Graziano: It's possible NYG takes Penix at 6

It was in a thread, not a OP.

I still worry about the Cardinals trade back and then trading up if Maye gets to 4.

Remember, the Vikings will give up THREE #1 picks to the Cardinals. They could easily flip some of that to move up with the Chargers (that deal could already be in place). All that matters to the Cardinals is that they still make out with more draft picks and the same player.

Otherwise, the Giants position here could simply be to let the Patriots take McCarthy and deal directly with the Cardinals right now (which still may happen).

trade down to get him.

In comment 16482813 JonC said:

Quote:

Giants leak today they're considering Penix at #6 as a response. Giants want to box out Vikes for Maye, Pats want to ensure JJ if they move down. It also suggests Vikes may have the upper hand at trading up for #4, if the Pats stay put and draft JJ. It's all coming into focus, now can Schoen pull it off.

This is spot on. I think this is going to heat up big time today. Now Schoen needs to bring in his closer.

Eric, I hope you’re right on Kraft being cool on Maye.

A three team deal just makes so much sense for cards giants and New England. But Vikings are not going to go down easy, they’ll keep driving up the price until the last minute

In comment 16482817 pjcas18 said:

Quote:

In comment 16482784 UConn4523 said: Quote: I don’t think the Giants are adjusting their board 36 hours before the draft. If they liked Penix a month ago they still like him now, and if they didn’t like him a month ago they probably still don’t now either. I’m simply saying your trade up scenario doesn’t appear to be realistic and comes with risk, not sure how that’s considered a better strategy unless you happen to know Penix won’t be taken by anyone else. it's not realistic because 36 hours before the draft - the guy on most draft boards in the 30-40 range suddenly becomes a "realistic option" at 6. lol. Ok. Prior to this report the Giants getting a WR like Nabers or Odunze at 6 and Penix or Nix sometime after seemed completely realistic. Sometime after could be a trade back into the 1st, a trade up in the 2nd, but it certainly seemed realistic and it probably still is unless you believe things that get released 36 hours before the draft.

So you are quoting draft boards? Strange. Guess McCarthy is out to then.

And I don’t believe this because it’s the day before the draft, I’ve believed Penix and Nix won’t be available after the teens for weeks atleast, possibly months.

In comment 16482845 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:

Quote:

Eric, I hope you’re right on Kraft being cool on Maye.

Look, the Commanders and Pats may still take Maye and all of this is moot that we will be laughing at in a couple of days.

However, everything coming out the last few days suggests Maye is not their guy.

.

somewhere between 30-40 on their boards. If they did, there would be no point floating this because nobody would believe it. This is being floated only because there is a very real possibility that Penix will be picked somewhere between 11 and 20.

There are a crap ton of teams after us that need QBs. You can't develop a draft strategy based on "buzz." It is based on who picks in a range, who do they need, and how good can they be.

This is only being floated to discourage NE from trading back to 11 if they like Penix. If nobody had him realistically going in the first round, it would be completely pointless to do it.

For us to stay at #6 and end up with the fifth QB taken?

the only way any of this makes sense is the following:

(1) the Pats are not in love with Maye. (But they also may be waiting to see if Washington passes on Daniels... this is why no deals until DC picks).

(2) there is someone the Pats want where they don't want to fall too far down on the board (McCarthy and/or Penix?)

Also throw in there the strong possibility that the Cardinals don't want to fall below #6.

on GoDeep's thread. It makes sense to keep NE in line.
Link - ( New Window )

I think they want Daniels, with JJ as the fallback unless Kraft wins out on JJ, and Penix the next fallback.

by the Giants. They are trying to take away possible options for the Pats.

It's all about leverage, and squeezing the deal. Supposedly, the Pats are no longer interested in the Giants offer which was #3.... for #6, 2025 #1 and a 2025 #3.

Supposedly, the Giants are now more interested in trading back a few spots to grab extra draft capital.

It's all posturing at this point, no deal is going to happen until and hour or two before the draft starts.

I do know that Kraft still loves JJM and that they want a QB in this draft. However, JJM wasn't one of the top QB's based on their scouting reports.

So do they reach for JJM, take Maye or trade back? It's still anybody's guess in Foxboro.

yessir.

Instant F from me

Daboll has said he likes juice at the position. Remember the Buck/Aikman comments from the Seattle game about Daboll/Jones.

NYG doesn't have a pick again until 47. Penix won't be there. If you want him, you take him at 6.

I guess anything is possible... but Penix at 6?

Nice click-bait.

