Think about it: If the NE PATRIOTS are OK with trading out of the #3 spot and pass on one of the remaining QBs... A team that has no QB. I team that has more NEED at QB than our beloved Giants... Willing to pass on Maye and McCarthy and trade down... Doesn't that tell you something about the ACTUAL draft value placed on Maye and McCarthy? If they were TRULY going to be franchise QBs wouldn't NE want one of them? Even if there were an 80% chance they are going to be great? Even 60-80% chance... Why give that up?
Maybe they get Schoen to include DJ in the trade. Again... That tells me they value DJ higher than Maye or McCarthy. Or at least equal in value.
Point is, if the remaining QBs don't look like a giant ass porter house steak on a plate to the QB starved Patriots, why the hell would we want to give up premium draft capital to get one of them while passing up an alpha WR1? It doesn't make sense. Make it make sense?
It would make more sense if NE picked one and we traded into the 4th spot to get the other. I wouldn't like it, but I would understand. But trading up to take a QB the Patriots do not want, idk... it seems like a bad move. Can you imagine a homeless person trying to get you to buy a cheeseburger off of him? Even if you were just thinking you could really go for a cheeseburgrer, you gotta be wondering what the hell is wrong with the cheeseburger. Even if you rationalize that maybe they would rather have money for booze or something... you STILL gotta wonder what the problem is with the cheeseburger that the person who has no idea when they will get another cheeseburger, if ever, is so willing to give it up. IDK about you, but I aint buying that cheeseburger.
Or if they want JJM and also want to get something for Maye at 3. I've said for a long time now, that NE could potentially get their guy and extra draft capital. That would he considered winning in my book.
So you're saying DJ is worth more than Maye and JJM in a completely made up hypothetical that isn't being reported anywhere? Tell me more.
How do people like this get out of bed in the morning and go to a job?
All teams rate players differently and it's still not an exact science.
Now..there seems to be 6 QBs that can be drafted in the 1st.....
All with different strengths....so it might also be which cup of tea you prefe.
Not only do I trust their opinions on QBs over a lot of other teams, but I think Daboll is probably the best coach to develop a Maye or McCarthy based on his track record.
Even looking at what he's done in NY with a mess of an OL, he got a playoff win and huge contract for Jones and had people talking about Tommy DeVito as a possible franchise QB.
My opinion is and always has been, when you brought Daboll in the main purpose was to let him select and groom a QB because he's good at it.
What conclusions can you draw from that? A QB needy team passed on Mahomes, therefore everyone should have passed on Mahomes because if a QB needy team passes on him he's not going to be good.
The Jets said "no" to Mahomes but yes the next year to Sam Darnold.
Do you see the flaws in your logic?
Here is a pre-2017-draft blurb on the Jets draft needs:
1. Quarterback: Just as it's been for the last 40-something years. General manager Mike Maccagnan's brief track record suggests he'll take a quarterback at some point during the draft.......
Don't worry. Another three days and this will all be over.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder!
All teams rate players differently and it's still not an exact science.
It's also how players learn and develop
Now, if you have an actual thought in your head, I'd like to hear THAT instead of your lame attempt at insulting my intelligence.
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Maybe they get Schoen to include DJ in the trade. Again... That tells me they value DJ higher than Maye or McCarthy. Or at least equal in value.
So you're saying DJ is worth more than Maye and JJM in a completely made up hypothetical that isn't being reported anywhere? Tell me more.
What conclusions can you draw from that? A QB needy team passed on Mahomes, therefore everyone should have passed on Mahomes because if a QB needy team passes on him he's not going to be good.
The Jets said "no" to Mahomes but yes the next year to Sam Darnold.
Do you see the flaws in your logic?
Here is a pre-2017-draft blurb on the Jets draft needs:
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...TOP 5 NEEDS:
1. Quarterback: Just as it's been for the last 40-something years. General manager Mike Maccagnan's brief track record suggests he'll take a quarterback at some point during the draft.......
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Are you basically asking us to explain to you that teams have players rated differently?
Bwhahaha gtfo! NO! I totally understand that. But I'm looking at a team that is worse off than we are. If we are in a spot where most people on this forum are ready to sell off our premium picks for the next couple years to get the 3rd or 4th best QB in the draft, then you gotta imagine NE is salivating to get a franchise QB. If they're passing up Maye/McCarthy for Brissette/Hoyle or *gasp* Daniel Jones... Something doesn't add up. Not everyone rates Cheeseburgers the same either. But if your hungry...
You say you understand that, then continue to proceed to demonstrate that you in fact do not seem to understand it.
He had a very promising second year with Josh Brown and Cole Beasley as the top 2 receiving targets.
