they do have Harrison and Nabers closely ranked, I can see the deal happening. I can also see the deal happening if they have Harrison ranked a little higher, but with the additional Arizona would be receiving, I think it would make up for that. Again, I think this is a real and viable scenario.
Eric...I understand the trade  
George from PA : 4/22/2024 9:10 pm : link
Just not sure why....if they truly know they want JJM.

As NE can't trade with the Viking.....

as they would need to get back down to 4 or 5....as the Giants are willing to trade back with Denver....who wants JJM.

Arizona won't trade back too far as they want top WRs.

So only the Chargers are the only one who can screw them.....

A deal with Arizona would be good enough....if they include NE keeps everyone happy.....and close any loop fine.


Just do not overpay.....as NE is risking nothing and Arizona very little
Eric  
Sean : 4/22/2024 9:12 pm : link
The thing is, that high 2025 draft pick is a lock to towards a QB if not addressed this year. Ultimately, you're evaluating Maye against next years QB prospects.
Basically Pats open for Business. Kraft wants a QB.  
Blue21 : 4/22/2024 9:12 pm : link
Wolfe wants picks. Because cards are involved Pats get Krafts QB. Giants get their QB. Cards get their WR . No one else can deliver this.
Oh and Wolfe gets his picks as do Cards  
Blue21 : 4/22/2024 9:13 pm : link
.
RE: Eric...I understand the trade  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:13 pm : link
In comment 16480523 George from PA said:
Quote:
Just not sure why....if they truly know they want JJM.

As NE can't trade with the Viking.....

as they would need to get back down to 4 or 5....as the Giants are willing to trade back with Denver....who wants JJM.

Arizona won't trade back too far as they want top WRs.

So only the Chargers are the only one who can screw them.....

A deal with Arizona would be good enough....if they include NE keeps everyone happy.....and close any loop fine.


Just do not overpay.....as NE is risking nothing and Arizona very little


The Vikings can steal Maye from the Giants very easily if the Pats take McCarthy.
RE: RE: Under the parameters of what many believe everyone wants  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 9:14 pm : link
In comment 16480510 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 16480507 UberAlias said:


Quote:


This arrangement is what makes the most sense.

--NYG - Drake Maye
--Kraft - A QB (Presumably JJM)
--NE FO - Extra picks to help build their pathetic roster
--Az - A stud WR (Guaranteed top 2 on their board, including a chance at their #1, MHJ) plus additional picks.



And in this scenario, I do not want the Giants giving up their #1... because with Maye and few picks, this team isn't getting much better in 2024. That #1 pick in 2025 might be pretty high.

However, if Maye is what he can become, it's worth it. In a normal draft, he could go #1.


I totally agree. Though the logic makes sense, the details are in the compensation.

Though it's nice to see a more favorable response than I received when I proposed this 2-3 weeks ago and the majority of posters said couldn't happen because 3-way deals don't happen in the NFL. Who knows is this is legit, but I don't buy that response. We know NYG has had talks with NE about trading up. That's hard to refute at this point. We know Ryan Cowden and Monti Ossenfort have a past relationship. Is it that hard to believe Schoen could suggested they get on the phone and at least talk it over if this were the path to get the QB they covet?
RE: Eric  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:15 pm : link
In comment 16480528 Sean said:
Quote:
The thing is, that high 2025 draft pick is a lock to towards a QB if not addressed this year. Ultimately, you're evaluating Maye against next years QB prospects.


Sure, but Maye needs a team around him. I'm just not sure the Giants have to give up their 2025 #1 to make this work.
RE: RE: Eric  
Blue21 : 4/22/2024 9:17 pm : link
In comment 16480536 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 16480528 Sean said:


Quote:


The thing is, that high 2025 draft pick is a lock to towards a QB if not addressed this year. Ultimately, you're evaluating Maye against next years QB prospects.



Sure, but Maye needs a team around him. I'm just not sure the Giants have to give up their 2025 #1 to make this work.
Eric you may be right which is why a surprise player may be involved
I think the Giants would have to part with a 2025 first  
Sean : 4/22/2024 9:19 pm : link
I'm not sure how much incentive NE/ARI have to do this if not for that included.
Compensation is a whole different matter  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 9:20 pm : link
And a significant one. But when it comes to negotiations, you often find that when all parties are sufficiently motivated to get a deal done, they often do. The bigger challenge is when you have to talk someone off of their intention (like talking NE out of taking a QB altogether)
RE: I think the Giants would have to part with a 2025 first  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:21 pm : link
In comment 16480542 Sean said:
Quote:
I'm not sure how much incentive NE/ARI have to do this if not for that included.


NE gets a pick they otherwise would not have gotten if they take JMS at #3.

The problem is the Cardinals. But do you need to give them a #1 pick to have them accept Nabers instead?
If Kraft  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:22 pm : link
wants JMS, the only way he is sure to get him is at #3 or #4.
I'm not a draft day expert, but I oppose trading up  
Marty in Albany : 4/22/2024 9:23 pm : link
for a QB. My reasons:

When you have top notch WRs, OLs, etc., who have say, an 85-90% chance of being a force from Day One waiting for us at pick 6, I have real problems with giving up a starting player as well as draft choices for a QB who has say, only a 50% chance of being a great QB and a 50% chance of laying waste to the team's future, because of what it cost us to get him.

I also don't understand what benefit a team can get from telling the TRUTH about what it wants to do in the draft. Therefore, I believe that we only get false
information from the team, and even if were true, it is subject to change without notice.

If a team leaks its plans because of negligence or stupidity, what hope is there that a team with stupid or negligent leadership will do well.
How are the Viking taking maye......  
George from PA : 4/22/2024 9:24 pm : link
If the Giants are sitting at 4....traded with Arizona

The only team not showing cards are the Chargers....

And NE drafted JJM.

What am saying is

The 3 way trade shouldn't cost the Giants a fortune.

As Arizona is only one risking anything....and minor at that.
RE: If Kraft  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 9:24 pm : link
In comment 16480547 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
wants JMS, the only way he is sure to get him is at #3 or #4.


Exactly. And if the FO wants extra draft picks, the only way they can get that without pissing Kraft off is dealing to 4. But Az isn't isn't looking to trade up, and they don't want to move too far back and risk missing out on one of the big 3 wideouts, so...

RE: RE: If Kraft  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:25 pm : link
In comment 16480552 UberAlias said:
Quote:
In comment 16480547 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


wants JMS, the only way he is sure to get him is at #3 or #4.



Exactly. And if the FO wants extra draft picks, the only way they can get that without pissing Kraft off is dealing to 4. But Az isn't isn't looking to trade up, and they don't want to move too far back and risk missing out on one of the big 3 wideouts, so...


It really is a creative proposal. And it screws the Vikings.
But again, will the Cardinals bite? And this assumes Kraft really wants McCarthy.
If NE truly likes JJM  
Sean : 4/22/2024 9:26 pm : link
That's a big plus for NYG. Even if NE just sits at 3 and takes JJM, NYG could entice ARI to drop down to 6 and get more draft ammo. NYG then selects Maye at 4.

The problem is the Chargers. This is why they can't just wait until 6.
too may bourbons, but to clarify...  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 9:26 pm : link
If the FO (NE's) wants extra draft picks, the only way they can achieve that without pissing Kraft off is dealing to 4. But Az isn't isn't looking to trade up, and assuming they (Az) don't want to move too far back and risk missing out on one of the big 3 wideouts...
If the Giants part with a 2025 1st.....they are morons  
George from PA : 4/22/2024 9:26 pm : link
And deserve what they get
RE: If NE truly likes JJM  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:29 pm : link
In comment 16480557 Sean said:
Quote:
That's a big plus for NYG. Even if NE just sits at 3 and takes JJM, NYG could entice ARI to drop down to 6 and get more draft ammo. NYG then selects Maye at 4.

