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Sy's reviews of D.J. Davidson and Jordon Riley

Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 2:06 pm
Week 1

Jordon Riley had a TFL on an impressive play usually reserved for Lawrence. I continue to be impressed with his play at his size.

Week 2

D.J .Davidson was active in place of Jordon Riley, which I like because these two will be competing for snaps all season and that will bring the best out them respectively. He added one tackle.

Week 3

D.J. Davidson got the look over rookie Jordon Riley again, and he showed why. On just 19 snaps (9 run / 10 pass) he finished with a half-sack, 2 pressures, and a pass break up at the line. He was injured on a dirty play by Jake Brendel, a play he should be fined for. Davidson was pushing the interior SF linemen around every time he got on the field. The injury to the elbow appeared to be fairly serious.

Week 4

Davidson was the overlooked stud of the game. On just 19 snaps, he finished with a TFL and 2 pass break ups. His feel for the play and sheer power were difference makers.

Week 5

The backups A’Shawn Robinson, D.J. Davidson, and Rakeem Nunez-Roches are cut from similar cloths. Big and strong, but slow and ineffective in space. None of them came in and made an impact. The latter did have one pressure early in the game.

Week 6

The backup trio Rakeem Nunez-Roches, A’Shawn Robinson, and rookie Jordon Riley saw limited snaps and we did not see much other than assists from any of them.

Week 7

N/A

Week 8

Rakeem Nunez-Roches and D.J. Davidson both played under 10 snaps and did not move the needle in either direction.

Week 9

N/A

Week 10

I thought D.J. Davidson flashed late in the game where his snaps saw an uptick. He had 2 pressures and 2 tackles. He has shown a knack for getting to the passer via a strong bull rush.

Week 11

Rakeem Nunez-Roches and D.J. Davidson spelled Robinson a lot through the second half. The former had a pressure and a tackle and the latter added one tackle.

Week 12

D.J. Davidson and Jordon Riley rotated in, and while they struggled to get off blocks in the passing game, I thought their stoutness against the run was solid. Where they currently struggle is shedding the blocks and making plays on the ball carrier. Riley missed two tackles.

Week 13

Rakeem Nunez-Roches added 2 tackles while backups D.J. Davidson and Jordon Riley saw a few snaps. Davidson was flagged for a false start early and missed a tackle, while Riley made a nice run stop where he showed good stack-and-shed with an explosive finish.

Week 14

The Jordon Riley vs. DJ Davidson “battle” (if you will) is interesting to watch. They fill the same role and give similar results, but the route in which they get there is very different. Riley looked better in this matchup, finishing with 2 tackles away from the starting point. He shows better movement traits and just-as heavy contact as Davidson.

Week 15

Good to see Jordon Riley on the field for a season-high 35 snaps. His previous high was about half of that. He had a tackle near the line of scrimmage where he looked like a the rookie version of Lawrence. I don’t want to get ahead of ourselves with this evaluation, but the way he abused All-Pro Center Jason Kelce on the play is something we see happen to Kelce maybe a handful of times in an entire season. Heavy hands, fast bench press, excellent pad level, dense presence, and a strong finish. These flashes are very encouraging for the future of the defensive line.

-D.J. Davidson added two tackles in relief and newcomer Timmy Horne (from ATL) got his feet wet with 7 snaps. I wouldn’t mind seeing some more of him, the initial look was promising.

Week 16

D.J. Davidson and Jordon Riley played uneventful snaps (about a dozen each) in back-up roles.

Week 17

D.J. Davidson and Jordon Riley played a handful of snaps in spot duty once again, not really making much of an impact. Riley has no variety to his pass rush plans.
Would Riley be a good fit playing alongside Dex in the base defense?  
BlackLight : 5/6/2024 2:31 pm : link
I seem to recall he was slotted as a nose tackle and Dex's backup on the depth chart last season, but I don't know if the distinctions actually matter.
RE: Would Riley be a good fit playing alongside Dex in the base defense?  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 2:32 pm : link
In comment 16507622 BlackLight said:
Quote:
I seem to recall he was slotted as a nose tackle and Dex's backup on the depth chart last season, but I don't know if the distinctions actually matter.