If 3500 yards accounted for and 28 TDs created is shit, that makes Jones's high water mark shit too, correct?
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The Browns and Jets passed on Josh Allen for Mayfield and Darnold. The Bucs had a need at Quarterback but passed on Allen trading the pick to Buffalo. Doesn’t that tell you something about Josh Allen?
Yeah, Josh Allen was shit until he got Diggs and some OL help.
Not even remotely accurate
So, I guess my question is, what if NE and Giants both like Maye and JJM, but giants have Maye 1 and JJm 2 and pats have the inverse? Then it isn’t a case of us taking a qb they don’t want or like, just different scouting/evaluations/preferences which is quite common in the NFL
He had a very promising second year with Josh Brown and Cole Beasley as the top 2 receiving targets.
If 3500 yards accounted for and 28 TDs created is shit, that makes Jones's high water mark shit too, correct?
Christian: That is such complete and unadulterated BS and you know it. The 2nd year #s you count for Allen INCLUDE his rushing totals. That year he had a 59% completion rate, threw for 3,100 yards (6.6 YPA) and 20 TDs with 9 picks (actually sounds kind of Daniel Jonesy doesn't it!) The very next season with Diggs on board he completed 69% of his passes for 4,500 yards (7.9 YPA) and 37 TDs with just 10 picks. In fact it was an absolutely remarkable turnaround with his yardage up 50% while his TD passes almost doubled w/o any change in picks. Here's a thought: maybe we should just get somebody like Diggs instead of blowing much of our draft capital on a guy who's going to have to deal with same issues Jones has had here for 5 years.
So, I guess my question is, what if NE and Giants both like Maye and JJM, but giants have Maye 1 and JJm 2 and pats have the inverse? Then it isn’t a case of us taking a qb they don’t want or like, just different scouting/evaluations/preferences which is quite common in the NFL
I mean Jesus how dense are you guys. If NE likes JJM more then like any normal team in that scenario they'd take JJM not offer the pick up for sale. Sheesh!
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About missing the invite for this DJFC meeting, but Eric told me I have to be nicer last week.
So, I guess my question is, what if NE and Giants both like Maye and JJM, but giants have Maye 1 and JJm 2 and pats have the inverse? Then it isn’t a case of us taking a qb they don’t want or like, just different scouting/evaluations/preferences which is quite common in the NFL
I mean Jesus how dense are you guys. If NE likes JJM more then like any normal team in that scenario they'd take JJM not offer the pick up for sale. Sheesh!
lol, why do that if they can trade down a spot and get JJM and more?
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In comment 16482221 LW_Giants said:
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About missing the invite for this DJFC meeting, but Eric told me I have to be nicer last week.
So, I guess my question is, what if NE and Giants both like Maye and JJM, but giants have Maye 1 and JJm 2 and pats have the inverse? Then it isn’t a case of us taking a qb they don’t want or like, just different scouting/evaluations/preferences which is quite common in the NFL
I mean Jesus how dense are you guys. If NE likes JJM more then like any normal team in that scenario they'd take JJM not offer the pick up for sale. Sheesh!
lol, why do that if they can trade down a spot and get JJM and more?
Because they aren't going to be able to do that. That trade you guys keep relying exists in your heads and that's all. If nothing else Arizona is not going to play along. The Cards have said they want a bushel of future picks or they're staying put and taking Harrison and trading down to 6 where they'd get what Nabers and a 2nd ain't either. They'd surely trade at that point with Minnesota or even Denver who'd be offering way more. Again the notion they'd prefer mving to 6 where they'd still get Nabers exists in only one place and that's in your guys heads.
Here's the reality: if the Pats are trading out from three its because they don't like either Maye AND McCarthy and feel they'd be better served getting a passel of picks and building the rest of the team that way and addressing QB some other way.
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In comment 16482230 Snorkels said:
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In comment 16482221 LW_Giants said:
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About missing the invite for this DJFC meeting, but Eric told me I have to be nicer last week.
So, I guess my question is, what if NE and Giants both like Maye and JJM, but giants have Maye 1 and JJm 2 and pats have the inverse? Then it isn’t a case of us taking a qb they don’t want or like, just different scouting/evaluations/preferences which is quite common in the NFL
I mean Jesus how dense are you guys. If NE likes JJM more then like any normal team in that scenario they'd take JJM not offer the pick up for sale. Sheesh!
lol, why do that if they can trade down a spot and get JJM and more?