The problem is the Chargers. This is why they can't just wait until 6.


This is a good point. The whole thing depends on the Pats and McCarthy. But even if they take him at #3, the Giants could steal try to work out a deal with the Cardinals.
RE: How are the Viking taking maye......  
GFAN52 : 4/22/2024 9:29 pm : link
In comment 16480551 George from PA said:
Quote:
If the Giants are sitting at 4....traded with Arizona

The only team not showing cards are the Chargers....

And NE drafted JJM.

What am saying is

The 3 way trade shouldn't cost the Giants a fortune.

As Arizona is only one risking anything....and minor at that.


Depends on Arizona's view of MHjr compared to Nabers/Odunze. We may view it as minor, but to them????
RE: How are the Viking taking maye......  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 9:29 pm : link
In comment 16480551 George from PA said:
Quote:
If the Giants are sitting at 4....traded with Arizona

The only team not showing cards are the Chargers....

And NE drafted JJM.

What am saying is

The 3 way trade shouldn't cost the Giants a fortune.

As Arizona is only one risking anything....and minor at that.


Yes. I think Schoen is getting creative in trying to keep 47 and 2025 1st while still getting the qb they like.
RE: If the Giants part with a 2025 1st.....they are morons  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 9:32 pm : link
In comment 16480560 George from PA said:
Quote:
And deserve what they get


I've been toeing both sides of this line. But to this remark specifically I will say --dealing a future #1 for a QB you anticipate will be your franchise QB happens all the time. We may not want it, but it's far from out of bounds when you are talking about dealing into the top 3 picks in the draft.
George  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:33 pm : link
is that what you were getting at... just deal directly with the Cardinals? If so, then yes, that's a good question. Unless there is a real debate going on in New England still about which QB... is that possible? That would seem odd.
Cards are loaded with picks  
Rjanyg : 4/22/2024 9:34 pm : link
There would have to be at least a 2025 day 2 pick, most likely a 2nd.

If NE can somehow get their guy and an extra pick ( 70? ) just to move back one spot? No brainer.

Key is AZ. Would have to love MHJ and Nabers the same.
RE: George  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 9:36 pm : link
In comment 16480571 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
is that what you were getting at... just deal directly with the Cardinals? If so, then yes, that's a good question. Unless there is a real debate going on in New England still about which QB... is that possible? That would seem odd.


Then there's no telling the Pats don't work something out with the Vikings similar to this. This would be the way to truly box out Minnesota.
the real question  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:37 pm : link
is are the Patriots really considering the Vikings deal (two #1s this year, 2025 #1)? If so, this deal makes sense from the Giants perspective.

if the Patriots are not considering that, then the Giants could just watch them take McCarthy and then deal just directly with the Cardinals.

If you are in Schoen's shoes, do you call their bluff or risk losing Maye?
RE: Cards are loaded with picks  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 9:37 pm : link
In comment 16480577 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
There would have to be at least a 2025 day 2 pick, most likely a 2nd.

If NE can somehow get their guy and an extra pick ( 70? ) just to move back one spot? No brainer.

Key is AZ. Would have to love MHJ and Nabers the same.


Or at least in the same tier.
Very doubtful NE has told anyone who they would pick  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 9:38 pm : link
Schoen explained it in his last press conference. Teams divulge as little as they have to.
RE: RE: George  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:38 pm : link
In comment 16480581 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480571 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


is that what you were getting at... just deal directly with the Cardinals? If so, then yes, that's a good question. Unless there is a real debate going on in New England still about which QB... is that possible? That would seem odd.



Then there's no telling the Pats don't work something out with the Vikings similar to this. This would be the way to truly box out Minnesota.


Yes, but they could lose McCarthy (including to the Giants).
RE: Cards are loaded with picks  
GFAN52 : 4/22/2024 9:38 pm : link
In comment 16480577 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
There would have to be at least a 2025 day 2 pick, most likely a 2nd.

If NE can somehow get their guy and an extra pick ( 70? ) just to move back one spot? No brainer.

Key is AZ. Would have to love MHJ and Nabers the same.


I'm not sure they do.
RE: the real question  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 9:40 pm : link
In comment 16480582 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
is are the Patriots really considering the Vikings deal (two #1s this year, 2025 #1)? If so, this deal makes sense from the Giants perspective.

if the Patriots are not considering that, then the Giants could just watch them take McCarthy and then deal just directly with the Cardinals.

If you are in Schoen's shoes, do you call their bluff or risk losing Maye?


It's not just calling their bluff though, because the Vikings could offer the same godfather package to AZ and AZ could trade back up for one of the receivers or pivot.

This deal is the only way to control your destiny.
Maybe  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:40 pm : link
what is going in New England is this: Kraft wants McCarthy but the personnel folks want the Vikes deal.

The Giants may be trying to tip the scales.
NYG knows that NE might take Maye  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 9:42 pm : link
Or trade with another team (MN) who will. Assuming the draft goes Caleb/Daniels, unless NYG knows for sure what NE plans to do, they need to deal with NE, not Az, if they want to be sure to get Maye.
RE: RE: the real question  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:42 pm : link
In comment 16480594 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480582 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


is are the Patriots really considering the Vikings deal (two #1s this year, 2025 #1)? If so, this deal makes sense from the Giants perspective.

if the Patriots are not considering that, then the Giants could just watch them take McCarthy and then deal just directly with the Cardinals.

If you are in Schoen's shoes, do you call their bluff or risk losing Maye?



It's not just calling their bluff though, because the Vikings could offer the same godfather package to AZ and AZ could trade back up for one of the receivers or pivot.

This deal is the only way to control your destiny.


Yes, and I've raised the possibility of the Cardinals trading up again.
RE: RE: RE: George  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 9:42 pm : link
In comment 16480585 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 16480581 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16480571 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


is that what you were getting at... just deal directly with the Cardinals? If so, then yes, that's a good question. Unless there is a real debate going on in New England still about which QB... is that possible? That would seem odd.



Then there's no telling the Pats don't work something out with the Vikings similar to this. This would be the way to truly box out Minnesota.



Yes, but they could lose McCarthy (including to the Giants).


By similar to this with the Vikings I mean a similar 2 step or 3 team trade with Minnesota and LAC. This is the only way to be certain you're getting the QB you want. Which if I was Schoen and I felt conviction about Maye, I would do everything possible to eliminate the potential of losing him. This is the only path to doing that and leave Minnesota no chance to spoil your plans.
The way the OP stated it the parameters were a done deal.  
Blue21 : 4/22/2024 9:46 pm : link
Could someone back out? Sure. But this close to the draft? Boards being set. Owners don't want bad surprises . I think Cards are the key. As for patriots this would be put in the newspapers as a brilliant move by them.
so does  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:49 pm : link
"Stars_and_stripes" join "gloveone" in the "Asshat Hall of Fame"?

TBD.
RE: the way  
jvm52106 : 4/22/2024 9:49 pm : link
In comment 16480497 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I look at this is this...

Giants get their QB.
Pats get extra pick they wouldn't have gotten.
Cards get extra pick, but could lose out on Harrison (they have most to lose... that's why I'm not sure this happens... it would make sense for them if they have two WRs equal on their board).


If the three teams work together it's pretty unlikely Cards lose out unless they have one WR head and shoulders over the next.. I don't see MHJ being selected by Harbaugh at 5..
RE: 3 way draft day trades are tough in NFL  
Matt in SGS : 4/22/2024 9:50 pm : link
In comment 16480162 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
I'm sure they have happened, but I can't recall the last time one has.


The last major 3 way deal I can remember in the NFL was the 1987 Eric Dickerson trade.

