It’s a fucking fan site where people voice their opinions!!! My opinion is that Jones sucks. I honestly have no fucking clue what Dabs’ really thinks about Jones because I’m not in his head, nor are you.
Are you this stupid?
My goodness SF; the Giants, with no doubt a huge input from Daboll, have chosen to stick with Jones and by all accounts are going to give him every chance to succeed this fall. Obviously they don't think he sucks.
And I don't think anybody has any problem with people voicing their opinion. You like a decision or you disagree with it and move on. The Giants have made their decision as to how they want to proceed at the position this year and everyone is free to agree or disagree. But the decision has been made and the team is moving on. What is bizarre is having fans arguing until they are blue in the face 'but what has Jones ever done?' and 'how many chances does a guy get' etc etc etc to the point that a lot of them sound like they'll be cheering against the Giants this year so what they maybe get a shot at a better QB next year. I'm cheering for the Giants to do well with Jones this year and keep building to get to where we want to get. If Jones flops or has another injury then you move on, but hoping that something like that happens is bizarre.
The Daniel Jones NYG QB discussion topic is officially the proverbial dead horse. There will be no new material here. Next season or any season beyond that will not reveal anything about Jones we don't already know. Our best case scenario here is stays healthy and plays decent. That is our pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. However, it is so much more likely that he is ineffective or hurts his neck again (or something else).
WTF? Where did I state I know more about QBs than Dabs? I obviously don’t.
I just think Jones sucks. Tar and feather me if you so desire.
This is what all the apologists do. Its an appeal to authority to support a point they can't argue any other way. The brightest people made the decision so if you criticize it, you must believe you are smarter than them.
It is a cop out when you don't have a lucid point to make.
WTF? Where did I state I know more about QBs than Dabs? I obviously don’t.
I just think Jones sucks. Tar and feather me if you so desire.
This is what all the apologists do. Its an appeal to authority to support a point they can't argue any other way. The brightest people made the decision so if you criticize it, you must believe you are smarter than them.
It is a cop out when you don't have a lucid point to make.
So whom am I going to believe here Mike. Some guy howling at the moon in a bar or some highly respected football people. Let me think on it for awhile!
I am not asking you to believe me over Brian Daboll. I think you know that, right? I am expressing my opinion on Daniel Jones based on watching him play football for the last 6 seasons. If you choose to believe that Daboll thinks Jones is a really good QB because Daboll coaches the Giants and Jones is his QB, than believe away.
Very knowledgeable NFL people with decades of experience draft players who bust all the time. They start guys who play poorly. It doesn't mean they are idiots, it means they are not infallible.
Brian Daboll didn't create Josh Allen in his basement. Daboll certainly had a big part in his development into a superstar. Does that mean every QB he touches will become Josh Allen? Look at all the jobs he held in the past as QB coach or offensive coordinator and point out the other guys he turned into great QBs.
Daboll knows more about QB than me. We also don't know his opinion about Daniel Jones, and we do know he is not infallible.
But if it helps you to continuously oversimplify things to support your opinion, let it rip!
I'll speak for all of us who have been arguing and fighting about Daniel Jones since the day he was drafted.
You can report back to Bob and Carl that without one iota of doubt everyone one of us hopes the Giants have a 19-0 record in 2024 and Daniel Jones is the MVP of the regular season and the Super Bowl. But anyone who thinks that Daniel Jones has shown he can be a Super Bowl winning QB is dealing in alternate facts.
This is a Giants internet fan board. We’re not on the payroll. The Giants have been a dysfunctional mess for over a decade. They are back to being the same laughing stock and league doormat they were when the fan base sold out Giants Stadium over and over and over in the 1970s no matter how bad the team got. For the record Tim J Mara should be in the Giants Ring of Honor. He is the person who pushed the Giants front office out of the 1950’s and pushed his uncle out of the way which changed everything until his uncle’s kids took over in 2012.
My first games as a Giants fan were in Yankee Stadium watching Lombardi's Packers and Landry's Cowboys humiliate the Giants the way Jerry Jones Cowboys do now. 89-14. Are you kidding me?
WTF? Where did I state I know more about QBs than Dabs? I obviously don’t.
I just think Jones sucks. Tar and feather me if you so desire.
This is what all the apologists do. Its an appeal to authority to support a point they can't argue any other way. The brightest people made the decision so if you criticize it, you must believe you are smarter than them.
It is a cop out when you don't have a lucid point to make.
So whom am I going to believe here Mike. Some guy howling at the moon in a bar or some highly respected football people. Let me think on it for awhile!
People said the same thing about Gettleman and he was an unmitigated disaster
RE: RE: RE: It's amazing how a franchise can lose its way
The scary possibility is that this is the way they've always been run, and the successes they've enjoyed have been the result of external influence (Rozelle forcing George Young on them) and luck, and not some larger policy or plan.
This is what I love about the BBI. Some yahoo comes on spouting some kind of criticism based on something he clearly knows fuck all about. George Young wasn't forced on anybody and he certainly wasn't forced on anybody by their record in the 1970s. The Giants were trying to find a full-time GM but had a 50-50 ownership split between two parties that hated each other. Anybody Wellington suggested Tim rejected out of hand and the only people Tim suggested were people that he knew Wellington would not accept. So Rozelle suggested GY as a compromise. There have even been reports that Wellington actually asked Rozelle to suggest Young because if Well did Tim would turn him down too.
And other than the fact that the organization has won four Super Bowls, more than 27 of the other 31 teams in the league, it truly is one fucked up team. And 18 games without a playoff win. The humiliation!
The only one mentioning that Welly wanted George Young was Welly.