In comment 16482874 Sean said:

Quote:

Daboll has said he likes juice at the position. Remember the Buck/Aikman comments from the Seattle game about Daboll/Jones. NYG doesn't have a pick again until 47. Penix won't be there. If you want him, you take him at 6.

Go post this on the Patriots version of BBI. It will help Schoen.

Without a follow up. No idea if he's a true asshat or just talking.

.

now the New York beat reporters are tweeting about it.

Bait taken.

In comment 16482694 Dankbeerman said:

Quote:

was looking to trade down to acquire picks and take Penix as a fallback then this could be leveraging them towards the rumored 3 way with us and the Cards

+1

In comment 16482886 Eric from BBI said:

Quote:

now the New York beat reporters are tweeting about it. Bait taken.

Mission accomplished...

Just call the bluff of the Pats and don’t trade with them. If they want McCarthy they have to take him at 3. If they want to trade with Minnesota they will be without a QB. Giants can either take McCarthy, trade with another team or trade with the Pats and take most of what they got in the trade back…lol take a WR and let McCarthy get taken by another team ahead of 11.

If you get desperate you most likely make a stupid trade. A QB is not going to help this team win this year. Trading up kills any hope to improve this team this year. Trading up costs a lot more cap money.

In comment 16482884 j_rud said:

Quote:

.

Laremy Tunsil understands...

In comment 16482896 Optimus-NY said:

Quote:

In comment 16482884 j_rud said: Quote: . Laremy Tunsil understands...

Haha, a Tunsil like surprise would be the cherry on top for this years draft run up!

If the Giants want a QB Trade the 2nd round pick and extra to get the QB in the late first round or early 2nd and I am also talking future round picks plus maybe a player as well.If its a QB we really like and he is still on the board.

In comment 16482673 section125 said:

Quote:

In comment 16482663 DefenseWins said: Quote: I do agree with Terps that if Penix is good enough to be taken at 12, then why not at 6... .

Because they would mitigate the risk he presents for health reasons by gaining some additional picks if trading back

It’s risky to trade back from #6 - assuming JJM is gone - with the hope that Penix might be available when the Giants have their pick.

I just hope all this smoke means the team is moving on from Daniel Jones.

Has trouble completing intermediate passes.

Has no plan B when a play breaks down as evidenced by the fact that he rushed for just 8 yards last season. (That's not going to work in today's NFL.)

Add in his age (24 before training camps open) and his medicals and I don't even want him in RD-2, let alone @ 6.

Also, from my thread yesterday, here's the review by Beacher Report’s Analyst Derrik Klassen:

“His response to pressure is to either throw it away or throw it up for Odunze… In the NFL you’re going to have to have a lot more.” “He doesn’t have answers to get outside the pocket. His scramble rate was around 1%. In the NFL that’s not going to fly. In 1980 maybe. Today there’s no shot.” “His adjusted accuracy rate is also worse than all the other QBs except for Rattler.” “That’s not great given all the offensive talent he had, plus superior coaching.” “He had everything you could want and he still was not an accurate passer.” “In the 1-10 yard area, he just doesn’t have that timing that rhythm that flexibility to throw it very well and that’s a big hinderance.” “He struggles with touch.”

Only way they take Penix is if they decide to trade down into the teens and get a shitload of extra picks including multiple 1sts and by that I mean a 2025 and 2026.

believes that the Giants would take Penix at #6. That's bullshit and everyone knows it, so any "leak" that we might is irrelevant and won't give us any "leverage" with NE or AZ.

I agree it's Maye or bust for the Giants. It's also looking like NE will take JJM. That puts the Giants and the Vikings in competition with Arizona for #4. My guess is we win that battle and Maye is a Giant by 9PM tomorrow night. The only way that doesn't happen is if AZ asks for a ridiculous haul of draft picks.

Scare AZ into realizing they’d have to overpay drastically to get back to five to draft a WR.

To be honest, there’s no bad situation here for the Giants. Unless they feel Maye is a 12 year franchise QB worthy of #1 overall in any draft. And worth the overpay.

But if all this maneuvering causes the Vikes to overpay to get into the third slot. Or 4th slot.

And AZ to overpay to get back to the 5th slot.

Giants may still be able to choose a dominate WR. Or even better, all those overpays to move up, causes a desired player to fall to six and someone has to pay this years cost to move up to six.

This isn’t a Cedric Jones or Devonta Smith situation IMO. Where there’s less targeted players available than their pick number in the draft.

But, having watched him play probably 15 games or more, I do agree with the snippet observations. There are warts and holes plus the injury dossier is really risky.

Anyway, Giants taking Penix at 6 is a non-issue imv, this is about motivating the Pats.