Colts- Get Dickerson
Rams- Get a bunch of picks from Indy & Buffalo (#1s & #2) & RBs Greg Bell (who became a Pro Bowler) & Owen Gill
Bills- Get Cornelius Bennett from Colts

That trade had established players, this one would be funky for picks, if it would happen.
RE: RE: the way  
GFAN52 : 4/22/2024 9:51 pm : link
In comment 16480614 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480497 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


I look at this is this...

Giants get their QB.
Pats get extra pick they wouldn't have gotten.
Cards get extra pick, but could lose out on Harrison (they have most to lose... that's why I'm not sure this happens... it would make sense for them if they have two WRs equal on their board).



If the three teams work together it's pretty unlikely Cards lose out unless they have one WR head and shoulders over the next.. I don't see MHJ being selected by Harbaugh at 5..


Unless they trade out to someone who does want him.
jvm52106  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/22/2024 9:51 pm : link
Possible, but it's a risk. And there have been mocks today with the Jets trading up with the Chargers to take Harrison.

To me, this largely depends on the Cardinals' evaluation of the WRs.
RE: so does  
UberAlias : 4/22/2024 9:51 pm : link
In comment 16480613 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
"Stars_and_stripes" join "gloveone" in the "Asshat Hall of Fame"?

TBD.
If ever there were ever a time someone might join gloveone in the asshat HOF, this would seem to be the year for it.
The Giants can be either be the partner or foil to both NE and Arizona  
George from PA : 4/22/2024 9:59 pm : link
NE if JJM is target.....can not drop further than 4th.

If Arizona desire is one of the top 2 WR.....can not drop further than 6th

Schoen was talking to both of them in his news conference....

I have a ton of trading down partners....."for your QB NE" . We would love on of the top WRs...."that you covet Arizona".

I understand the Chargers can screw thing up....

so sitting at 6 is a risk. A risk I would take but

I can understand why the Giants wouldn't...so they need to deal with Arizona...and can include NE to completely close loop....with Arizona possibly risking their 1st choice.

It shouldn't be too costly
RE: George  
Blue21 : 4/22/2024 10:01 pm : link
In comment 16480571 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
is that what you were getting at... just deal directly with the Cardinals? If so, then yes, that's a good question. Unless there is a real debate going on in New England still about which QB... is that possible? That would seem odd.
Remember the OP said it could work out to two trades. Giants to Cards. So Giants are at 4 Cards at 6 with extra pick. Then Giants to NE. So Giants at 3 with Maye and NE to 4 with extra pick/picks otherwise NE has threatened to trade with Minn for two first rounders . Remember there's a lot of talk about Nix to Patriots. Giants want Maye and don't want to lose him. Handshake type deal in place . Crazy. I don't know. But doesn't sound completely nuts to me. As I said before it's so complicated there may be some validity to it,
A few things  
jvm52106 : 4/22/2024 10:02 pm : link
1) I am biased here as I have said Naye as my #1 QB from day 1.

2) I don't think Chargers would go MHJ, I think it would be Nabers- a complete opposite of Quentin Johnson.

3) I am OK if we give up next year's first rd pick aa long as we keep 47 and 70 this year.

4) Players who could be traded- Slayton (unlikely), Ojulari (very likely) and Neal (quite possibly) and Jones (Pats have cap space).

5) I doubt we would include Thibs in any trade offers.

There are many ways to get creative here and Giants need to sell out to get their guy, which is Maye..
I'm  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 10:11 pm : link
I'm not sure how much credibility we should give to any of these "asshat" reports given that they tend to contradict instead of reinforce each other. Most of the other reports have also consistently said that the Patriots want an "unprecedented" amount of draft capital to move out of #3. Nothing being discussed here as possibly being offered by the Giants meets that criteria. Certainly not any offer that doesn't involve the Giants parting with their #1 next year. And there have been multiple reports that the Giants will not give up that pick as part of any trade. Most of the Patriots beat reporters also seem convinced that NE will pick a QB at #3. Something like this three team trade could happen, but I still think the most likely outcome for the Giants to get Maye is trading directly with Arizona. And I think the most likely outcome overall is that the Giants take Nabers at #6.
The Giants can't trade Jones right now....  
George from PA : 4/22/2024 10:13 pm : link
It would be a 60 million plus cap hit.
RE: I'm  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 10:14 pm : link
In comment 16480704 AcidTest said:
Quote:
I'm not sure how much credibility we should give to any of these "asshat" reports given that they tend to contradict instead of reinforce each other. Most of the other reports have also consistently said that the Patriots want an "unprecedented" amount of draft capital to move out of #3. Nothing being discussed here as possibly being offered by the Giants meets that criteria. Certainly not any offer that doesn't involve the Giants parting with their #1 next year. And there have been multiple reports that the Giants will not give up that pick as part of any trade. Most of the Patriots beat reporters also seem convinced that NE will pick a QB at #3. Something like this three team trade could happen, but I still think the most likely outcome for the Giants to get Maye is trading directly with Arizona. And I think the most likely outcome overall is that the Giants take Nabers at #6.


dd in Mass has been mentioning this same trade for a while now. He says he knows some Pats family people. And Woodstock didn't really refute this it seemed.
I actually think the Giants mgt....knowing too many eyes and ears  
George from PA : 4/22/2024 10:19 pm : link
Things will leak......


Has been feeding the gossip...sending out opposing tidbits...


Trading up....trading down....QB ...no QB....etc etc.

You almost need to read between the lines.

RE: The Giants can be either be the partner or foil to both NE and Arizona  
BleedBlue46 : 4/22/2024 10:21 pm : link
In comment 16480646 George from PA said:
Quote:
NE if JJM is target.....can not drop further than 4th.

If Arizona desire is one of the top 2 WR.....can not drop further than 6th

Schoen was talking to both of them in his news conference....

I have a ton of trading down partners....."for your QB NE" . We would love on of the top WRs...."that you covet Arizona".

I understand the Chargers can screw thing up....

so sitting at 6 is a risk. A risk I would take but

I can understand why the Giants wouldn't...so they need to deal with Arizona...and can include NE to completely close loop....with Arizona possibly risking their 1st choice.

It shouldn't be too costly


Yep, this is really the only way Schoen could secure Maye if he really wants him. And it could cost a lot less than any bidding war with the Vikings. Very creative thinking. I'm a JJM guy, but I've always said I'd be happy with Maye at the right price. This seems like it could be done for a fair price.
RE: RE: I'm  
AcidTest : 4/22/2024 10:26 pm : link
In comment 16480732 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480704 AcidTest said:


Quote:


I'm not sure how much credibility we should give to any of these "asshat" reports given that they tend to contradict instead of reinforce each other. Most of the other reports have also consistently said that the Patriots want an "unprecedented" amount of draft capital to move out of #3. Nothing being discussed here as possibly being offered by the Giants meets that criteria. Certainly not any offer that doesn't involve the Giants parting with their #1 next year. And there have been multiple reports that the Giants will not give up that pick as part of any trade. Most of the Patriots beat reporters also seem convinced that NE will pick a QB at #3. Something like this three team trade could happen, but I still think the most likely outcome for the Giants to get Maye is trading directly with Arizona. And I think the most likely outcome overall is that the Giants take Nabers at #6.



dd in Mass has been mentioning this same trade for a while now. He says he knows some Pats family people. And Woodstock didn't really refute this it seemed.


I didn't say there were no "asshat" reports supporting this proposed three-team deal or some other deal that results in the Giants getting Maye. I said that there are many reports from other "asshats" as well as Patriots and national beat reporters saying the exact opposite. In 2019, all the "asshats" here said we were absolutely not taking a QB at #6. They were all wrong.

I think posters are simply assigning undue credibility to any "asshat" report that supports their personal interest for what they want they Giants to do. Those who support trading for Maye at any cost support "asshat" reports that reinforce that possibility, and vice versa. I may admittedly be guilty of that myself. But I have at least acknowledged that the Giants may well "trade the farm" for Maye, even though I absolutely do not want them to do so.