The "anybody Wellington suggested that Tim objected to" was some former reporter and drinking buddy of Welly's. Tim blew a gasket and wanted to be bought out. He threatened to sue. That's when Rozelle got involved and imposed order. The Giants got Young who would not have come if he had to put up with Wellington's interference or the feuding Maras. He got absolute 100% control over football operations and a 5 year contract, Rozelle imposed a gag and a 100% hands-off-football- operations order on Wellington under threat of suspension if he interfered and Tim was told to shut up about lawsuits. That's how the Giants got George Young instead of one of his uncle's former players or drinking buddies in charge.
So, was Young forced on Wellington? No. Did Rozelle keep Wellington away from football operations under threat of suspension. Yes. Don't think for a minute it was voluntary. Did Rozelle provide guarantees to Young? Yes
But don't worry nostalgia buffs, Wellington's son is back and fucking up the franchise just like his old man. A chip off the old block.
WTF? Where did I state I know more about QBs than Dabs? I obviously don’t.
I just think Jones sucks. Tar and feather me if you so desire.
This is what all the apologists do. Its an appeal to authority to support a point they can't argue any other way. The brightest people made the decision so if you criticize it, you must believe you are smarter than them.
It is a cop out when you don't have a lucid point to make.
So whom am I going to believe here Mike. Some guy howling at the moon in a bar or some highly respected football people. Let me think on it for awhile!
snablats, you probably said this same thing last year when they extended Jones--how's that working out for you?
On a larger point, I find this shit from Papa and Banks annoying AF. For them to judge people as ‘goofy’ or not real fans because they have the temerity to go after Jones as a QB or the organization at large…like seriously fuck off. There are definitely people in that building seemingly more concerned with attacking the fans for justifiably being pissed at the past decade than actually winning.
is perfectly happy to publicly shit on any player they don't think is performing. But not sweet little Daniel and his $100 million. Leave Daniel Alone.
No one, repeat no one can get anything out of this guy
Whats more likely- every single coach we have hired for 5 years has been absolutely terrible or the Giants are forcing these coaches to put a round peg in a square hole?
No matter what system he has played in, who has coached him and who has played with him and at what level he has played it. He simply hasnt done anything but lose games, throw 200 yds or less a game, throw 1 TD per game and 6.8 ypa
You telling me Joe Judge and Pat Shurmer were great coaches? And the, what? 4 Offensive Coordinators were really actually some of the best but DJ was holding the team back? gtfo. This is the most ridiculous take I've read yet. Banks is right.
You are absolutely embarrassing yourself on this thread. Was Shimer a good HEAD COACH? Hell no. But the man could run an offense and was known to be very good with QBs. Yet here you are proclaiming that Daniel Jones has had nothing but ALL bad coaches, bad teammates, bad weapons, bad OL, bad defenses, on and on and on. And it’s never once dawned on you dumb, ignorant Pom Pom wavers that maybe, just maybe Daniel Jones plays a part in some of those endless failed coaches and players. Nope. THEY’VE all failed HIM!
He's just parroting Mara...'We've done everything possible to screw this kid up.'
As if Jones should be absolved for everything. No other Giant that I can remember has gotten this treatment. It's truly remarkable. But hey, we'll start our 1-4 this fall, Jones will suck, & the excuses will come out again.
Someone above mentioned BBI as the place self-awareness goes to die. A thread that started out essentially as a criticism of a commentary that the place has become rather toxic with its incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes devolves into a series of incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes!! Well done guys!!
will sleep happily on his big pile of money regardless of who attacks him or defends him on line.
Then he'll wake up and get to work on time. And we'll get a press release about how amazing it is that he gets to work on time every day and how nobody is more dedicated to their craft because he also went to the gym.
Someone above mentioned BBI as the place self-awareness goes to die. A thread that started out essentially as a criticism of a commentary that the place has become rather toxic with its incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes devolves into a series of incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes!! Well done guys!!
The thread's premise was Banks & Papa-two shills-lecturing fans for how they should feel about Jones. I'm so fucking sick of it.
'We're in goofy land right now.'-Carl Bank. Like fuck off Carl.
Someone above mentioned BBI as the place self-awareness goes to die. A thread that started out essentially as a criticism of a commentary that the place has become rather toxic with its incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes devolves into a series of incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes!! Well done guys!!
The thread's premise was Banks & Papa-two shills-lecturing fans for how they should feel about Jones. I'm so fucking sick of it.
'We're in goofy land right now.'-Carl Bank. Like fuck off Carl.
They are shills because they don't agree with you on Daniel Jones?
Yes. They're fucking shills because they constantly parrot the Giants talking point when it comes to Jones & no one else. Papa & Banks-neither who'll be confused with Summerall & Madden-just trot out the party line. It's fucking annoying.
But what I find more insulting is their disdain for fans who dare criticize the Giants or Jones. Like fuck off Bob & Carl...maybe if we haven't sucked the last decade, people wouldn't be so mad.
Someone above mentioned BBI as the place self-awareness goes to die. A thread that started out essentially as a criticism of a commentary that the place has become rather toxic with its incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes devolves into a series of incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes!! Well done guys!!
The thread's premise was Banks & Papa-two shills-lecturing fans for how they should feel about Jones. I'm so fucking sick of it.
'We're in goofy land right now.'-Carl Bank. Like fuck off Carl.
They are shills because they don't agree with you on Daniel Jones?
The franchise play by play guy and a ring of honor legend are wasting time telling fans what to think and how to act while this team has been 3rd and 4th place for 10 years.
I'm @ my fucking wits end with this shit. Carl & Papa giving shit to fans who have the audacity to point out Jones isn't a good ? & then ? their fanhood..
'They have made it their life's work to shit on Daniel Jones'-Carl Bank.
No Carl, no one is shitting on Daniel Jones. They're just pointing out that he's not a good QB & want a better one.
But we're 'goofy' per Carl. Seriously Carl, fuck off.
I'm @ my fucking wits end with this shit. Carl & Papa giving shit to fans who have the audacity to point out Jones isn't a good ? & then ? their fanhood..