Because they aren't going to be able to do that. That trade you guys keep relying exists in your heads and that's all. If nothing else Arizona is not going to play along. The Cards have said they want a bushel of future picks or they're staying put and taking Harrison and trading down to 6 where they'd get what Nabers and a 2nd ain't either. They'd surely trade at that point with Minnesota or even Denver who'd be offering way more. Again the notion they'd prefer mving to 6 where they'd still get Nabers exists in only one place and that's in your guys heads.
Here's the reality: if the Pats are trading out from three its because they don't like either Maye AND McCarthy and feel they'd be better served getting a passel of picks and building the rest of the team that way and addressing QB some other way.
There’s just as many assumptions in what you’re saying as any of us, but if you can’t see that….well…I guess there’s nothing else worth discussing. No one here is saying Nabers won’t be the pick for the giants at 6, we’re just discussing what potential trades could look like. And you’re acting like someone is threatening to shoot your dog.
He had a very promising second year with Josh Brown and Cole Beasley as the top 2 receiving targets.
If 3500 yards accounted for and 28 TDs created is shit, that makes Jones's high water mark shit too, correct?
Christian: That is such complete and unadulterated BS and you know it. The 2nd year #s you count for Allen INCLUDE his rushing totals. That year he had a 59% completion rate, threw for 3,100 yards (6.6 YPA) and 20 TDs with 9 picks (actually sounds kind of Daniel Jonesy doesn't it!)
You must have missed the part in bold.
The rush + pass numbers Allen had in the pre-Diggs year were not shit. They were promising.
With more experience and better weapons, Allen went from promising to MVP candidate.
But if your definition of shit is 2019 Allen/2022 Jones, I'm sure I can find it in my heart to agree with you for dramatic effect.
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In comment 16482232 LW_Giants said:
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In comment 16482230 Snorkels said:
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In comment 16482221 LW_Giants said:
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About missing the invite for this DJFC meeting, but Eric told me I have to be nicer last week.
So, I guess my question is, what if NE and Giants both like Maye and JJM, but giants have Maye 1 and JJm 2 and pats have the inverse? Then it isn’t a case of us taking a qb they don’t want or like, just different scouting/evaluations/preferences which is quite common in the NFL
I mean Jesus how dense are you guys. If NE likes JJM more then like any normal team in that scenario they'd take JJM not offer the pick up for sale. Sheesh!
lol, why do that if they can trade down a spot and get JJM and more?
Because they aren't going to be able to do that. That trade you guys keep relying exists in your heads and that's all. If nothing else Arizona is not going to play along. The Cards have said they want a bushel of future picks or they're staying put and taking Harrison and trading down to 6 where they'd get what Nabers and a 2nd ain't either. They'd surely trade at that point with Minnesota or even Denver who'd be offering way more. Again the notion they'd prefer mving to 6 where they'd still get Nabers exists in only one place and that's in your guys heads.
Here's the reality: if the Pats are trading out from three its because they don't like either Maye AND McCarthy and feel they'd be better served getting a passel of picks and building the rest of the team that way and addressing QB some other way.
There’s just as many assumptions in what you’re saying as any of us, but if you can’t see that….well…I guess there’s nothing else worth discussing. No one here is saying Nabers won’t be the pick for the giants at 6, we’re just discussing what potential trades could look like. And you’re acting like someone is threatening to shoot your dog.
C'mon Christian: I think you're better than that. Trying to sneak Allen's rush yards into his stats and calling it 'accounted for' is disingenuous at best, downright deceitful at worst. And the point isn't what Allen did in his second year, its that he absolutely took off in year three once they got him a true #1 receiver.
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In comment 16481755 Jay on the Island said:
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The Browns and Jets passed on Josh Allen for Mayfield and Darnold. The Bucs had a need at Quarterback but passed on Allen trading the pick to Buffalo. Doesn’t that tell you something about Josh Allen?
Yeah, Josh Allen was shit until he got Diggs and some OL help.
Not even remotely accurate
Look… I’m salty. I’m nervous about Thursday. I don’t want us in QB Hell for 5 years because we traded away our future to move up for a friggin HUGE ass maybe. I’m illustrating that point with a question that needs serious consideration. But hate is like a friggin blindfold, is it not? DJ has proven he’s good enough, at least, as a stop gap. We can get an elite receiver. We can maybe even grab a Penix or Nix right after. Who I believe will be better than JJ. Maye could go either way.
We won’t get another shot at a receiver like the top 3 for a while since to move up for Maye or JJ would mean sacrificing opportunities. And if they don’t work out, when we do have a chance we’re back to the same game of trying to get a QB. If we can’t agree that’s fine but don’t try to act like I’m someone who watched his first draft in 2023. I’m making valid points
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Are you basically asking us to explain to you that teams have players rated differently?
How do people like this get out of bed in the morning and go to a job?