Nobody knows what is going to happen. I have never been more uncertain about what the Giants would do this close to a draft.
doesn’t matter if Cards have Nabers equal or higher  
ColHowPepper : 4/22/2024 10:33 pm : link
than MHJ; all they need to do is say to JS we must have MHJ or you need to make it worth our while. we’d never know
RE: I'm  
GFAN52 : 4/22/2024 10:38 pm : link
In comment 16480704 AcidTest said:
Quote:
I'm not sure how much credibility we should give to any of these "asshat" reports given that they tend to contradict instead of reinforce each other. Most of the other reports have also consistently said that the Patriots want an "unprecedented" amount of draft capital to move out of #3. Nothing being discussed here as possibly being offered by the Giants meets that criteria. Certainly not any offer that doesn't involve the Giants parting with their #1 next year. And there have been multiple reports that the Giants will not give up that pick as part of any trade. Most of the Patriots beat reporters also seem convinced that NE will pick a QB at #3. Something like this three team trade could happen, but I still think the most likely outcome for the Giants to get Maye is trading directly with Arizona. And I think the most likely outcome overall is that the Giants take Nabers at #6.


Agree with this as well.
I don’t think we have any asshats yet with Schoen and his drafts.  
ThomasG : 4/22/2024 10:44 pm : link
While some things they have done with the roster, outside of his two drafts, has gotten leaked out, not certain anybody has stepped up with credible draft-related inside information during Schoen’s reign. The disaggregation of rumors this year aligns with that same theme too.

Let me know if a poster has stepped up and hit on something worthwhile in either of the last two drafts, in the meanwhile, your best bet may be to just monitor the top 30 visits and guess.
RE: George  
crooza172 : 4/22/2024 10:51 pm : link
In comment 16480571 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
is that what you were getting at... just deal directly with the Cardinals? If so, then yes, that's a good question. Unless there is a real debate going on in New England still about which QB... is that possible? That would seem odd.


It’s to prevent the Vikings stealing Maye with the patriots. Patriots can still trade down and get their guy. This is genius if true.
If NE likes JJM over Maye,  
BigBlueNH : 4/22/2024 10:58 pm : link
and Zona has MHJ and Nabers ranked closely, then this deal makes a lot of sense for all 3 teams. If ...
Game of poker  
Stars_and_stripes : 4/22/2024 11:02 pm : link

If the Pats truly like McCarthy but don't love any QB enough to bypass a mother load deal from Minny, then this deal makes a ton of sense.

Pats at outset of the league meetings said something like 'We'd have to really really love a QB to take him at 3.'

Reading the tea leaves, that probably applies to Caleb and Jayden and then a drop off. At that point the value of a godfather offer from Minny becomes to good too pass up . So Giants path to outbid Vikes was to guarantee Pats get their next highest rated QB (and one whom Kraft supposedly likes a lot) while also providing enough additional draft capital in the process.

In this scenario, Wolf gets his picks as he and Mayo made statements repeatedly about building and winning by acquiring extra picks and Kraft gets his QB.

Again, he didn't give up really any of the ins and outs of the exact terms of the offers by any team involved so some of this is interpolation but he was clear that Minny was a big factor in this driving the price up.

I would gather what has been out there in rumor land that 11,23 2025 1st and potentially more might be involved.

McCown was hired this year as the QB coach and just happens to be Maye's high school coach. I would think that's more than mere coincidence.
So wait how does this work,...  
blueblood : 4/22/2024 11:08 pm : link
Giants trade up to 3 and take Maye..
Pats move down to 6...

Then Pats trade picks to Arizona back UP to 4 and take McCarthy ??

Is that how this plays out.. that seems to make little sense to me.
RE: Than why the fuck trade at all????????  
allstarjim : 4/22/2024 11:09 pm : link
In comment 16480176 George from PA said:
Quote:
Patriots draft JLL
Arizona draft MHJ

And we get Maye.

Schoen will be a fool if he gives up premium picks.


BC if the Giants don't do it, the Vikings will move 11 and 23 plus to move to 3 or 4. For example, Pats definitely know AZ would move off of 4. So they collect Minny's picks, use that capital to move back up to 4 for JJM, with Bikes taking Maye at 3.

AZ could then easily make a good offer to get to 5, 6, or 7 and still land one of MHJ, Nabers, or Odunze. I have little doubt that Harbaigh would be willing to trade out of 5 with a good offer. Hell, of Giants miss on both JJM and Maye, with a nice enough offer, they could easily move down to 11. Maybe go Brian Thomas, or non-WR and still have enough assets.

I'm not saying moving up is the best strategy. Indeed, I prefer to call everyone's bluff. Knowing NE prefers JJM, force their hand to make a trade and maneuver back into position for JJM. And if they do...fine. Take Nabers or Odunze or trade down. I think no matter what the Giants will be not very good next year. If Odunze, for example, is the consolation prize, and we go for the QB next year, I'm good with it. Go for broke on the QB next year.

But then your painted into a corner. It's high stakes gambling. Because careers are on the line, I think it leans more heavily into OP's scenario...just get your guy this year and pay what is needed to do so, figure everything else out later.
RE: So wait how does this work,...  
mphbullet36 : 4/22/2024 11:25 pm : link
In comment 16480829 blueblood said:
Quote:
Giants trade up to 3 and take Maye..
Pats move down to 6...

Then Pats trade picks to Arizona back UP to 4 and take McCarthy ??

Is that how this plays out.. that seems to make little sense to me.


It actually makes perfect sense.

Pats are willing to trade down if they are guaranteed JJM. The only way that happens is if Giants agree they want Maye and will pick him.

Cardinals get involved because Pats can't swap 3 to 6 and guarantee JJM. Because Minny can trade up to 4 or 5.

So its basically a 3-team deal. Cards get involved because they now know 4 Qb's going 1-2-3-4 in the draft...so they are locked into MHjr or Nabers and get big time draft capital.

Also, don't see this mentioned  
allstarjim : 4/22/2024 11:30 pm : link
Banks could be the surprise player in the deal. It doesn't have to be KT or Hyatt.

Remember that two things very relevant here:

Giants hired a new DC in Shane Bowen, who has a lot of zone coverage in his scheme. Banks' strength is man coverage. If Bowen feels that Banks isn't the best fit, he could be moved.

Second fact is that this draft is heavy in draftable corner talent. Particularly the middle rounds.

Banks could be a guy you put in play.
Blue horse shoe  
thrunthrublue : 4/23/2024 12:02 am : link
Loves Bluestar Airlines……
We will see what happens,  
BleedBlue46 : 4/23/2024 12:54 am : link
But I'm glad to see everyone realizing this is our only way to potentially guarantee getting the QB most people here want. I suggested this as the only way to secure Maye multiple times, but nobody ever considered it then and it was shot down as being impossible.

This would likely be cheaper on draft capital than just trading up to 3, if Schoen pulls this off I'll really respect the creativity.
RE: Also, don't see this mentioned  
BleedBlue46 : 4/23/2024 12:56 am : link
In comment 16480854 allstarjim said:
Quote:
Banks could be the surprise player in the deal. It doesn't have to be KT or Hyatt.

Remember that two things very relevant here:

Giants hired a new DC in Shane Bowen, who has a lot of zone coverage in his scheme. Banks' strength is man coverage. If Bowen feels that Banks isn't the best fit, he could be moved.

Second fact is that this draft is heavy in draftable corner talent. Particularly the middle rounds.

Banks could be a guy you put in play.


Yes, that's true. I'd hate to see that because he might be one of Schoen's best picks, but you're right. I did mention him being one of the potential guys to move earlier in the thread actually.
RE: Also, don't see this mentioned  
MojoEd : 4/23/2024 1:22 am : link
In comment 16480854 allstarjim said:
Quote:
Banks could be the surprise player in the deal. *****.