'They have made it their life's work to shit on Daniel Jones'-Carl Bank.
No Carl, no one is shitting on Daniel Jones. They're just pointing out that he's not a good QB & want a better one.
But we're 'goofy' per Carl. Seriously Carl, fuck off.
Ya think you might be getting a bit to wound up over this?😁😁😁
He's just parroting Mara...'We've done everything possible to screw this kid up.'
As if Jones should be absolved for everything. No other Giant that I can remember has gotten this treatment. It's truly remarkable. But hey, we'll start our 1-4 this fall, Jones will suck, & the excuses will come out again.
New York Giants football...FEEL THE EXCITEMENT!
Of course the excuses will continue. I mean, they already have the “Jones was coming off a severe injury and it usually takes 2 years to get back to normal” all locked and loaded. And Mara will agree with them and there we are, on to year 7…
He's just parroting Mara...'We've done everything possible to screw this kid up.'
As if Jones should be absolved for everything. No other Giant that I can remember has gotten this treatment. It's truly remarkable. But hey, we'll start our 1-4 this fall, Jones will suck, & the excuses will come out again.
New York Giants football...FEEL THE EXCITEMENT!
Of course the excuses will continue. I mean, they already have the “Jones was coming off a severe injury and it usually takes 2 years to get back to normal” all locked and loaded. And Mara will agree with them and there we are, on to year 7…
I wonder how Mara felt trying to draft his replacement
Papa & Banks basically telling Giants fans to be content because we have been better than Washington and that Dallas hasn't won a Super Bowl . And The Eagles have lost 2 Super Bowls along the way
The team won 2 Super Bowls over a decade ago do everyone should be happy with that until apparently someone in our division tops it.
I just can’t do another season of Jones. He lost me for good in the Seahawks game.
DJHC = Seattle game
DJFC = Minnesota playoff victory
Ive got about 50 other starts from Jones if you would like?
Lets start with his last one vs the Raiders
Or his lone prime time win vs Washington where a playoff spot was basically on the line and Jones unloaded for a 160 yds passing and 35 yds rushing and directing our offense to an inspired 12 pts. (We fortunately got an epic game from Kayvon who had a sack, FF, FR and TD on a singular play)
Or his amazing historic 2 TD to 5 Ints start in 2020 - you probably thought i was gonna say 2023 but no he also did it in 2020- to open the year where he had a 4 game no TD streak! He conpiled a whopping 840 yds 0 TDs 3 INTs in 4 losses before the leaves fell in October
If ever there was proof of what Banks was saying its this thread! Banks wasn't criticizing fans for criticizing the team or even Daniel Jones. He was commenting on the over-the-top incessant, repetitive, vitriolic, bitter, angry almost spiteful verbal abuse directed at Jones coming from so-called fans of the team combined with the over-the-top incessant, repetitive, vitriolic, bitter, angry almost spiteful verbal abuse directed at anyone who has the temerity to question some of the premise or data they are quoting coming from the same people who call themselves fans but come across as bitter angry old men.
I just can’t do another season of Jones. He lost me for good in the Seahawks game.
DJHC = Seattle game
DJFC = Minnesota playoff victory
Ive got about 50 other starts from Jones if you would like?
Lets start with his last one vs the Raiders
Or his lone prime time win vs Washington where a playoff spot was basically on the line and Jones unloaded for a 160 yds passing and 35 yds rushing and directing our offense to an inspired 12 pts. (We fortunately got an epic game from Kayvon who had a sack, FF, FR and TD on a singular play)
Or his amazing historic 2 TD to 5 Ints start in 2020 - you probably thought i was gonna say 2023 but no he also did it in 2020- to open the year where he had a 4 game no TD streak! He conpiled a whopping 840 yds 0 TDs 3 INTs in 4 losses before the leaves fell in October
I mean theres a ton more if you want them
No need to share your life’s work sweetheart. We get it.
If ever there was proof of what Banks was saying its this thread! Banks wasn't criticizing fans for criticizing the team or even Daniel Jones. He was commenting on the over-the-top incessant, repetitive, vitriolic, bitter, angry almost spiteful verbal abuse directed at Jones coming from so-called fans of the team combined with the over-the-top incessant, repetitive, vitriolic, bitter, angry almost spiteful verbal abuse directed at anyone who has the temerity to question some of the premise or data they are quoting coming from the same people who call themselves fans but come across as bitter angry old men.
This ^^ ... and just a reminder, there's just one person who is THE key to resolving this DJ debate: DJ.
So regardless of your personal point of view, you might as well just stfu, relax, and let camp and the season unfold. But I do hope each side here has a designated Secretary tracking all the threads and comments that can be dredged up and excoriated when DJ does whatever it is he's going to be enabled to do this season. (Oh wait, maybe not ...)
1. Notice how other players don't get the same treatment as Jones? Why doesn't Evan Neal get any of the benefit of the doubt? Even Schoen said he needed to play better. Yet Jones gets a list of excuses. It's unfair to the rest of the players on the team.
2. There is no doubt to me once Jones is off the team the same people defending him now will be quick to blame him.
I will bite---Neal is still being called the starter as of now and Neal didn't play well in 2022. Jones did play well in 2022. He was one of the best rushing QBs in the league and played well in 9-10 games helping them win 9-10 games. Neal didn't help anyone that year. Yet he's still got a starting job.
Not to mention QBs need more helpful factors around them than the RT needs.
Also, QB and RT not quite the same entity when it comes to PR. But who cares. Both guys need to play well in 24 and contrary to popular belief I think Jones would be done here if he struggled this coming season. Which is all that matters.
people hang on 19-21 too much in regards to Jones. Yes those years happened but Schoen and Daboll care more about 2022 and 2023, than 2021, you can believe that.
HE's had one good year under this regime and one bad year. 24 is a big season for DJ. It's a big year for a lot of players.