Who plays where is one of the things I'm dying to know.

Heck, Dottino thinks Boogie Basham might play DT.
BTW  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 2:48 pm : link
the Jordan Phillips signing from the Bills could go in either direction. Bills fans absolutely adored the guy. However, his last few years (both in Arizona and his second stint with Buffalo) have been marred by injury. He even talked about retiring after the season was over.

That said, the guy is a big dude and he's a great locker room presence.
RE: RE: Would Riley be a good fit playing alongside Dex in the base defense?  
Klaatu : 5/6/2024 3:00 pm : link
In comment 16507624 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 16507622 BlackLight said:


Quote:


I seem to recall he was slotted as a nose tackle and Dex's backup on the depth chart last season, but I don't know if the distinctions actually matter.



Who plays where is one of the things I'm dying to know.


Me too.
These guys showed great potential last year…..  
Simms11 : 5/6/2024 3:05 pm : link
and with another year of Patterson’s tutelage, they cold become solid contributors. Riley really impressed me for a very late round pick and unheralded, as well. Some scout should get a bonus digging him up.
I really Like Riley  
Rjanyg : 5/6/2024 3:14 pm : link
He was really good in the preseason and I thought he would have seen more time.

Looking forward to seeing him this year.
RE: These guys showed great potential last year…..  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 3:15 pm : link
In comment 16507663 Simms11 said:
Quote:
and with another year of Patterson’s tutelage, they cold become solid contributors. Riley really impressed me for a very late round pick and unheralded, as well. Some scout should get a bonus digging him up.


What intrigues me is that Patterson had a lot of nice things to say about him.
one example  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 3:19 pm : link
...
“You had a good game playing against the best Center in the league” - ( New Window )
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 3:21 pm : link

Talkin’ Giants

@TalkinGiants
Giants DL Coach Andre Patterson on Jordon Riley growing despite being inactive

Compares it to Danielle Hunter not playing his 1st 5 games in Minnesota
https://twitter.com/TalkinGiants/status/1708194724362735824 - ( New Window )
RE: Would Riley be a good fit playing alongside Dex in the base defense?  
Angel Eyes : 5/6/2024 3:22 pm : link
In comment 16507622 BlackLight said:
Quote:
I seem to recall he was slotted as a nose tackle and Dex's backup on the depth chart last season, but I don't know if the distinctions actually matter.

The distinctions matter on some level. For example, Dex shouldn't play outside where a constant refrain, particularly in 2021, was that he was playing out of position as a defensive end.
the basic problem  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 3:26 pm : link
the Giants have right now is they have a number of big body run stuffers. They need someone who is able to pressure the QB. Jordan Phillips has done that in the past (his 2019 season with 9.5 sacks and 16 QB hits), but that was a long time ago. And he's nearing the end and probably has to have his snaps really managed.

Pass rushing DT is one of those positions that will likely have to wait until next offseason.
dark horses  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 3:27 pm : link
would be Ryder Anderson and possibly Boogie Basham.
Consistency is really the key  
gersh : 5/6/2024 3:35 pm : link
Reading some of those reviews, we would be assure to have our starter next to Dex
Other reviews....not so much
that dirty play on dj davidson vs SF was total horseshit  
Eric on Li : 5/6/2024 3:36 pm : link
im still shocked that guy didnt get fined/suspended. if that wasnt intent to injure im not sure what is. if it was a DL to a QB after the whistle there would have been an ejection.
RE: dark horses  
Eric on Li : 5/6/2024 3:37 pm : link
In comment 16507687 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
would be Ryder Anderson and possibly Boogie Basham.


basham as a lighter down pass rusher is interesting. bowen had success with players like him in TEN (autry being the main one).
What they are doing at DT  
Sy'56 : 5/6/2024 3:41 pm : link
is a major mystery to me.