Huge surprise seeing how thin they are at QB. If that happens, Banks should be valued at greater than a #1 pick because of the bust rate for first round picks is around 50% and Banks is a hit with 4 more years under team’s control. I can’t see them using that chip but who knows.
So this 3-way situation was dealt with in some mock drafts.  
Rave7 : 4/23/2024 2:48 am : link
1. NFL Spinzone Lou Scataglia 4/22/24 mock draft.

"3. New York Giants (via NE) - Drake Maye, QB, UNC
How about this? The New York Giants have been rumored to be interested in a QB during the 2024 NFL Draft, but there’s also reports out there saying they aren’t interested in one this early. Well, what if Patriots de-facto GM Eliot Wolf is interested in moving down a bit? If so, the Giants could offer a strong enough package to move up to the third overall spot to take Drake Maye.

4. New England Patriots (via ARI) - JJ McCarthy, QB, Michigan
So, the Patriots moved down to six initially, but they decided they wanted to try and trade up a couple of picks with the Arizona Cardinals. The Pats moved down and moved back up, and they did this to net a QB they are high on and to net some draft picks. JJ McCarthy is the fourth QB off the board.

5. Chargers - MHJ

6. Arizona Cardinals (via NE) - Malik Nabers, WR, LSU
The Arizona Cardinals moved down two slots from their original first-round pick and are still able to land Malik Nabers, arguably the best WR in the 2024 NFL Draft. The Cardinals get Kyler Murray a true WR1 on the outside."

The next one is based on Sky King 'our Vikings asshat' saying the Vikings are only interested in Maye and next would be Penix. If the Vikings lose Maye to us, then there's less chance of someone jumping over the Patriots for JJM. Then it would be like this.

NFL draft lounge Brian Lambs 4/22/24 mock draft

"3. **Trade** New York Giants (Via Patriots) – Drake Maye, QB, North Carolina
I have my first trade in this 2024 NFL Draft, and I think it’s a little unconventional. If the New England Patriots aren’t sold on Drake Maye, or perhaps they’re in love with JJ McCarthy, then moving a couple of spots down the board would be a smart decision.

4. Arizona Cardinals – Marvin Harrison Jr, WR, Ohio State
If they don’t trade out of this position, then I believe that the Arizona Cardinals would be more than happy to get the best wide receiver in the 2024 NFL Draft class. In this case, that’s Marvin Harrison Jr.

5. Chargers -Joe Alt

6. New England Patriots (Via Giants) – JJ McCarthy, QB, Michigan
In this mock draft, the New England Patriots move back three spots, but are still able to get one of the top quarterbacks in this year’s class. JJ McCarthy’s draft stock skyrocketed this season, which was capped off with the National Championship. I don’t know if he can make it into the top three, but he has the tools and makeup to play like one."

So it's unconventional but doable and creative I guess. Sorry for the long post, but it's not just us at BBI thinking about it.
If they believe in Maye  
BigBlueCane : 4/23/2024 3:58 am : link
and the price of moving up includes either KT or next year's #1, you give up KT.

Period. Don't delude yourself into thinking this is a redline. Nor compare this with the Eli situation. The Giants roster at that point in time, was far superior to what we have currently.
RE: The Giants can't trade Jones right now....  
Beer Man : 4/23/2024 6:38 am : link
In comment 16480717 George from PA said:
Quote:
It would be a 60 million plus cap hit.
Exactly, all of his prorated bonus would accelerate to the current year blowing a big hole in the 2024 salary cap.
RE: RE: The Giants can't trade Jones right now....  
Dankbeerman : 4/23/2024 6:44 am : link
In comment 16480923 Beer Man said:
Quote:
In comment 16480717 George from PA said:


Quote:


It would be a 60 million plus cap hit.

Exactly, all of his prorated bonus would accelerate to the current year blowing a big hole in the 2024 salary cap.
He is carrying a 47 mil cap number right now, its not that big a imp to trade him.

The reason he wont be traded is his 35 mil salary that goss with him
RE: RE: RE: The Giants can't trade Jones right now....  
section125 : 4/23/2024 6:52 am : link
In comment 16480926 Dankbeerman said:
Quote:
In comment 16480923 Beer Man said:


Quote:


In comment 16480717 George from PA said:


Quote:


It would be a 60 million plus cap hit.

Exactly, all of his prorated bonus would accelerate to the current year blowing a big hole in the 2024 salary cap.

He is carrying a 47 mil cap number right now, its not that big a imp to trade him.

The reason he wont be traded is his 35 mil salary that goss with him


Not right now, no, but don't kid yourself that it couldn't happen before the trade deadline if a playoff team loses its QB to an injury for the season. Remember Jones contract is basically voidable after this year.
so basically  
stoneman : 4/23/2024 7:00 am : link
the Giants pay a kings ransom to NE/AZ for the same outcome as if they stay at 6 and pick their guys. This just garantees MINN stays out of 5/6. This bites.
RE: so basically  
stoneman : 4/23/2024 7:00 am : link
In comment 16480934 stoneman said:
Quote:
the Giants pay a kings ransom to NE/AZ for the same outcome as if they stay at 6 and pick their guys. This just garantees MINN stays out of 5/6. This bites.


out of 4/5
RE: RE: so basically  
The Dude : 4/23/2024 7:09 am : link
In comment 16480935 stoneman said:
Quote:
In comment 16480934 stoneman said:


Quote:


the Giants pay a kings ransom to NE/AZ for the same outcome as if they stay at 6 and pick their guys. This just garantees MINN stays out of 5/6. This bites.



out of 4/5


If he's "the guy" boxing out MINN will be inconsequential. Big if of course, but worth noting.
RE: RE: RE: so basically  
stoneman : 4/23/2024 7:13 am : link
In comment 16480938 The Dude said:
Quote:
In comment 16480935 stoneman said:


Quote:


In comment 16480934 stoneman said:


Quote:


the Giants pay a kings ransom to NE/AZ for the same outcome as if they stay at 6 and pick their guys. This just garantees MINN stays out of 5/6. This bites.



out of 4/5



If he's "the guy" boxing out MINN will be inconsequential. Big if of course, but worth noting.


So NE and NYG make a picking swear deals to pick certain QBs - once the trade is consumated, NYG can pick anybody they want - or trade it to MINN for 3 #1s.
RE: RE: RE: RE: so basically  
stoneman : 4/23/2024 7:15 am : link
In comment 16480941 stoneman said:
Quote:
In comment 16480938 The Dude said:


Quote:


In comment 16480935 stoneman said:


Quote:


In comment 16480934 stoneman said:


Quote:


the Giants pay a kings ransom to NE/AZ for the same outcome as if they stay at 6 and pick their guys. This just garantees MINN stays out of 5/6. This bites.



out of 4/5



If he's "the guy" boxing out MINN will be inconsequential. Big if of course, but worth noting.



So NE and NYG make a picking swear deals to pick certain QBs - once the trade is consumated, NYG can pick anybody they want - or trade it to MINN for 3 #1s.


pinkey swear
Fun thread, but not realistic  
ZogZerg : 4/23/2024 7:29 am : link
The Pats aren't trading back 1 or 2 spots and picking "their" QB. If they have a QB they are staying at 3 picking him unless it's Pennix or Nix, where they can safely trade down.

The Pats would have no guarantee they would get the guy they want by trading down with anyone. They aren't stupid, which this story suggests.
RE: I don’t think we have any asshats yet with Schoen and his drafts.  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 7:33 am : link
In comment 16480789 ThomasG said:
Quote:
While some things they have done with the roster, outside of his two drafts, has gotten leaked out, not certain anybody has stepped up with credible draft-related inside information during Schoen’s reign. The disaggregation of rumors this year aligns with that same theme too.

Let me know if a poster has stepped up and hit on something worthwhile in either of the last two drafts, in the meanwhile, your best bet may be to just monitor the top 30 visits and guess.