RE: RE: RE: Their podcast has become a platform for bashing the fans
and defending Jones. But some of those fans that they are bashing, are their listeners! That’s not a formula for success.
Maybe if those fans they are "bashing" would calm down for a second and listen, they would understand that they are not saying anything but the truth. Jones may not be the guy long term but he is the guy right now. Shitting on him is destructive behavior. Rooting against him is the same as rooting against your team. I've said this a million times. It's a cowards way out. You're afraid to be let down again so you embrace losing and blame DJ because it's the easy thing to do. There is logic to what the so-called DJFC has been saying all along. The ONLY argument against Jones that is based on fact is that he has been injured a lot. Other than that, we have NO clue what Jones can be with a true #1 and an OL that can block.
Wait a minute...stating your opinion that Daniel Jones sucks and you want the Giants to get rid of him makes you a coward?
Those people are afraid of being let down? We've already been let down by this team for the past decade and our first round pick who can't play QB at a league average level.
I would argue the exact opposite. Refusing to acknowledge reality and cheering blindly into an echo chamber of everyone telling you everything is ok is cowardly.
No being a defeatist prick makes you a coward. RIGHT NOW Daniel Jones is the starting QB od the NY Football Giants. It's a new season. New pieces in place. Jones has had some pretty shitty circumstances to play in. The haters like to pretend he can't throw for more than 3 feet. The riders like to think he's an amazing QB and it's everyone else's fault. The rational thinkers actually acknowledge that we don't really know shit about DJ because he's had all of his starters on the field with him for, like, an hour over 6 seasons and no OL to speak of. So the reality is, we have no idea what he is or what he isn't. Only what he hasn't been ablel to do yet. This COULD be a great season. But there are "fans" that want DJ to fail. They want to be right. Anyone hoping this kid fails is a damn coward and I stick to that. You can think he sucks. But being unable to root for your team because you are afraid of being let down means you are letting fear control you. That is the definition of coward. If this doesn't apply to you, don't get your panties stuck up your ass.
If we should be listening to the players in the locker room, what does it say that Thibodeaux publicly questioned Jones being paid before Barkley (who the GM let walk) and our top draft pick said we still had to figure out the quarterback position?
We can take two things for this:
1.) Saquon Barkley was 100% the most talented and gifted athlete on our team and when DJ had been successful, Barkley was a major part of it (since it certainly wasn't the OL or the receivers). So to pay DJ before Barkely was bad enough. to pay him INSTEAD of Barkley was a complete head scratcher. Thibs was not wrong, but I don't think his intent was to say Jones didn't deserve to get paid. Just that Barkley should have been a priority. I'm not floundering or backpedaling. I've said this numerous times. I like DJ and I'd like to see him succeed with the right pieces in place and if he doesn't? move on. But I was always a FAN of Barkley. Gonna be hard watching him as an Eagle twice a year.
2.) Malik's statement had some context. He's also not wrong. Even if we can't agree on DJ's potential, I think we can ALL agree that the Giants actually DO need to figure out what they are doing at QB. Do they believe in DJ? Do they WANT to move on? Was Lock brought in to challenge DJ as the starter or is he purely a backup? Is DJ ready to go or will there be some additional time needed when the season starts? Malik is a kid that is going to speak his mind. He's not a QB coach. He's not a scout. Until Malik starts catching passes from Jones, he's not going to be able to tell anyone anything meaningful about how talented or skilled Jones is as an athlete or a leader. SO I fully took his comment as a truthful evaluation of the state of the Giants offense at the time of that interview. Not an indictment of Jone's level of QB play.
If ever there was proof of what Banks was saying its this thread! Banks wasn't criticizing fans for criticizing the team or even Daniel Jones. He was commenting on the over-the-top incessant, repetitive, vitriolic, bitter, angry almost spiteful verbal abuse directed at Jones coming from so-called fans of the team combined with the over-the-top incessant, repetitive, vitriolic, bitter, angry almost spiteful verbal abuse directed at anyone who has the temerity to question some of the premise or data they are quoting coming from the same people who call themselves fans but come across as bitter angry old men.
Can you please cite one of these spiteful vitriolic verbal abuse comments on this thread aimed at Daniel Jones?
Ill give you an example of what I mean.
Carl Banks saying those Giants fans who criticize Jones are just gamblers who lost money betting on the Giants
was dumb on many levels, not the least of which is that it raised expectations to a point that he's not capable of living up to. But, in football the QB gets too much credit when things go well and too much blame when they don't. Add in that Jones has had an awful OL every year and a really bad receiving corps every year, which made it nearly impossible for him to succeed, and it's clear that his lack of success isn't all on him. He's not a terrible player. He could have a very good year this year. He's not the long-term answer for the NYG at QB, they can and should look for a better QB. But the amount of derision being heaped on him is over the top; and Banks and Papa were right about that.
THIS ^^^^ Reading BBI is a discouraging pursuit lately. Yes the team has been bad, but the vitriol here is way beyond any semblance of constructive criticism.
RE: RE: Jones is not an elite QB. Picking him at 6
was dumb on many levels, not the least of which is that it raised expectations to a point that he's not capable of living up to. But, in football the QB gets too much credit when things go well and too much blame when they don't. Add in that Jones has had an awful OL every year and a really bad receiving corps every year, which made it nearly impossible for him to succeed, and it's clear that his lack of success isn't all on him. He's not a terrible player. He could have a very good year this year. He's not the long-term answer for the NYG at QB, they can and should look for a better QB. But the amount of derision being heaped on him is over the top; and Banks and Papa were right about that.
THIS ^^^^ Reading BBI is a discouraging pursuit lately. Yes the team has been bad, but the vitriol here is way beyond any semblance of constructive criticism.
Jones is a very bad QB. Please refer to his 2023 where he put up last in the league QB starter stats. Sorry, good QBs don't get outplayed by Tommy DeVito.
