What was the Eli trade? I honestly forget exactly what it was, but at the time the Giants did have needs. If Maye turns out that good, if you find your QB of the future for next 10-12 years it’s worth it imo.
What was the Eli trade? I honestly forget exactly what it was, but at the time the Giants did have needs. If Maye turns out that good, if you find your QB of the future for next 10-12 years it’s worth it imo.
It’s simple when you apply hindsight. Isn’t any trade just that easy?
What was the Eli trade? I honestly forget exactly what it was, but at the time the Giants did have needs. If Maye turns out that good, if you find your QB of the future for next 10-12 years it’s worth it imo.
EA refused to throw in Osi and chose to hold on to our 2004 2nd (took Chris snee) and gave the chargers our 2005 instead
Wait or even do a slight trade up to AZ for JJ. It won't cost an arm and a leg, and they (AZ) can still secure a top WR at 6.
McCarthy's processing speed and field vision is exciting. His athleticism is RB caliber and tested better than most great backs. I think he would be a great option with Daboll.
Tom E. Curran
@tomecurran
·
1h
Expect the Patriots to take Drake Maye at number three tonight unless someone - Vikings or Giants - makes them an offer they just can’t refuse.
The Pats are clearly not good at hiding their intentions. They want their cake (extra draft picks) and want to eat it too (JJM is Kraft's guy).
Ron Wolf's kid and Mayo are clearly inexperienced and outweighed by anything Kraft says or wants. I'd make a deal with Arizona to trade up to 4 and take away all of NE's leverage; then have it announced immediately after the Foreskins pick Daniels second overall---right before the Patsies go on the clock.
After that, let the Pats sweat it out at 3. They can either take their guy---JJM---or continue to mess around and find out for ten minutes. They won't trade with anyone but the giants at that point OR just take their guy at 3. It's not gonna be Maye, otherwise there wouldn't be this much noise.
Schoen should call their bluff at that point and make them either take their guy at 3 or dare them to take Maye with the knowledge that the NYG would be content to take JJM at 4, thereby boxing out the Vikings AND neutering the Pats' silly little games. If the Pats were smart, at that point they'd negotiate a reasonable deal with the Giants to swap picks, but the NYG would have to be serious at being content with picking JJM at 4. I think they would be. Wolf Jr. and Mayo would prolly blink and make a deal with Kraft in their ears at that point that would be in the NYG's favor. Giants would get Maye at 3 and the Patsies would net JJM at 4.
Tom E. Curran
@tomecurran
·
1h
Expect the Patriots to take Drake Maye at number three tonight unless someone - Vikings or Giants - makes them an offer they just can’t refuse.
"We like Drake Maye. We love him. We are going to take him. In case someone makes an offer we can't refuse! Giants?? Vikings??"
If I could switch out the 2 or the 3 this year for one next year. If not I make that trade.
In terms of draft capital next year, keep in mind that there is a at least a fair chance the Giants might pick up at least 1 3rd round comp pick if Brown is hired elsewhere as a GM or if Kafka is hired elsewhere as a HC
Is that the Pats truly wanted Daniels 1st, that appears to not be happening. Now at 3 they seems to want JJM more than Maye..
Notice Washington isn't being rumored to be taking calls and willing to move for a huge deal.. That indicates they have their guy in mind already and are not moving from that spot..If they had Maye and Daniels equal they could troll the Pats some, trying to get a few extra picks and dropping back 1 but NOPE.. There is NO chatter about Washington moving at all..
Honestly, I go back and forth on the two guys. No one really knows. I'd be fine with either. And if one comes a lot cheaper? That seals it for me unless I have a massive grade difference on the two.
QB is the only position where I don't believe in the "take the next best guy". If you have conviction, go get him.
It's a lot, and I would love to hold on the second rounder somehow. Maybe get rid of the pick swap, just flat out give them the third, and keep the second.
also don't understand the Bill Simmons hate. Sure he's a Boston homer, but he admits it, he's also informed, entertaining and his podcasts are all good listens.
and what Eric said, I would bet that's what's going on right now. Wolfe is saying "I want this, I want that" and Joe is saying "fine, I have a deal with the Cards and I'll take whichever one you don't".
Takes ALL of NE's leverage away. Watch them blink when they are on the clock. If Schoen is successful, I'm betting the deal will look more like: our 6, 70, next year's 1 for #3 and a 3rd or 4th rd pick back this year.
and what Eric said, I would bet that's what's going on right now. Wolfe is saying "I want this, I want that" and Joe is saying "fine, I have a deal with the Cards and I'll take whichever one you don't".