And yet you continue to read these threads.
RE: Fun thread, but not realistic  
stoneman : 4/23/2024 7:35 am : link
In comment 16480950 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
The Pats aren't trading back 1 or 2 spots and picking "their" QB. If they have a QB they are staying at 3 picking him unless it's Pennix or Nix, where they can safely trade down.

The Pats would have no guarantee they would get the guy they want by trading down with anyone. They aren't stupid, which this story suggests.


Agreed - there would be no guarantees for NE.
RE: RE: Fun thread, but not realistic  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 7:39 am : link
In comment 16480957 stoneman said:
Quote:
In comment 16480950 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


The Pats aren't trading back 1 or 2 spots and picking "their" QB. If they have a QB they are staying at 3 picking him unless it's Pennix or Nix, where they can safely trade down.

The Pats would have no guarantee they would get the guy they want by trading down with anyone. They aren't stupid, which this story suggests.



Agreed - there would be no guarantees for NE.


So this is some sort of devious plan by the Giants to land McCarthy instead of Maye? LOL
RE: Fun thread, but not realistic  
logman : 4/23/2024 7:42 am : link
In comment 16480950 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
The Pats aren't trading back 1 or 2 spots and picking "their" QB. If they have a QB they are staying at 3 picking him unless it's Pennix or Nix, where they can safely trade down.

The Pats would have no guarantee they would get the guy they want by trading down with anyone. They aren't stupid, which this story suggests.


If Schoen snaked the Pats on a deal like this, word would get out, and no one would every deal with him again. He'd effectively kill his ability to be a GM
RE: RE: RE: Fun thread, but not realistic  
ZogZerg : 4/23/2024 7:43 am : link
In comment 16480960 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 16480957 stoneman said:


Quote:


In comment 16480950 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


The Pats aren't trading back 1 or 2 spots and picking "their" QB. If they have a QB they are staying at 3 picking him unless it's Pennix or Nix, where they can safely trade down.

The Pats would have no guarantee they would get the guy they want by trading down with anyone. They aren't stupid, which this story suggests.



Agreed - there would be no guarantees for NE.



So this is some sort of devious plan by the Giants to land McCarthy instead of Maye? LOL


No. This is a thread on BBI. Didn't we just have one the other day saying the Giants wanted JJ? The Pats can't be 100% sure who the Giants will take. You have even said that yourself. LOL
RE: RE: Fun thread, but not realistic  
ZogZerg : 4/23/2024 7:44 am : link
In comment 16480964 logman said:
Quote:
In comment 16480950 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


The Pats aren't trading back 1 or 2 spots and picking "their" QB. If they have a QB they are staying at 3 picking him unless it's Pennix or Nix, where they can safely trade down.

The Pats would have no guarantee they would get the guy they want by trading down with anyone. They aren't stupid, which this story suggests.



If Schoen snaked the Pats on a deal like this, word would get out, and no one would every deal with him again. He'd effectively kill his ability to be a GM


Schoen has NOT told the Pats who the Giants want. Come on folks, you can't actually believe that he has.
ZogZerg  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 7:47 am : link
GM's tell other teams all of the time what they intend to do with the pick. We know this because teams have started releasing footage of these negotiations after the draft.

RE: ZogZerg  
ZogZerg : 4/23/2024 7:50 am : link
In comment 16480970 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
GM's tell other teams all of the time what they intend to do with the pick. We know this because teams have started releasing footage of these negotiations after the draft.


Eric - They aren't telling them a week before the draft. Numerous GMs have stated this over the years on how trades work.
RE: RE: RE: Fun thread, but not realistic  
logman : 4/23/2024 7:50 am : link
In comment 16480968 ZogZerg said:
Quote:


Schoen has NOT told the Pats who the Giants want. Come on folks, you can't actually believe that he has.


We have video of him assuring JAX that he was not going offense when they dealt for Banks.
RE: ZogZerg  
Chris684 : 4/23/2024 7:51 am : link
In comment 16480970 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
GM's tell other teams all of the time what they intend to do with the pick. We know this because teams have started releasing footage of these negotiations after the draft.


I actually believe these teams know almost exactly who each other wants, it’s just the fans and media mostly in the dark. Why else would it be that for years these teams jump one another at the exact point in the draft even after the 1st round.
ZogZerg  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 7:52 am : link
All three teams are not hiding secrets here. Every team knows what the other team wants. That's why they would do it.
RE: ZogZerg  
ZogZerg : 4/23/2024 7:57 am : link
In comment 16480985 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
All three teams are not hiding secrets here. Every team knows what the other team wants. That's why they would do it.


Why does New England Need to be involved in a trade at all????? That makes ZERO sense. NE is not trading to Minny. Let them pick their QB.

Any trade would only need to include the Giants and Arizona, and that would only happen if Arizona was willing to lose out on the best player in the draft.


RE: RE: ZogZerg  
logman : 4/23/2024 7:59 am : link
In comment 16480997 ZogZerg said:
Quote:


Why does New England Need to be involved in a trade at all?????


To ensure NE doesn't trade to MIN
RE: RE: RE: ZogZerg  
ZogZerg : 4/23/2024 8:01 am : link
In comment 16481000 logman said:
Quote:
In comment 16480997 ZogZerg said:


Quote:




Why does New England Need to be involved in a trade at all?????




To ensure NE doesn't trade to MIN


They are not trading to Minny. Stop with the BS. They need a QB and apparently everyone on this thread know who it is. Trade to Minny and they lose out on that player. Not happening.
RE: RE: ZogZerg  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 8:01 am : link
In comment 16480997 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
In comment 16480985 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


All three teams are not hiding secrets here. Every team knows what the other team wants. That's why they would do it.



Why does New England Need to be involved in a trade at all????? That makes ZERO sense. NE is not trading to Minny. Let them pick their QB.

Any trade would only need to include the Giants and Arizona, and that would only happen if Arizona was willing to lose out on the best player in the draft.



Already discussed why above.

ZogZerg  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 8:02 am : link
It's clear you are not understanding this. I suggest you re-read the thread or take a break. It's obviously making you angry.
RE: RE: RE: RE: ZogZerg  
logman : 4/23/2024 8:03 am : link
In comment 16481002 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
In comment 16481000 logman said:


Quote:


In comment 16480997 ZogZerg said:


Quote:




Why does New England Need to be involved in a trade at all?????




To ensure NE doesn't trade to MIN



They are not trading to Minny. Stop with the BS. They need a QB and apparently everyone on this thread know who it is. Trade to Minny and they lose out on that player. Not happening.


Since you have that crystal ball out, might as well share the Powerball and Mega Millions numbers, too.

You don't know what they will or will not do any more than anyone else.
RE: ZogZerg  
ZogZerg : 4/23/2024 8:06 am : link
In comment 16481004 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
It's clear you are not understanding this. I suggest you re-read the thread or take a break. It's obviously making you angry.


No angry at all. This is what I read:

Quote:

Giants have the high hand though once it became clear that they can deliver what Pats want most and that would also entail getting the Cards involved. Cards want the blue chip WR and Pats want McCarthy most.


So Pats giving up McCarthy to trade with Minny?
It would be great if these teams  
stoneman : 4/23/2024 8:07 am : link
had this all set up, executed to the NFL office at pick 3, then the NYG had another deal with Minn executed right after and NYG traded the #3 and made the big haul - 2 2024 1sts, 1 2025 1st and more, and made their move for next year.
RE: RE: I don’t think we have any asshats yet with Schoen and his drafts.  
ThomasG : 4/23/2024 8:07 am : link
In comment 16480955 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 16480789 ThomasG said:


Quote:


While some things they have done with the roster, outside of his two drafts, has gotten leaked out, not certain anybody has stepped up with credible draft-related inside information during Schoen’s reign. The disaggregation of rumors this year aligns with that same theme too.