RE: RE: RE: Jones is not an elite QB. Picking him at 6
was dumb on many levels, not the least of which is that it raised expectations to a point that he's not capable of living up to. But, in football the QB gets too much credit when things go well and too much blame when they don't. Add in that Jones has had an awful OL every year and a really bad receiving corps every year, which made it nearly impossible for him to succeed, and it's clear that his lack of success isn't all on him. He's not a terrible player. He could have a very good year this year. He's not the long-term answer for the NYG at QB, they can and should look for a better QB. But the amount of derision being heaped on him is over the top; and Banks and Papa were right about that.
THIS ^^^^ Reading BBI is a discouraging pursuit lately. Yes the team has been bad, but the vitriol here is way beyond any semblance of constructive criticism.
Jones is a very bad QB. Please refer to his 2023 where he put up last in the league QB starter stats. Sorry, good QBs don't get outplayed by Tommy DeVito.
It's like you simply don't understand anything that you read.
Your post here fails to address his point, in fact, it illustrates it.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Jones is not an elite QB. Picking him at 6
Jones is a very bad QB. Please refer to his 2023 where he put up last in the league QB starter stats. Sorry, good QBs don't get outplayed by Tommy DeVito.
It's like you simply don't understand anything that you read.
Your post here fails to address his point, in fact, it illustrates it.
I think you have the reading comprehension problem. I am responding directly to the comment that Jones isn't a terrible player.
In fact there is overwhelming data to suggest he is terrible. He couldn't outplay Tommy DeVito for chrissakes. This eval is at the core of the dispute. But please, continue to snarkily miss the point.
That was a sea of dumb comments. Nobody is rooting for Daniel Jones to fail...they are expecting it. And they are expecting it not because they hate him, hate the Giants, or hate sunshine and rainbows. They expect him to fail because it is what he has done for most games he has been the starting QB for the NYG.
Stop pretending that Daniel Jones is some unknown commodity that nobody has yet seen film on. He has started over 60 NFL games! There is plenty of evidence of what Daniel Jones is and isn't. You wanting to say "2022 is evidence he is really good" and "everything else is no evidence at all" speaks to your bias, not your analytical abilities.
Are you this stupid?
My goodness SF; the Giants, with no doubt a huge input from Daboll, have chosen to stick with Jones and by all accounts are going to give him every chance to succeed this fall. Obviously they don't think he sucks.
And I don't think anybody has any problem with people voicing their opinion. You like a decision or you disagree with it and move on. The Giants have made their decision as to how they want to proceed at the position this year and everyone is free to agree or disagree. But the decision has been made and the team is moving on. What is bizarre is having fans arguing until they are blue in the face 'but what has Jones ever done?' and 'how many chances does a guy get' etc etc etc to the point that a lot of them sound like they'll be cheering against the Giants this year so what they maybe get a shot at a better QB next year. I'm cheering for the Giants to do well with Jones this year and keep building to get to where we want to get. If Jones flops or has another injury then you move on, but hoping that something like that happens is bizarre.
The Daniel Jones NYG QB discussion topic is officially the proverbial dead horse. There will be no new material here. Next season or any season beyond that will not reveal anything about Jones we don't already know. Our best case scenario here is stays healthy and plays decent. That is our pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. However, it is so much more likely that he is ineffective or hurts his neck again (or something else).
And if pretending that something shitty is great makes you a good fan, then a good fan is not something I'm interested in being.
The Giants are serving the fans garbage.
I just think Jones sucks. Tar and feather me if you so desire.
This is what all the apologists do. Its an appeal to authority to support a point they can't argue any other way. The brightest people made the decision so if you criticize it, you must believe you are smarter than them.
It is a cop out when you don't have a lucid point to make.
Quote:
WTF? Where did I state I know more about QBs than Dabs? I obviously don’t.
I just think Jones sucks. Tar and feather me if you so desire.
This is what all the apologists do. Its an appeal to authority to support a point they can't argue any other way. The brightest people made the decision so if you criticize it, you must believe you are smarter than them.
It is a cop out when you don't have a lucid point to make.
So whom am I going to believe here Mike. Some guy howling at the moon in a bar or some highly respected football people. Let me think on it for awhile!
I am not asking you to believe me over Brian Daboll. I think you know that, right? I am expressing my opinion on Daniel Jones based on watching him play football for the last 6 seasons. If you choose to believe that Daboll thinks Jones is a really good QB because Daboll coaches the Giants and Jones is his QB, than believe away.
Very knowledgeable NFL people with decades of experience draft players who bust all the time. They start guys who play poorly. It doesn't mean they are idiots, it means they are not infallible.
Brian Daboll didn't create Josh Allen in his basement. Daboll certainly had a big part in his development into a superstar. Does that mean every QB he touches will become Josh Allen? Look at all the jobs he held in the past as QB coach or offensive coordinator and point out the other guys he turned into great QBs.
Daboll knows more about QB than me. We also don't know his opinion about Daniel Jones, and we do know he is not infallible.
But if it helps you to continuously oversimplify things to support your opinion, let it rip!
You can report back to Bob and Carl that without one iota of doubt everyone one of us hopes the Giants have a 19-0 record in 2024 and Daniel Jones is the MVP of the regular season and the Super Bowl. But anyone who thinks that Daniel Jones has shown he can be a Super Bowl winning QB is dealing in alternate facts.
This is a Giants internet fan board. We’re not on the payroll. The Giants have been a dysfunctional mess for over a decade. They are back to being the same laughing stock and league doormat they were when the fan base sold out Giants Stadium over and over and over in the 1970s no matter how bad the team got. For the record Tim J Mara should be in the Giants Ring of Honor. He is the person who pushed the Giants front office out of the 1950’s and pushed his uncle out of the way which changed everything until his uncle’s kids took over in 2012.