Passing on DTs the entire draft (some good ones, too) tells me they have a plan with the current guys. I fear there won't be enough pass rush depth.
RE: What they are doing at DT  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 3:43 pm : link
In comment 16507705 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
is a major mystery to me.

Passing on DTs the entire draft (some good ones, too) tells me they have a plan with the current guys. I fear there won't be enough pass rush depth.


I do wonder what they would have done had Newton somehow slipped to them at #47.
Going into the draft I wanted a 3 technique but  
edavisiii : 5/6/2024 3:45 pm : link
You can't fill all the holes in one draft! As Sy just said depth is a problem if injuries creep in.
these  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 3:47 pm : link
are the DTs who went in round two before the NYG pick...

Ruke Orhorhoro
Johnny Newton
T'Vondre Sweat
Braden Fiske
RE: What they are doing at DT  
Eric on Li : 5/6/2024 3:49 pm : link
In comment 16507705 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
is a major mystery to me.

Passing on DTs the entire draft (some good ones, too) tells me they have a plan with the current guys. I fear there won't be enough pass rush depth.


im with you - i'm not so worried about pass rush though because they can always kick pass rushers inside, but just athleticism and movement.

your comment in the game reviews matches what i saw - they had a lot of big space eaters without the mobility to make plays too far from their starting point.

what they dont seem to have is that highly active DT who can make plays across the formation (like LW).

if i were running their draft i think id have gone day 2 or 3 with jenkins or dorlus.
these are the DTs  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 3:49 pm : link
who went before their 3rd round pick

Maason Smith
Kris Jenkins
Michael Hall Jr.
RE: these  
Eric on Li : 5/6/2024 3:52 pm : link
In comment 16507713 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
are the DTs who went in round two before the NYG pick...

Ruke Orhorhoro
Johnny Newton
T'Vondre Sweat
Braden Fiske


Maason Smith went 1 pick after Nubin Jenkins went 2 picks later. Dorlus went 2 picks after Theo Johnson.

All of those prospects had flaws enough that i can kind of understand picking a player they liked better (Nubin) and thinking Horne/Basham if viewed as draft prospects may not be so different in the boxes they check (not to mention Riley/DJD/Anderson).
Hall was supposedly off a lot of boards for character flags  
Eric on Li : 5/6/2024 3:53 pm : link
Sy would know better on that.
Eric on Li  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 3:56 pm : link
I'm a huge fan of Newton. I think the Commanders got a steal where they got him early in the second round (we really didn't have a chance to get him there).

The question really is a guy like Smith or Jenkins better than Nubin? Some people were really down on this safety class and said a safety never should have gone in round 2. Others said they felt Nubin was a late 1st round value.

We shall see. I do think Bowen's defense needs both types of players. Safety is big in his defense and Nubin has the leadership skills to hold together the entire secondary (I really think he will be a coach and fan favorite). But I also think Bowen needs that 3-technique.
RE: these  
Four Aces : 5/6/2024 4:00 pm : link
In comment 16507713 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
are the DTs who went in round two before the NYG pick...

Ruke Orhorhoro
Johnny Newton
T'Vondre Sweat
Braden Fiske

I suspect Fiske would have been a Giant. He’s exactly what we needed at DE.
Four Aces  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/6/2024 4:09 pm : link
I do wonder about that (and the other DTs who went right before us). Only thing I'll say is two went right after us, and Schoen seemed pretty giddy after Day 2 was over. Was he putting on a good face? Perhaps, but I didn't get that sense.