Takes ALL of NE's leverage away. Watch them blink when they are on the clock. If Schoen is successful, I'm betting the deal will look more like: our 6, 70, next year's 1 for #3 and a 3rd or 4th rd pick back this year.
It could very well be a lottery pick. Especially if we include our two and three this year. I would not offer any more than our 3 this year to move up.
That said, I would much rather pick at 6 or trade down.
100% this. These are 2 high quality QB prospects that fit here. I'd give up something for the preferred one but not a "cant refuse" offer. A fair offer. Next year's 1st or 2nd + Slayton or something like that.
if the Patriots really want McCarthy, they are going to take him.
If the cost is too high here, we move to the Cardinals for Maye.
this is where I'm at. If I'm the NYG, chances are nobody is getting my 2025 1st, and it certainly won't be the Pats.
Not because they're the Pats, but I feel pretty good that we don't want the same guy, and I'm going to force them to take him right where they are.
If that goes they way I think it's going to, then maybe I have a real decision to make when Arizona is on the clock. But I still feel like I have some leverage there, as Arizona won't want to fall out of the range on those top 3 WRs.
One prediction that I have is that IF the Giants swap picks with the Cards, the price will be a good bit less than what many are projecting. To me, the one wild-card is just how crazy Minnesota is willing to get.
both in the same spot with the Maye/JJM, both have a preference but both close. NE wants to get paid to move down 1 spot and get either of the two(seems like JJM pref) and is trying to get NYG to pay up in a 3 team switch with AZ involved. Neither NE nor AZ want to deal with Min IMO and move down to 11 given he QB and WR talent at the top of this, absent a ridiculous offer from Minn which I don't see happening.
LAC is the only realistic trade partner with Minn at this point unless Minn massively overpays AZ.
So... as we've discussed ad nauseam it'll be NYG Maye/JJM at 3 from NE or 4 from AZ or Nabers, Odunez, JJM at 6 (in order of likelyhood)
as part of the trade with Arizona, does a "right to swap" 2025 first rounders form part of the compensation.
Giving up a first to move 2 picks when all signs are that Arizona doesn't want to drop down too far seems like an overpay.
Of course, "there is no overpay" when you hit on the QB, but I think you run into big trouble when you value guys on the romanticized future vision versus the current expected value of the pick including the entire distribution of outcomes. The subjective part comes into play in probability-weighting those outcomes, but you really can't price it 100% to the upside case when youre the buyer.
I'd rather pay that than ignore QB and continue the misery of our overpaid zero that we have been suffering under for years. But that would be bad negotiation.
Total guess but while I think Giants are OK with including
If the cost is too high here, we move to the Cardinals for Maye.
He's no different then most of us. Only difference is we post on an isolated fan board while he has a national soapbox
It’s simple when you apply hindsight. Isn’t any trade just that easy?
EA refused to throw in Osi and chose to hold on to our 2004 2nd (took Chris snee) and gave the chargers our 2005 instead
McCarthy's processing speed and field vision is exciting. His athleticism is RB caliber and tested better than most great backs. I think he would be a great option with Daboll.
Quote:
Simmons is insufferable. I hope the Pats suck for decades.
He's no different then most of us. Only difference is we post on an isolated fan board while he has a national soapbox
And most of BBI shouldn’t have a national show either.
So no way I make that trade.
Tell him to focus on the Celtics collapse last night
He's not exactly throwing out garbage and purporting it to be fact. He's just being a fan stating a position he has.
LOL
Tom E. Curran
@tomecurran
·
1h
Expect the Patriots to take Drake Maye at number three tonight unless someone - Vikings or Giants - makes them an offer they just can’t refuse.
Strange, since they have their pick of either guy.
Ron Wolf's kid and Mayo are clearly inexperienced and outweighed by anything Kraft says or wants. I'd make a deal with Arizona to trade up to 4 and take away all of NE's leverage; then have it announced immediately after the Foreskins pick Daniels second overall---right before the Patsies go on the clock.
After that, let the Pats sweat it out at 3. They can either take their guy---JJM---or continue to mess around and find out for ten minutes. They won't trade with anyone but the giants at that point OR just take their guy at 3. It's not gonna be Maye, otherwise there wouldn't be this much noise.