My first games as a Giants fan were in Yankee Stadium watching Lombardi's Packers and Landry's Cowboys humiliate the Giants the way Jerry Jones Cowboys do now. 89-14. Are you kidding me?
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In comment 16521426 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
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WTF? Where did I state I know more about QBs than Dabs? I obviously don’t.
I just think Jones sucks. Tar and feather me if you so desire.
This is what all the apologists do. Its an appeal to authority to support a point they can't argue any other way. The brightest people made the decision so if you criticize it, you must believe you are smarter than them.
It is a cop out when you don't have a lucid point to make.
So whom am I going to believe here Mike. Some guy howling at the moon in a bar or some highly respected football people. Let me think on it for awhile!
People said the same thing about Gettleman and he was an unmitigated disaster
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The scary possibility is that this is the way they've always been run, and the successes they've enjoyed have been the result of external influence (Rozelle forcing George Young on them) and luck, and not some larger policy or plan.
This is what I love about the BBI. Some yahoo comes on spouting some kind of criticism based on something he clearly knows fuck all about. George Young wasn't forced on anybody and he certainly wasn't forced on anybody by their record in the 1970s. The Giants were trying to find a full-time GM but had a 50-50 ownership split between two parties that hated each other. Anybody Wellington suggested Tim rejected out of hand and the only people Tim suggested were people that he knew Wellington would not accept. So Rozelle suggested GY as a compromise. There have even been reports that Wellington actually asked Rozelle to suggest Young because if Well did Tim would turn him down too.
And other than the fact that the organization has won four Super Bowls, more than 27 of the other 31 teams in the league, it truly is one fucked up team. And 18 games without a playoff win. The humiliation!
The "anybody Wellington suggested that Tim objected to" was some former reporter and drinking buddy of Welly's. Tim blew a gasket and wanted to be bought out. He threatened to sue. That's when Rozelle got involved and imposed order. The Giants got Young who would not have come if he had to put up with Wellington's interference or the feuding Maras. He got absolute 100% control over football operations and a 5 year contract, Rozelle imposed a gag and a 100% hands-off-football- operations order on Wellington under threat of suspension if he interfered and Tim was told to shut up about lawsuits. That's how the Giants got George Young instead of one of his uncle's former players or drinking buddies in charge.
So, was Young forced on Wellington? No. Did Rozelle keep Wellington away from football operations under threat of suspension. Yes. Don't think for a minute it was voluntary. Did Rozelle provide guarantees to Young? Yes
But don't worry nostalgia buffs, Wellington's son is back and fucking up the franchise just like his old man. A chip off the old block.
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Aaaaaaand The usual suspects bombing the thread again. Surprise surprise.... lol
So the only legitimate opinions on Jones are fulsome praise, then. Good to know.
Right Greg! That's exactly what I said.
Or NOT lol
That’s a weird take.
It's a dumb take.
Incidentally, Carl Banks has no problem torching defensive players who don't perform. Why does he have white cotton gloves for Jones?
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In comment 16521426 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
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WTF? Where did I state I know more about QBs than Dabs? I obviously don’t.
I just think Jones sucks. Tar and feather me if you so desire.
This is what all the apologists do. Its an appeal to authority to support a point they can't argue any other way. The brightest people made the decision so if you criticize it, you must believe you are smarter than them.
It is a cop out when you don't have a lucid point to make.
So whom am I going to believe here Mike. Some guy howling at the moon in a bar or some highly respected football people. Let me think on it for awhile!
snablats, you probably said this same thing last year when they extended Jones--how's that working out for you?
Fucking shills.
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So because Banks was a great player, one can’t question his analysis on Jones?
That’s a weird take.
It's a dumb take.
Incidentally, Carl Banks has no problem torching defensive players who don't perform. Why does he have white cotton gloves for Jones?
I find the same shit with Neal. Let’s torch Evan-and he hasn’t been good-but don’t dare say anything negative about Jones. Fucking hypocrites.
Every other fan base in the league is literally laughing at us that we’re still riding with Jones. That’s why we are a laughingstock.
Don't tell me what I can and cannot see
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Not argument in favor if Jones
No one, repeat no one can get anything out of this guy
Whats more likely- every single coach we have hired for 5 years has been absolutely terrible or the Giants are forcing these coaches to put a round peg in a square hole?
No matter what system he has played in, who has coached him and who has played with him and at what level he has played it. He simply hasnt done anything but lose games, throw 200 yds or less a game, throw 1 TD per game and 6.8 ypa
You telling me Joe Judge and Pat Shurmer were great coaches? And the, what? 4 Offensive Coordinators were really actually some of the best but DJ was holding the team back? gtfo. This is the most ridiculous take I've read yet. Banks is right.
You are absolutely embarrassing yourself on this thread. Was Shimer a good HEAD COACH? Hell no. But the man could run an offense and was known to be very good with QBs. Yet here you are proclaiming that Daniel Jones has had nothing but ALL bad coaches, bad teammates, bad weapons, bad OL, bad defenses, on and on and on. And it’s never once dawned on you dumb, ignorant Pom Pom wavers that maybe, just maybe Daniel Jones plays a part in some of those endless failed coaches and players. Nope. THEY’VE all failed HIM!
Wake the fuck up!!!!! This is unbelievable
As if Jones should be absolved for everything. No other Giant that I can remember has gotten this treatment. It's truly remarkable. But hey, we'll start our 1-4 this fall, Jones will suck, & the excuses will come out again.
New York Giants football...FEEL THE EXCITEMENT!
Then he'll wake up and get to work on time. And we'll get a press release about how amazing it is that he gets to work on time every day and how nobody is more dedicated to their craft because he also went to the gym.
The thread's premise was Banks & Papa-two shills-lecturing fans for how they should feel about Jones. I'm so fucking sick of it.
'We're in goofy land right now.'-Carl Bank. Like fuck off Carl.