Let me know if a poster has stepped up and hit on something worthwhile in either of the last two drafts, in the meanwhile, your best bet may be to just monitor the top 30 visits and guess.



And yet you continue to read these threads.


Sure, it's still NYG football talk anyway. And maybe there is a current day draft-insider or two that shows up with something and slides it in to the discussions.
ZogZerg  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 8:08 am : link
the point of the three-way trade from the perspective of the Giants is to box out the Vikings. The perspective of the trade from the Patriots and Cardinals is to receive "free" draft assets when taking players they would have taken anyways. IMO, the problem here could be the Cardinals unless they have Harrison and one of the other WRs ranked closely.
RE: ZogZerg  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 8:10 am : link
In comment 16481013 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
the point of the three-way trade from the perspective of the Giants is to box out the Vikings. The perspective of the trade from the Patriots and Cardinals is to receive "free" draft assets when taking players they would have taken anyways. IMO, the problem here could be the Cardinals unless they have Harrison and one of the other WRs ranked closely.


And for the Pats, they don't want to drop below 4 if they want McCarthy. The Cards don't want to drop below 6 if they want a WR.

It's actually pretty damn clever.
ThomasG  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 8:11 am : link
OK... here is a suggestion, read but don't bitch about the asshat threads. Because right now, you're not providing any value added to the discussion. You keep doing this on threads.
RE: RE: ZogZerg  
ThomasG : 4/23/2024 8:12 am : link
In comment 16480982 Chris684 said:
Quote:
In comment 16480970 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


GM's tell other teams all of the time what they intend to do with the pick. We know this because teams have started releasing footage of these negotiations after the draft.




I actually believe these teams know almost exactly who each other wants, it’s just the fans and media mostly in the dark. Why else would it be that for years these teams jump one another at the exact point in the draft even after the 1st round.


There was a lot of video coverage last year on Schoen and he was talking to himself/guessing along regarding what the teams were doing in front of us just like any other educated fan.
From what I understand  
Rjanyg : 4/23/2024 8:13 am : link
NYG might have created a situation where they can box out MN for Maye.

Giants trade to 3. Giants draft Maye
NE trades to 4. NE draft McCarthy
AZ grabs one of MHJ or Nabers

It all comes down to compensation.

Very interesting.
also  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 8:16 am : link
since the Pats may prefer Daniels, it makes no sense to do this until after the Commanders pick.
RE: ZogZerg  
ZogZerg : 4/23/2024 8:17 am : link
In comment 16481013 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
the point of the three-way trade from the perspective of the Giants is to box out the Vikings. The perspective of the trade from the Patriots and Cardinals is to receive "free" draft assets when taking players they would have taken anyways. IMO, the problem here could be the Cardinals unless they have Harrison and one of the other WRs ranked closely.


Yeah, this sounds like a deal that a Giants fan came up with. Don't think Kraft will think it's worth it. It would be wild move by the Pats if they could pull it off. Risking your preferred "franchise QB" for a couple of draft picks.
ZogZerg  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 8:19 am : link
from my perspective, the Pats would be nuts not to do it because they are getting "free" goodies.

It also may pacify some in the Pats organization who supposedly are at odds with taking McCarthy and not trading down (we don't know if the rumors are true or not however).
RE: ThomasG  
ThomasG : 4/23/2024 8:19 am : link
In comment 16481017 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
OK... here is a suggestion, read but don't bitch about the asshat threads. Because right now, you're not providing any value added to the discussion. You keep doing this on threads.


Not bitching. I only asked if we had a current poster aligned with a recent Schoen draft since he is a fairly new at his role.
this may  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 8:22 am : link
all be BS...

However, if the Giants really want Maye, the Patriots really want McCarthy, and the Cardinals are happy with any of two WRs, it's an elegant solution.

If this is a fabricated story, I hope the Giants are reading this and taking it as a great idea to offer.
RE: ZogZerg  
ZogZerg : 4/23/2024 8:23 am : link
In comment 16481027 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
from my perspective, the Pats would be nuts not to do it because they are getting "free" goodies.

It also may pacify some in the Pats organization who supposedly are at odds with taking McCarthy and not trading down (we don't know if the rumors are true or not however).


Agree. If Pats top brass are split to some extent and not all on board with Maye/McCarthy then that's the concern for the Giants with Minny. If JJ is preferred slighlty more than say Pennix (or whomever is next) then that would be the reason Pats do this.
Eric  
JT039 : 4/23/2024 8:25 am : link
Let’s get crazy and say there’s no trades in the top 10. Draft goes..

Williams
Daniels
Maye
Harrison
Alt

What do you think the Giants do? JJ, Nabers, or trade back?

Apologies if you answered this already..
RE: Eric  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 8:30 am : link
In comment 16481037 JT039 said:
Quote:
Let’s get crazy and say there’s no trades in the top 10. Draft goes..

Williams
Daniels
Maye
Harrison
Alt

What do you think the Giants do? JJ, Nabers, or trade back?

Apologies if you answered this already..


I don't have a a clue. I'm tending to believe McCarthy is smoke at this point with the Giants.

Two days away  
JT039 : 4/23/2024 8:32 am : link
And we all have no clue.

This is exciting yet nerve wracking at the same time.
If  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2024 8:33 am : link
the Patriots draft Maye (or the Commanders draft Maye and the Patriots draft Daniels) and McCarthy falls to the Giants... and the Vikings offer three #1s? You have to consider that.
RE: If  
GFAN52 : 4/23/2024 8:53 am : link
In comment 16481055 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
the Patriots draft Maye (or the Commanders draft Maye and the Patriots draft Daniels) and McCarthy falls to the Giants... and the Vikings offer three #1s? You have to consider that.


Three #1s, which includes their 2025 1st, yes I would consider that.
RE: If  
The Dude : 4/23/2024 8:55 am : link
In comment 16481055 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
the Patriots draft Maye (or the Commanders draft Maye and the Patriots draft Daniels) and McCarthy falls to the Giants... and the Vikings offer three #1s? You have to consider that.


I think possible outcomes:

1. Maye in a trade up
2. Stay at 6 for Nabers
3. If outcomes one and two are gone....trade back, but needs a 2025 1x included. (Den, Minn, LV?, Saints)

Not an asshat, just my gut.
RE: If  
Chris684 : 4/23/2024 8:57 am : link
In comment 16481055 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
the Patriots draft Maye (or the Commanders draft Maye and the Patriots draft Daniels) and McCarthy falls to the Giants... and the Vikings offer three #1s? You have to consider that.


If Maye is our guy of the first tier QBs and we lose out, I'm most intrigued by the Denver noise and their love of JJM. I would personally just take JJM myself at 6, but if they don't want to do that, give me 12 and Surtain Jr. I would then be looking at Nix/Penix at 12.
RE: From what I understand  
Stars_and_stripes : 4/23/2024 9:05 am : link
In comment 16481020 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
NYG might have created a situation where they can box out MN for Maye.

Giants trade to 3. Giants draft Maye
NE trades to 4. NE draft McCarthy
AZ grabs one of MHJ or Nabers

It all comes down to compensation.

Very interesting.


I bet all these teams involved know exactly what each other wants most or have a strong clue. They know each other's tendencies. They have gotten intel. They have studied each others moves.

It sure seems like Minnesota is ready to give up the farm for Maye. Pats are leveraging that as much as they can to get their cake and eat it too. Is it true they want Minny's godfather offer if they don't end up with McCarthy along with some level of additional compensation? High stakes poker game. If they really do and Giants thought they were bluffing, they'd likely lose out on Maye.
RE: this may  
Optimus-NY : 4/23/2024 9:42 am : link
In comment 16481032 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
all be BS...

However, if the Giants really want Maye, the Patriots really want McCarthy, and the Cardinals are happy with any of two WRs, it's an elegant solution.

