response a poster got from sending John Mara a letter asking to move on from Jones? Looking back, I'm not sure they were ever seriously considering trying to take a QB this year. I think they went through the motions, but there clearly wasn't any urgency.
Wish I could find the letter Mara sent.
One of the more interesting facets of the evening was the decision to pass on McCarthy.... no, he wasn't a better prospect than Nabers but the positional value.
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They spent inordinate amounts of time with all of them and tried trading up for Maye. It didn't pan out. Its temporary and has its benefits, such as not wasting a year of the rookie QB contract. Ive been saying for a few weeks I didnt think we'd see trades in the top 5, and I said I was curious as to how we really felt about McCarthy. Now we know.
One of the more interesting facets of the evening was the decision to pass on McCarthy.... no, he wasn't a better prospect than Nabers but the positional value.
I gotta be honest, I felt a little bad for the kid. Its totally possible he was posturing yesterday but he certainly seemed like he wanted the Giants.
Yep. They likely had JJM rated well below Nabers and Odunze and probably below some other guys too or they would have taken him. If he can't fix his throwing motion and improve his touch/accuracy on intermediate to deep throws then he will always be a system qb at best. I believe he could fix that and reach his ceiling, they obviously don't.
If they had full bloom conviction on Maye they would have traded whatever it took. They clearly didn't. They got an all pro caliber prospect and I don't see any qb needy teams picking ahead of us next year which is not going tobe a terrible qb draft, just average likely. I love Jaxon Dart and I like cam Ward then there's Sanders, ewers, Beck, Leonard and Will be others too.
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In comment 16489820 j_rud said:
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They spent inordinate amounts of time with all of them and tried trading up for Maye. It didn't pan out. Its temporary and has its benefits, such as not wasting a year of the rookie QB contract. Ive been saying for a few weeks I didnt think we'd see trades in the top 5, and I said I was curious as to how we really felt about McCarthy. Now we know.
One of the more interesting facets of the evening was the decision to pass on McCarthy.... no, he wasn't a better prospect than Nabers but the positional value.
I gotta be honest, I felt a little bad for the kid. Its totally possible he was posturing yesterday but he certainly seemed like he wanted the Giants.
He's close to home with one of the best situations for a qb in the league. When asked who he wanted to play for at the combine he said the Vikings. I wouldn't feel bad for him lol
Likely his throwing motion, touch and accuracy on the intermediate to deep balls. Daboll must have felt it was something that wouldn't be fixed.
And don’t forget another quote that’s been said: Sometimes spending all the time with meetings/visits with a prospect is to rule them out.
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In comment 16489825 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 16489820 j_rud said:
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They spent inordinate amounts of time with all of them and tried trading up for Maye. It didn't pan out. Its temporary and has its benefits, such as not wasting a year of the rookie QB contract. Ive been saying for a few weeks I didnt think we'd see trades in the top 5, and I said I was curious as to how we really felt about McCarthy. Now we know.
One of the more interesting facets of the evening was the decision to pass on McCarthy.... no, he wasn't a better prospect than Nabers but the positional value.
I gotta be honest, I felt a little bad for the kid. Its totally possible he was posturing yesterday but he certainly seemed like he wanted the Giants.
He's close to home with one of the best situations for a qb in the league. When asked who he wanted to play for at the combine he said the Vikings. I wouldn't feel bad for him lol
Maybe Im overstating it. It was more like "Yikes, wonder if thats embarrassing". Didnt know about the combine comments, thats really cool. I couldn't imagine getting to play for the actual team you wanted.
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They spent inordinate amounts of time with all of them and tried trading up for Maye. It didn't pan out. Its temporary and has its benefits, such as not wasting a year of the rookie QB contract. Ive been saying for a few weeks I didnt think we'd see trades in the top 5, and I said I was curious as to how we really felt about McCarthy. Now we know.
One of the more interesting facets of the evening was the decision to pass on McCarthy.... no, he wasn't a better prospect than Nabers but the positional value.
JJ was never an option. They had him way below Maye. It was all smoke.