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Someone above mentioned BBI as the place self-awareness goes to die. A thread that started out essentially as a criticism of a commentary that the place has become rather toxic with its incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes devolves into a series of incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes!! Well done guys!!
The thread's premise was Banks & Papa-two shills-lecturing fans for how they should feel about Jones. I'm so fucking sick of it.
'We're in goofy land right now.'-Carl Bank. Like fuck off Carl.
They are shills because they don't agree with you on Daniel Jones?
But what I find more insulting is their disdain for fans who dare criticize the Giants or Jones. Like fuck off Bob & Carl...maybe if we haven't sucked the last decade, people wouldn't be so mad.
I hope Papa & Carl can be reasonable. I doubt it.
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In comment 16521685 Snorkels said:
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Someone above mentioned BBI as the place self-awareness goes to die. A thread that started out essentially as a criticism of a commentary that the place has become rather toxic with its incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes devolves into a series of incessant, repetitive, vitriolic anti-Jones diatribes!! Well done guys!!
The thread's premise was Banks & Papa-two shills-lecturing fans for how they should feel about Jones. I'm so fucking sick of it.
'We're in goofy land right now.'-Carl Bank. Like fuck off Carl.
They are shills because they don't agree with you on Daniel Jones?
The franchise play by play guy and a ring of honor legend are wasting time telling fans what to think and how to act while this team has been 3rd and 4th place for 10 years.
'They have made it their life's work to shit on Daniel Jones'-Carl Bank.
No Carl, no one is shitting on Daniel Jones. They're just pointing out that he's not a good QB & want a better one.
But we're 'goofy' per Carl. Seriously Carl, fuck off.
'They have made it their life's work to shit on Daniel Jones'-Carl Bank.
No Carl, no one is shitting on Daniel Jones. They're just pointing out that he's not a good QB & want a better one.
But we're 'goofy' per Carl. Seriously Carl, fuck off.
Ya think you might be getting a bit to wound up over this?😁😁😁
I
As if Jones should be absolved for everything. No other Giant that I can remember has gotten this treatment. It's truly remarkable. But hey, we'll start our 1-4 this fall, Jones will suck, & the excuses will come out again.
New York Giants football...FEEL THE EXCITEMENT!
Of course the excuses will continue. I mean, they already have the “Jones was coming off a severe injury and it usually takes 2 years to get back to normal” all locked and loaded. And Mara will agree with them and there we are, on to year 7…
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He's just parroting Mara...'We've done everything possible to screw this kid up.'
As if Jones should be absolved for everything. No other Giant that I can remember has gotten this treatment. It's truly remarkable. But hey, we'll start our 1-4 this fall, Jones will suck, & the excuses will come out again.
New York Giants football...FEEL THE EXCITEMENT!
Of course the excuses will continue. I mean, they already have the “Jones was coming off a severe injury and it usually takes 2 years to get back to normal” all locked and loaded. And Mara will agree with them and there we are, on to year 7…
I wonder how Mara felt trying to draft his replacement
One more year
Despite what some of the pinheads say here
They wouldn’t have tried to get Maye if they didn’t want an upgrade
DJHC = Seattle game
DJFC = Minnesota playoff victory
The team won 2 Super Bowls over a decade ago do everyone should be happy with that until apparently someone in our division tops it.
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I just can’t do another season of Jones. He lost me for good in the Seahawks game.
DJHC = Seattle game
DJFC = Minnesota playoff victory
Ive got about 50 other starts from Jones if you would like?
Lets start with his last one vs the Raiders
Or his lone prime time win vs Washington where a playoff spot was basically on the line and Jones unloaded for a 160 yds passing and 35 yds rushing and directing our offense to an inspired 12 pts. (We fortunately got an epic game from Kayvon who had a sack, FF, FR and TD on a singular play)
Or his amazing historic 2 TD to 5 Ints start in 2020 - you probably thought i was gonna say 2023 but no he also did it in 2020- to open the year where he had a 4 game no TD streak! He conpiled a whopping 840 yds 0 TDs 3 INTs in 4 losses before the leaves fell in October
I mean theres a ton more if you want them
And if pretending that something shitty is great makes you a good fan, then a good fan is not something I'm interested in being.
The Giants are serving the fans garbage.
Does the bold text above relate to the notion that fans are partly responsible for the state of the team?
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In comment 16521771 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
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I just can’t do another season of Jones. He lost me for good in the Seahawks game.
DJHC = Seattle game
DJFC = Minnesota playoff victory
Ive got about 50 other starts from Jones if you would like?
Lets start with his last one vs the Raiders
Or his lone prime time win vs Washington where a playoff spot was basically on the line and Jones unloaded for a 160 yds passing and 35 yds rushing and directing our offense to an inspired 12 pts. (We fortunately got an epic game from Kayvon who had a sack, FF, FR and TD on a singular play)
Or his amazing historic 2 TD to 5 Ints start in 2020 - you probably thought i was gonna say 2023 but no he also did it in 2020- to open the year where he had a 4 game no TD streak! He conpiled a whopping 840 yds 0 TDs 3 INTs in 4 losses before the leaves fell in October
I mean theres a ton more if you want them
No need to share your life’s work sweetheart. We get it.
This ^^ ... and just a reminder, there's just one person who is THE key to resolving this DJ debate: DJ.
So regardless of your personal point of view, you might as well just stfu, relax, and let camp and the season unfold. But I do hope each side here has a designated Secretary tracking all the threads and comments that can be dredged up and excoriated when DJ does whatever it is he's going to be enabled to do this season. (Oh wait, maybe not ...)
2. There is no doubt to me once Jones is off the team the same people defending him now will be quick to blame him.
I will bite---Neal is still being called the starter as of now and Neal didn't play well in 2022. Jones did play well in 2022. He was one of the best rushing QBs in the league and played well in 9-10 games helping them win 9-10 games. Neal didn't help anyone that year. Yet he's still got a starting job.