If this is a fabricated story, I hope the Giants are reading this and taking it as a great idea to offer.


How would it be executed though? Giants trade up to 4 with Arizona late on draft day or between picks 1 and 2 overall (to give Minnesota little time to react) and then trade up to 3 with the Pats once the Pats are on the clock?
RE: RE: this may  
BleedBlue46 : 4/23/2024 10:07 am : link
In comment 16481240 Optimus-NY said:
Quote:
In comment 16481032 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


all be BS...

However, if the Giants really want Maye, the Patriots really want McCarthy, and the Cardinals are happy with any of two WRs, it's an elegant solution.

If this is a fabricated story, I hope the Giants are reading this and taking it as a great idea to offer.



How would it be executed though? Giants trade up to 4 with Arizona late on draft day or between picks 1 and 2 overall (to give Minnesota little time to react) and then trade up to 3 with the Pats once the Pats are on the clock?


I'd imagine it would all happen with NE on the clock as it depends on CW and JD going 1-2
Stray thought - what if  
Reale01 : 4/23/2024 10:10 am : link
If NE makes a Godfather deal with MN. The Giants are not getting Maye. (Maybe 3 1s and a 2)

New England still wants JJM and won't get him at 12. They would be looking to trade up for JJM using some of their newly acquired assets.

Giants trade pick 6 to NE for three 1s. NE gets their guy and a #2. Giants get 3 1s.
RE: RE: RE: this may  
AnnapolisMike : 4/23/2024 10:11 am : link
In comment 16481296 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16481240 Optimus-NY said:




I'd imagine it would all happen with NE on the clock as it depends on CW and JD going 1-2



This. If X and Y happen that triggers the trades. It is all in place if this is real.
RE: RE: ZogZerg  
BleedBlue46 : 4/23/2024 10:11 am : link
In comment 16481025 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
In comment 16481013 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


the point of the three-way trade from the perspective of the Giants is to box out the Vikings. The perspective of the trade from the Patriots and Cardinals is to receive "free" draft assets when taking players they would have taken anyways. IMO, the problem here could be the Cardinals unless they have Harrison and one of the other WRs ranked closely.



Yeah, this sounds like a deal that a Giants fan came up with. Don't think Kraft will think it's worth it. It would be wild move by the Pats if they could pull it off. Risking your preferred "franchise QB" for a couple of draft picks.


NE wouldn't be risking losing JJM in this scenario, they would go straight to pick 4 knowing we were taking Maye at 3.
RE: RE: RE: RE: ZogZerg  
BleedBlue46 : 4/23/2024 10:13 am : link
In comment 16481002 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
In comment 16481000 logman said:


Quote:


In comment 16480997 ZogZerg said:


Quote:




Why does New England Need to be involved in a trade at all?????




To ensure NE doesn't trade to MIN



They are not trading to Minny. Stop with the BS. They need a QB and apparently everyone on this thread know who it is. Trade to Minny and they lose out on that player. Not happening.


Whats stopping them from potentially taking the haul from Min then moving back up to get JJM theoretically?
These handshake predraft deals are done all the time. It happened when  
Blue21 : 4/23/2024 10:16 am : link
We got Eli. Night before draft a third party contacted Giants and said Chargers are taking Eli you guys take Rivers and then trade for Eli with the following picks. Many times it's done by the parties directly.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: ZogZerg  
crooza172 : 4/23/2024 10:17 am : link
In comment 16481316 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16481002 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


In comment 16481000 logman said:


Quote:


In comment 16480997 ZogZerg said:


Quote:




Why does New England Need to be involved in a trade at all?????




To ensure NE doesn't trade to MIN



They are not trading to Minny. Stop with the BS. They need a QB and apparently everyone on this thread know who it is. Trade to Minny and they lose out on that player. Not happening.



Whats stopping them from potentially taking the haul from Min then moving back up to get JJM theoretically?


Eliminating the possibility of NOT being able to move back up is my thought. I think this is a strong W for all three teams involved. Everyone gets what they want with no additional stress.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: ZogZerg  
Stars_and_stripes : 4/23/2024 10:17 am : link
In comment 16481316 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16481002 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


In comment 16481000 logman said:


Quote:


In comment 16480997 ZogZerg said:


Quote:




Why does New England Need to be involved in a trade at all?????




To ensure NE doesn't trade to MIN



They are not trading to Minny. Stop with the BS. They need a QB and apparently everyone on this thread know who it is. Trade to Minny and they lose out on that player. Not happening.



Whats stopping them from potentially taking the haul from Min then moving back up to get JJM theoretically?


A big enough offer from the Giants to compensate as well as Cards being in position to draft their blue-chip WR.
If the cards, NE , and Giants have a deal and one of them backs out  
Blue21 : 4/23/2024 10:20 am : link
At last minute after the deal started. I pity that team in the future. Word will get around and future trust will be lost. Nope if a team backs out it will be before. No one will get screwed so to speak.
RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
Dr. D : 4/23/2024 10:28 am : link
In comment 16480204 Section331 said:
Quote:
would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.

if they're confident they can get him at 4, while adding another pick, why not?
I'm late to this thread, but wow!  
LW_Giants : 4/23/2024 10:32 am : link
This would be a very creative way to allow everyone to get what they want (if NE really loves JJM)
NE: gets JJM and some additional assets to just move down one spot
NYG: Get their guy in Maye
Arizona: Gets additional assets and one of top 2 receivers.

I'm not sure I believe this since the OP has no history here, and it's very complicated. But I certainly hope it's true.

Question is how much do vikings keep adding to the deal to get either Arizona or NE to say "actually we need you to add more Giants"
RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
Optimus-NY : 4/23/2024 10:34 am : link
In comment 16480204 Section331 said:
Quote:
would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.


Sounds like there's a lot of palace intrigue going on in Foxboro (i.e., coaching staff vs. front office vs. ownership).
RE: I'm late to this thread, but wow!  
GFAN52 : 4/23/2024 10:36 am : link
In comment 16481357 LW_Giants said:
Quote:
This would be a very creative way to allow everyone to get what they want (if NE really loves JJM)
NE: gets JJM and some additional assets to just move down one spot
NYG: Get their guy in Maye
Arizona: Gets additional assets and one of top 2 receivers.

I'm not sure I believe this since the OP has no history here, and it's very complicated. But I certainly hope it's true.

Question is how much do vikings keep adding to the deal to get either Arizona or NE to say "actually we need you to add more Giants"


That's a great point about the Vikings. They haven't hidden their desperation for getting a QB in this draft.
RE: RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
PatersonPlank : 4/23/2024 10:42 am : link
In comment 16481365 Optimus-NY said:
Quote:
In comment 16480204 Section331 said:


Quote:


would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.



Sounds like there's a lot of palace intrigue going on in Foxboro (i.e., coaching staff vs. front office vs. ownership).


Because they can get an additional pick, probably relatively high, with zero risk and still get JJM
RE: RE: RE: Thanks for sharing, but I’m wondering why Pats  
crooza172 : 4/23/2024 2:37 pm : link
In comment 16481383 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
In comment 16481365 Optimus-NY said:


Quote:


In comment 16480204 Section331 said:


Quote:


would be involved at all in this scenario? If they want JJM, just take him 3rd, and the Giants and Cards can work out their own deal.



Sounds like there's a lot of palace intrigue going on in Foxboro (i.e., coaching staff vs. front office vs. ownership).



Because they can get an additional pick, probably relatively high, with zero risk and still get JJM


Agreed with this and everything I am seeing/hearing today seems to corroborate with this three way trade.

New England seems to like JJM over Maye. They don't want to move back to spot that doesn't guarantee them JJM.
Giants are trying to trade up for Maye.
Cardinals are open to moving back, but no lower than 6.

I'm not going to get my hopes up here but this is starting to look more and more like it may happen and just makes way to much sense.
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