You look at the grades. Let's take Sy's grades as an example. A 90 grade on Nabers, which is an All-Pro projection. JJM an 84 grade. Despite this, Sy said he would've gone JJM, obviously because of the positional importance. But reasonable people can disagree. Here you have two prospects you like but one has a clearly superior grade.
Nabers is one of the best prospects in the entire draft class. If the gap is big enough, you can reasonably pass on the QB for the sure thing. Doesn't mean they didn't like JJM... they did a ton of work with him, we know this from JJM himself on the Eisen pod. JJM probably went into tonight thinking there was a good chance he would be a Giant. And it's highly possible if LAC went Nabers instead of Alt, it would JJM in blue.
But with QBs, there's that level of uncertainty that's built-in. There's zero uncertainty with Nabers. He's a combination of OBJ and Tyreek Hill. He's ridiculous. He was the top receiver of several analysts I respect.
JJM might still end up being a great QB for the Vikings. Or maybe not. But what you can't change is the $70M you're paying Jones over the next two years. So next year, you can cut DJ and potentially owe him only $22M, you can really get the benefit of the rookie QB deal, and have a really good foundation for that young signal caller to enter into.
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They spent inordinate amounts of time with all of them and tried trading up for Maye. It didn't pan out. Its temporary and has its benefits, such as not wasting a year of the rookie QB contract. Ive been saying for a few weeks I didnt think we'd see trades in the top 5, and I said I was curious as to how we really felt about McCarthy. Now we know.
Yep. They likely had JJM rated well below Nabers and Odunze and probably below some other guys too or they would have taken him. If he can't fix his throwing motion and improve his touch/accuracy on intermediate to deep throws then he will always be a system qb at best. I believe he could fix that and reach his ceiling, they obviously don't.
If they had full bloom conviction on Maye they would have traded whatever it took. They clearly didn't. They got an all pro caliber prospect and I don't see any qb needy teams picking ahead of us next year which is not going tobe a terrible qb draft, just average likely. I love Jaxon Dart and I like cam Ward then there's Sanders, ewers, Beck, Leonard and Will be others too.
Get ready b/c Dart is it going to put up stupid numbers this year and climb way up draft boards. Book it.
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In comment 16489820 j_rud said:
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They spent inordinate amounts of time with all of them and tried trading up for Maye. It didn't pan out. Its temporary and has its benefits, such as not wasting a year of the rookie QB contract. Ive been saying for a few weeks I didnt think we'd see trades in the top 5, and I said I was curious as to how we really felt about McCarthy. Now we know.
Yep. They likely had JJM rated well below Nabers and Odunze and probably below some other guys too or they would have taken him. If he can't fix his throwing motion and improve his touch/accuracy on intermediate to deep throws then he will always be a system qb at best. I believe he could fix that and reach his ceiling, they obviously don't.
If they had full bloom conviction on Maye they would have traded whatever it took. They clearly didn't. They got an all pro caliber prospect and I don't see any qb needy teams picking ahead of us next year which is not going tobe a terrible qb draft, just average likely. I love Jaxon Dart and I like cam Ward then there's Sanders, ewers, Beck, Leonard and Will be others too.
Get ready b/c Dart is it going to put up stupid numbers this year and climb way up draft boards. Book it.
Agreed, kid is a stud. I'd put money on him being qb1. Seattle, PIT, NO, LV, TB, DAL, LAR, maybe 1 other qb needy team next year. I see us picking far ahead of all of them. Could be a good year to get a QB like Dart. He's the guy I'll be hoping for.
You look at the grades. Let's take Sy's grades as an example. A 90 grade on Nabers, which is an All-Pro projection. JJM an 84 grade. Despite this, Sy said he would've gone JJM, obviously because of the positional importance. But reasonable people can disagree. Here you have two prospects you like but one has a clearly superior grade.
Nabers is one of the best prospects in the entire draft class. If the gap is big enough, you can reasonably pass on the QB for the sure thing. Doesn't mean they didn't like JJM... they did a ton of work with him, we know this from JJM himself on the Eisen pod. JJM probably went into tonight thinking there was a good chance he would be a Giant. And it's highly possible if LAC went Nabers instead of Alt, it would JJM in blue.