(Also, watch the war room camera interaction between Daboll and Bowen at the 5:45 mark).
New York Giants Draft Picks - 2024 NFL Draft (Malik Nabers, Tyler Nubin & More!!!) - ( New Window )
RE: Eric on Li  
Eric on Li : 5/6/2024 4:10 pm : link
In comment 16507731 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I'm a huge fan of Newton. I think the Commanders got a steal where they got him early in the second round (we really didn't have a chance to get him there).

The question really is a guy like Smith or Jenkins better than Nubin? Some people were really down on this safety class and said a safety never should have gone in round 2. Others said they felt Nubin was a late 1st round value.

We shall see. I do think Bowen's defense needs both types of players. Safety is big in his defense and Nubin has the leadership skills to hold together the entire secondary (I really think he will be a coach and fan favorite). But I also think Bowen needs that 3-technique.


I liked Jenkins a lot. There were knocks on how many plays he made but he tested great. I think he can clearly hold up at the POA but also had athleticism where someone like Patterson could unlock him, especially in a different system than Harboughs. I think he was a safer pick than Nubin, at a more premium position. I'd have picked him and just signed Micah Hyde or whichever veteran they like best for S.

I liked Newton too but i think he fell because of injury concerns and when that's the case i try to not get too over my skiis bc the nfl is usually pretty smart when name brand players fall due to medical (not unlike when we "stole" Ojulari). Broken feet on 300lb'ers are not faint of heart injuries.
The Giants definitely were excited to get their #1 safety.  
Four Aces : 5/6/2024 4:18 pm : link
I guess I didn’t see safety as a greater need than a 3-4 DE to adequately
replace Leo or Ashawn. But Fiske appears to be some player. I’ll have to look at Sy’s ratings of Fiske and Nubin to compare. I would have preferred Fiske personally because I have more faith in Pinnock, Belton, Owens, Mills, etc.

So maybe the calculation for the Giants was always safety/CB or CB/safety in rounds 2 and 3. And DE/DT wasn’t high on their list of priorities. They may have more faith in Riley, Davidson, Horne, Boogie, etc than we do.
I think in general  
GiantTuff1 : 5/6/2024 4:33 pm : link
it’s not as sexy to simply replace a player at the same position (e.g. Nubin for McKinney) since it feels like net no gain. Versus getting a player at a position that is generally weak and your strengthening it, the WR room for example. I feel similarly about the rookie TE in effect offsetting Waller. It’s probably a good pick but it doesn’t feel like you gained anything because of the recent loss.
Just reread Sy’s summary for Fiske…  
Four Aces : 5/6/2024 4:38 pm : link
I think it’s very accurate. I’ll stick to Fiske being the pick if he was there. To me, he seemed like the perfect pick on our line.

“ *Now this is a name to keep an eye on for the Giants pick at #47. One of my favorite guys to watch in the entire class. Fiske broke out in a big way down the stretch, but don’t mistake this for a one-shot wonder. He was a pro prospect coming into 2023 and everyone wanted a piece of him in the transfer portal. This might be one of the best five athletes we have ever seen at DT in combine history. His energy is contagious and whoever drafts him will have a new coach/fan favorite. There is some hot/cold to his game and it may keep him in a rotational role. But he will make an impact player. Ideal fit for NYG.”
Once the DTs they were targeting were gone, they went Nubin who was  
Four Aces : 5/6/2024 4:39 pm : link
too good to pass up.
RE: What they are doing at DT  
BillT : 5/6/2024 4:58 pm : link
In comment 16507705 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
is a major mystery to me.

Passing on DTs the entire draft (some good ones, too) tells me they have a plan with the current guys. I fear there won't be enough pass rush depth.

I chalk it up to “you can’t fix everything”. They filled holes all over the roster. RB, TE, S, CB, OL, WR in the draft or with FA. There is a limit.
Recognizing a need at the position is one thing  
Ten Ton Hammer : 5/6/2024 6:46 pm : link
if you don't think what's available is worth taking and you don't believe in the player then why would you take that player?