Schoen should call their bluff at that point and make them either take their guy at 3 or dare them to take Maye with the knowledge that the NYG would be content to take JJM at 4, thereby boxing out the Vikings AND neutering the Pats' silly little games. If the Pats were smart, at that point they'd negotiate a reasonable deal with the Giants to swap picks, but the NYG would have to be serious at being content with picking JJM at 4. I think they would be. Wolf Jr. and Mayo would prolly blink and make a deal with Kraft in their ears at that point that would be in the NYG's favor. Giants would get Maye at 3 and the Patsies would net JJM at 4.
LOL
Tom E. Curran
@tomecurran
·
1h
Expect the Patriots to take Drake Maye at number three tonight unless someone - Vikings or Giants - makes them an offer they just can’t refuse.
"We like Drake Maye. We love him. We are going to take him. In case someone makes an offer we can't refuse! Giants?? Vikings??"
In terms of draft capital next year, keep in mind that there is a at least a fair chance the Giants might pick up at least 1 3rd round comp pick if Brown is hired elsewhere as a GM or if Kafka is hired elsewhere as a HC
Exactly. It's obvious to everyone now what they're doing.
But that's a fuck ton to give up for a team with as many holes as the Giants. Regretfully, no.
Notice Washington isn't being rumored to be taking calls and willing to move for a huge deal.. That indicates they have their guy in mind already and are not moving from that spot..If they had Maye and Daniels equal they could troll the Pats some, trying to get a few extra picks and dropping back 1 but NOPE.. There is NO chatter about Washington moving at all..
Quote:
the Pats we are OK with McCarthy.
Truth is I am ok with McCarthy
Honestly, I go back and forth on the two guys. No one really knows. I'd be fine with either. And if one comes a lot cheaper? That seals it for me unless I have a massive grade difference on the two.
If they loved Maye, they wouldn't be doing any of this. They are practically begging at this point.
QB is the only position where I don't believe in the "take the next best guy". If you have conviction, go get him.
It's a lot, and I would love to hold on the second rounder somehow. Maybe get rid of the pick swap, just flat out give them the third, and keep the second.
If they loved Maye, they wouldn't be doing any of this. They are practically begging at this point.
Exactly, the complete opposite of what Washington is doing..
If the cost is too high here, we move to the Cardinals for Maye.
100%
Takes ALL of NE's leverage away. Watch them blink when they are on the clock. If Schoen is successful, I'm betting the deal will look more like: our 6, 70, next year's 1 for #3 and a 3rd or 4th rd pick back this year.
Takes ALL of NE's leverage away. Watch them blink when they are on the clock. If Schoen is successful, I'm betting the deal will look more like: our 6, 70, next year's 1 for #3 and a 3rd or 4th rd pick back this year.
Exactly.
That said, I would much rather pick at 6 or trade down.
100% this. These are 2 high quality QB prospects that fit here. I'd give up something for the preferred one but not a "cant refuse" offer. A fair offer. Next year's 1st or 2nd + Slayton or something like that.
If the cost is too high here, we move to the Cardinals for Maye.
this is where I'm at. If I'm the NYG, chances are nobody is getting my 2025 1st, and it certainly won't be the Pats.
Not because they're the Pats, but I feel pretty good that we don't want the same guy, and I'm going to force them to take him right where they are.
If that goes they way I think it's going to, then maybe I have a real decision to make when Arizona is on the clock. But I still feel like I have some leverage there, as Arizona won't want to fall out of the range on those top 3 WRs.
One prediction that I have is that IF the Giants swap picks with the Cards, the price will be a good bit less than what many are projecting. To me, the one wild-card is just how crazy Minnesota is willing to get.
LAC is the only realistic trade partner with Minn at this point unless Minn massively overpays AZ.
So... as we've discussed ad nauseam it'll be NYG Maye/JJM at 3 from NE or 4 from AZ or Nabers, Odunez, JJM at 6 (in order of likelyhood)
Giving up a first to move 2 picks when all signs are that Arizona doesn't want to drop down too far seems like an overpay.
Of course, "there is no overpay" when you hit on the QB, but I think you run into big trouble when you value guys on the romanticized future vision versus the current expected value of the pick including the entire distribution of outcomes. The subjective part comes into play in probability-weighting those outcomes, but you really can't price it 100% to the upside case when youre the buyer.
This. Hey Simmons, the 1986 Mets say hello!
Bill said: if NYG offered 6, 47, 70 and 2025 1st for 3 and 103, I would do it.
I believe NYG would do: 6, 70 and 2025 1st and 3rd and a player for 3 and 103.
I don't either. It's their pick. They can ask for whatever they want. We or any other team would do exactly the same with our picks.
I would not do that deal. Way too much IMO.