But with QBs, there's that level of uncertainty that's built-in. There's zero uncertainty with Nabers. He's a combination of OBJ and Tyreek Hill. He's ridiculous. He was the top receiver of several analysts I respect.
JJM might still end up being a great QB for the Vikings. Or maybe not. But what you can't change is the $70M you're paying Jones over the next two years. So next year, you can cut DJ and potentially owe him only $22M, you can really get the benefit of the rookie QB deal, and have a really good foundation for that young signal caller to enter into.
I don't agree. GiantGrit, Woodstock and Rico were right. JJ was a smokescreen and I doubt Schoen had a first round grade on QBs 4-6.
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In comment 16489820 j_rud said:
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They spent inordinate amounts of time with all of them and tried trading up for Maye. It didn't pan out. Its temporary and has its benefits, such as not wasting a year of the rookie QB contract. Ive been saying for a few weeks I didnt think we'd see trades in the top 5, and I said I was curious as to how we really felt about McCarthy. Now we know.
One of the more interesting facets of the evening was the decision to pass on McCarthy.... no, he wasn't a better prospect than Nabers but the positional value.
JJ was never an option. They had him way below Maye. It was all smoke.
Agreed, you were right. We will see if they were right.
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In comment 16489840 j_rud said:
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In comment 16489825 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 16489820 j_rud said:
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They spent inordinate amounts of time with all of them and tried trading up for Maye. It didn't pan out. Its temporary and has its benefits, such as not wasting a year of the rookie QB contract. Ive been saying for a few weeks I didnt think we'd see trades in the top 5, and I said I was curious as to how we really felt about McCarthy. Now we know.
One of the more interesting facets of the evening was the decision to pass on McCarthy.... no, he wasn't a better prospect than Nabers but the positional value.
I gotta be honest, I felt a little bad for the kid. Its totally possible he was posturing yesterday but he certainly seemed like he wanted the Giants.
He's close to home with one of the best situations for a qb in the league. When asked who he wanted to play for at the combine he said the Vikings. I wouldn't feel bad for him lol
Maybe Im overstating it. It was more like "Yikes, wonder if thats embarrassing". Didnt know about the combine comments, thats really cool. I couldn't imagine getting to play for the actual team you wanted.
Yeah, he is thrilled.
are we going to revisit the grading scale?
The only one that maybe should have had the grade to take him at 6 was JJM. Penix & Nix shouldn't have been first rounders. Let alone top 12 guys. There are so many red flags on both of them.
These teams could all be wrong but it's hardly the case that Falcons were alone in their judgment about Penix.
If Jones had suffered a career-ending injury in 2023 and was out of the picture, of course the Giants would have considered the other QB options in a different light.
It's not realistic to believe that grading, and resulting decisions, happen in the abstract.
The drafting of Jones himself in 2019 is evidence of that.
Gettleman is one reason the Giants only had six picks this year, no RB, injury-prone average QB, and oodles of cash spent on OL.
On the other hand, desperate for picks, Joe S trades a second and a ton of cash for a good pass rusher (averages 8 sacks a year); does not trade down to refill the draft pick coffers; spends his second year spending a ton of dough on the OL.
Honestly, I’m not sure. However, it will be interesting to see if the Giants pick 5th or 6th again, how much longer this GM keeps his job.
I am agnostic on DJ, tbh. But the current regime had every chance to move on and didn’t for a reason. Locke is in for insurance, but these other guys could bust as well as hit. We have plenty of holes to fill. O don’t get why people think Schoen would change his whole year long evaluation based on a small sample last year.
The exercise of pretending to be interested in other QBs was partly a show for the Patriots' benefit and partly for the benefit of the NYG fanbase (We tried!).
Vacchiano's reporting suggests that ownership would not have approved targeting anyone except the top three. Whether Schoen had any genuine interest in other options that was thwarted by this position will never be known.