Also, a mid/late-round rookie DT is not something that's actually going to address frontline needs. The responsibility falls on the non-rookies like Davidson (a draft pick) and Riley, a developmental guy, to take the next step and claim a role.
Has Waller made up his mind?  
George from PA : 5/6/2024 7:02 pm : link
His cap saving would add flexibility to add a couple of more players.

I like what they did at Edge, WR,TE, OL, RB, LB and safety...even the addition of Lock was an upgrade.

Rhey mught have enough at DT and corner, but another vet would be nice
RE: Hall was supposedly off a lot of boards for character flags  
Sy'56 : 5/7/2024 3:49 am : link
In comment 16507724 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
Sy would know better on that.


Hall Jr had locker room issues - not off field concerns. Just more of a "me" guy that would turn some effort off and on - by no means a guy that ends up on the news though.
By pure production  
RetroJint : 5/7/2024 6:43 am : link
Hall went two rounds too early. He has a stamina problem. It’s one of the reasons why his snap counte were so low.

I don’t see Riley or Davidson . Just because you’re big doesn’t mean you’re a run stopper. If they were why did teams run through them like an expressway when they were on the field ? Riley made a couple high visibility plays because somebody forgot to block him .

The Giants will still be looking for DT depth . Hey it’s not easy to do . That said I see these guys as third-team depth . Nothing more .
RE: BTW  
Ivan15 : 5/7/2024 9:04 am : link
In comment 16507640 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
the Jordan Phillips signing from the Bills could go in either direction. Bills fans absolutely adored the guy. However, his last few years (both in Arizona and his second stint with Buffalo) have been marred by injury. He even talked about retiring after the season was over.

That said, the guy is a big dude and he's a great locker room presence.
_________________
I thought that was a good signing until I realized how old and how big he is. Over 30 and big guys fall off the cliff quickly. May be a year or two too late for him. Maybe if he is just a space eater at backup nose tackle, he can contribute but I thought that was Nachos role.
I really like Davidson & Riley ....  
Manny in CA : 5/7/2024 2:40 pm : link

Agree, Davidson is more the guy you want at the Nose, he a brute fireplug. Riley is more interesting, as massive as he is he gets skinny and pushes his way to the backfield.

The Eagles' Kelce was the master of getting lower than any other lineman in the league, then lifting the opponent off the ground. I've seen him do that to Dex.

Riley, by nature is very crafty and knows how to avoid getting tangled up like that. When second rate lineman want to stand up and wrestle him, he throws them around like rag dolls. If he keeps working and listens to coach Andre', we could see him at the Pro Bowl very soon.

RE: By pure production  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/7/2024 2:53 pm : link
In comment 16508374 RetroJint said:
Quote:
Hall went two rounds too early. He has a stamina problem. It’s one of the reasons why his snap counte were so low.

I don’t see Riley or Davidson . Just because you’re big doesn’t mean you’re a run stopper. If they were why did teams run through them like an expressway when they were on the field ? Riley made a couple high visibility plays because somebody forgot to block him .

The Giants will still be looking for DT depth . Hey it’s not easy to do . That said I see these guys as third-team depth . Nothing more .


But teams didn't run through them. Where are you getting that?
RE: By pure production  
Ten Ton Hammer : 5/7/2024 4:41 pm : link
In comment 16508374 RetroJint said:
Quote:
Hall went two rounds too early. He has a stamina problem. It’s one of the reasons why his snap counte were so low.

I don’t see Riley or Davidson . Just because you’re big doesn’t mean you’re a run stopper. If they were why did teams run through them like an expressway when they were on the field ? Riley made a couple high visibility plays because somebody forgot to block him .

The Giants will still be looking for DT depth . Hey it’s not easy to do . That said I see these guys as third-team depth . Nothing more .


Dexter Lawrence took 3 years to show out. He was a 2 sack a year guy before he took a leap.

There needs to be a little more patience with these guys who aren't first round picks.
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