In comment 16482950 Jim in Tampa said:

Quote:

His response to pressure is to either throw it away or throw it up for Odunze

Any chance you have a link to that. I’m blown away reading that. For the simple fact of my blind comments about him int he QB stats thread from yesterday 😮

No one knows who prefers what QB or maybe none at all. All these suggested trades were heard in 2018 and the draft didn't go as expected. Just wait and see because there are no peyton Mannings or Luck in this draft

In comment 16482957 JonC said:

Quote:

But, having watched him play probably 15 games or more, I do agree with the snippet observations. There are warts and holes plus the injury dossier is really risky. Anyway, Giants taking Penix at 6 is a non-issue imv, this is about motivating the Pats.

Agreed, I don't think they are seriously considering him at 6 for themselves.

In comment 16482962 Shecky said:

Quote:

In comment 16482950 Jim in Tampa said: Quote: His response to pressure is to either throw it away or throw it up for Odunze Any chance you have a link to that. I’m blown away reading that. For the simple fact of my blind comments about him int he QB stats thread from yesterday 😮

The link to that thread is below. The OP contains the link to the interview. QBs are discussed in the first half of the video and the other skill positions in the second half.

QB Takes - ( New Window )

It is very risky for them to try pull this off unless they have the deal in place if the other pieces fall. What would LA's be motivation for moving out of the top 5? They will receive less of a haul from Arizona than the Cards got to move back. Arizona has a lot of picks already I don't think they will get too cute and drop further than 6. The caveat is that I don't know anything.

There is a chance to make some cash, as Penix is currently +10000 to go #6

In comment 16482812 Eric from BBI said:

Quote:

I'm not going to get any work done today.

How is this any different than the last few days;)

This is a great thread, BTW! Some good insight.

In comment 16482950 Jim in Tampa said:

Quote:

Has trouble completing intermediate passes. Has no plan B when a play breaks down as evidenced by the fact that he rushed for just 8 yards last season. (That's not going to work in today's NFL.) Add in his age (24 before training camps open) and his medicals and I don't even want him in RD-2, let alone @ 6. Also, from my thread yesterday, here's the review by Beacher Report’s Analyst Derrik Klassen: “His response to pressure is to either throw it away or throw it up for Odunze… In the NFL you’re going to have to have a lot more.” “He doesn’t have answers to get outside the pocket. His scramble rate was around 1%. In the NFL that’s not going to fly. In 1980 maybe. Today there’s no shot.” “His adjusted accuracy rate is also worse than all the other QBs except for Rattler.” “That’s not great given all the offensive talent he had, plus superior coaching.” “He had everything you could want and he still was not an accurate passer.” “In the 1-10 yard area, he just doesn’t have that timing that rhythm that flexibility to throw it very well and that’s a big hinderance.” “He struggles with touch.”

Not to mention his body is made of porcelain.

In comment 16482957 JonC said:

Quote:

Anyway, Giants taking Penix at 6 is a non-issue imv, this is about motivating the Pats.

Could be motivating the Pats. Could be one last try to get them to agree to the current framework before upping their offer. Could also be pressure to get the Pats to accept the Giants proposal over the Vikings proposal.

but it's a long fall for the Pats whom I believe want JJ.

I think this is all to try and extort more from NYG.

The Giants are involved in a lawsuit accusing them of being a racist organization in the FLores thing.

Picking a black QB at 6 on national TV would go a long way to eliminate that narrative (as ridiculous as I personally think it is) I would imagine.

And it happens, a lot of fans will be mad but they shouldn’t be. Penix is criminally underrated.

Penix at 6 is much more ideal than any of the WRs.

In comment 16483055 JonC said:

Quote:

but it's a long fall for the Pats whom I believe want JJ. I think this is all to try and extort more from NYG.

Agreed, and I would ignore it. We made an offer. Now it's time to tell them to take it or leave it, and if the latter, then we walk away. My guess is they take JJM anyway, and then we can deal with AZ for Maye. But even then, we should take the same approach and not get into a relentless bidding war with the Vikings. Make an offer and say no if AZ asks for more.

I guess I'm in the minority, but I don't think it's a disaster if we don't get JJM or Maye. The disaster would be massively overpaying for either. Take one of the other QBs, maybe after a trade down, or punt the entire issue until next year.

In comment 16483055 JonC said:

Quote:

but it's a long fall for the Pats whom I believe want JJ. I think this is all to try and extort more from NYG.

I agree. I don't see how the Pats risk going all the way to 11 if they want a specific QB. A HUGE risk for them.