Not to mention QBs need more helpful factors around them than the RT needs.
Also, QB and RT not quite the same entity when it comes to PR. But who cares. Both guys need to play well in 24 and contrary to popular belief I think Jones would be done here if he struggled this coming season. Which is all that matters.
HE's had one good year under this regime and one bad year. 24 is a big season for DJ. It's a big year for a lot of players.
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In comment 16520993 JohnB said:
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and defending Jones. But some of those fans that they are bashing, are their listeners! That’s not a formula for success.
Maybe if those fans they are "bashing" would calm down for a second and listen, they would understand that they are not saying anything but the truth. Jones may not be the guy long term but he is the guy right now. Shitting on him is destructive behavior. Rooting against him is the same as rooting against your team. I've said this a million times. It's a cowards way out. You're afraid to be let down again so you embrace losing and blame DJ because it's the easy thing to do. There is logic to what the so-called DJFC has been saying all along. The ONLY argument against Jones that is based on fact is that he has been injured a lot. Other than that, we have NO clue what Jones can be with a true #1 and an OL that can block.
Wait a minute...stating your opinion that Daniel Jones sucks and you want the Giants to get rid of him makes you a coward?
Those people are afraid of being let down? We've already been let down by this team for the past decade and our first round pick who can't play QB at a league average level.
I would argue the exact opposite. Refusing to acknowledge reality and cheering blindly into an echo chamber of everyone telling you everything is ok is cowardly.
1.) Saquon Barkley was 100% the most talented and gifted athlete on our team and when DJ had been successful, Barkley was a major part of it (since it certainly wasn't the OL or the receivers). So to pay DJ before Barkely was bad enough. to pay him INSTEAD of Barkley was a complete head scratcher. Thibs was not wrong, but I don't think his intent was to say Jones didn't deserve to get paid. Just that Barkley should have been a priority. I'm not floundering or backpedaling. I've said this numerous times. I like DJ and I'd like to see him succeed with the right pieces in place and if he doesn't? move on. But I was always a FAN of Barkley. Gonna be hard watching him as an Eagle twice a year.
2.) Malik's statement had some context. He's also not wrong. Even if we can't agree on DJ's potential, I think we can ALL agree that the Giants actually DO need to figure out what they are doing at QB. Do they believe in DJ? Do they WANT to move on? Was Lock brought in to challenge DJ as the starter or is he purely a backup? Is DJ ready to go or will there be some additional time needed when the season starts? Malik is a kid that is going to speak his mind. He's not a QB coach. He's not a scout. Until Malik starts catching passes from Jones, he's not going to be able to tell anyone anything meaningful about how talented or skilled Jones is as an athlete or a leader. SO I fully took his comment as a truthful evaluation of the state of the Giants offense at the time of that interview. Not an indictment of Jone's level of QB play.
Can you please cite one of these spiteful vitriolic verbal abuse comments on this thread aimed at Daniel Jones?
Ill give you an example of what I mean.
Carl Banks saying those Giants fans who criticize Jones are just gamblers who lost money betting on the Giants
THIS ^^^^ Reading BBI is a discouraging pursuit lately. Yes the team has been bad, but the vitriol here is way beyond any semblance of constructive criticism.
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was dumb on many levels, not the least of which is that it raised expectations to a point that he's not capable of living up to. But, in football the QB gets too much credit when things go well and too much blame when they don't. Add in that Jones has had an awful OL every year and a really bad receiving corps every year, which made it nearly impossible for him to succeed, and it's clear that his lack of success isn't all on him. He's not a terrible player. He could have a very good year this year. He's not the long-term answer for the NYG at QB, they can and should look for a better QB. But the amount of derision being heaped on him is over the top; and Banks and Papa were right about that.
THIS ^^^^ Reading BBI is a discouraging pursuit lately. Yes the team has been bad, but the vitriol here is way beyond any semblance of constructive criticism.
Jones is a very bad QB. Please refer to his 2023 where he put up last in the league QB starter stats. Sorry, good QBs don't get outplayed by Tommy DeVito.
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In comment 16521056 NBGblue said:
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was dumb on many levels, not the least of which is that it raised expectations to a point that he's not capable of living up to. But, in football the QB gets too much credit when things go well and too much blame when they don't. Add in that Jones has had an awful OL every year and a really bad receiving corps every year, which made it nearly impossible for him to succeed, and it's clear that his lack of success isn't all on him. He's not a terrible player. He could have a very good year this year. He's not the long-term answer for the NYG at QB, they can and should look for a better QB. But the amount of derision being heaped on him is over the top; and Banks and Papa were right about that.
THIS ^^^^ Reading BBI is a discouraging pursuit lately. Yes the team has been bad, but the vitriol here is way beyond any semblance of constructive criticism.
Jones is a very bad QB. Please refer to his 2023 where he put up last in the league QB starter stats. Sorry, good QBs don't get outplayed by Tommy DeVito.
Your post here fails to address his point, in fact, it illustrates it.
Jones is a very bad QB. Please refer to his 2023 where he put up last in the league QB starter stats. Sorry, good QBs don't get outplayed by Tommy DeVito.
It's like you simply don't understand anything that you read.
Your post here fails to address his point, in fact, it illustrates it.
I think you have the reading comprehension problem. I am responding directly to the comment that Jones isn't a terrible player.
In fact there is overwhelming data to suggest he is terrible. He couldn't outplay Tommy DeVito for chrissakes. This eval is at the core of the dispute. But please, continue to snarkily miss the point.
Stop pretending that Daniel Jones is some unknown commodity that nobody has yet seen film on. He has started over 60 NFL games! There is plenty of evidence of what Daniel Jones is and isn't. You wanting to say "2022 is evidence he is really good" and "everything else is no evidence at all" speaks to your bias, not your analytical abilities.