They fucking got 6 last year with a banged up Tyrod Taylor and Tommy DeVito. The Mike - you've complimented Daboll in the past yet you think 5 wins is the ceiling? They got more than 5 last year. You seem knowledgeable, but you lean way too much into hyperbolic territory at times.
If they did bottom out to 3 wins, it's an easy offseason to fire everyone from Schoen to to his support staff down to Daboll and cutting Jones.
7-10 which is more likely will be a much more complicated decision.
I’ve maintained 4-6 wins so this kind of falls into line
To predict a 5 win team. In the last 2 seasons under Schoen and Daboll this team went 15-18-1. Daniel Jones is 10-11-1. Last year we won 6 games. Barkley missed 3 games, Waller missed 5 games, Andrew Thomas missed 7 games, Evan Neal 10 games. Devito as an undrafted rookie started 6 games.
This team has talented players that can make plays. We have seen teams in the past where we had absolutely no one on a top level or barely even had starting caliber players. It was easy to see a 5 win team. This is not that team despite what some may claim.
I agree with this. I think 7-10 / 8-9 is a realistic season assuming health. If I had to bet the 6.5 total, I'd bet the over because of Daboll.
That's not to say going 7-10 or 8-9 is good. It might actually be the worst outcome if it means running in all back in 2025. But, I think that's the most likely scenario. I think Daboll is a strong head coach who has some personality concerns.
Daboll will have the team competing. Ultimately the QB play will put a ceiling on anything significant, but I see 7 wins about. The talk of 3 or 4 wins doesn't make much sense.
If the argument is what's the different between 3 and 7, they are both shitty seasons? I agree with that. I just don't see this as a top 3 pick in the NFL draft bad team.
the key players stay healthy. Our studs must be studs and our young guys with potential must develop into studs and stay healthy. It is a lot to expect but I can't see us being that bad again. The first six quarters of last year were the worst I've seen to start a season ever. Ever.
now that the league is taking away B gap runs seems highly unlikely. 7-8 wins seems the high end point. But I think the roster overall is much more talented than most think. I think this team is a QB away from being a very good team. It sucks that a QB is the hardest thing to get.
RE: RE: So they must assume Jones starts all 17 games
To predict a 5 win team. In the last 2 seasons under Schoen and Daboll this team went 15-18-1. Daniel Jones is 10-11-1. Last year we won 6 games. Barkley missed 3 games, Waller missed 5 games, Andrew Thomas missed 7 games, Evan Neal 10 games. Devito as an undrafted rookie started 6 games.
This team has talented players that can make plays. We have seen teams in the past where we had absolutely no one on a top level or barely even had starting caliber players. It was easy to see a 5 win team. This is not that team despite what some may claim.
We've seen too many off seasons where they've brought in guys, even new coaches, and declared the offensive line "fixed" only to see it get even worse, so the Giants pretty much have to prove it on the field at this point.
Whatever you think of Jones, he's coming off of an ACL and he's a running QB.
The defensive line has Dexter Lawrence ... and bodies.
And finally ... the schedule is brutal.
I hope the team wins more, and I hope our young players mature so the team can compete, but on paper, this team isn't there yet.
It's a young and talented team that will get better as the season progresses. If the injury gods are good to us, I expect 10 to 12 wins.
No offense, but 10-12 wins? Please explain.
I think that is loco.
Milton absolutely loves him some Daniel Jones.
I’ll leave it to you to figure out what that means for his football acumen…
10-12 wins is a loooooong stretch. We've hit double digit wins twice in the last 15 years with some arguably better teams. It is possible but is it probable? Not to me. To me if we get anywhere close to .500, that would be an achievement, but 5 - 7 wins is more likely and I don't see DJ still upright at the end of the year if he starts week 1.
Unless the Giants win the Super Bowl, and following the logic of some BBI posters, wouldn't any number of wins be 'meaningless'? From the perspective of some, the best situation for the Giants would be to lose every game so that they lock up the #1 draft pick. Might as well lose all games the following year too, so that they get the #1 pick again.
Unless the Giants win the Super Bowl, and following the logic of some BBI posters, wouldn't any number of wins be 'meaningless'? From the perspective of some, the best situation for the Giants would be to lose every game so that they lock up the #1 draft pick. Might as well lose all games the following year too, so that they get the #1 pick again.
Yes! Get your QB the first year. Trade the pick the next year to set the team up for the next several years.
I seriously doubt we lose more games than last year. But I’m tired of trying to convince anyone. Just drop the smugness if/when proven wrong.
So it’s “smug” to think that a team that has sucked for over a decade will suck again? That’s an interesting way of looking at it. So what to we call those that blindly believe the team will be good? I’m guessing you have a cute, cuddly description for their (your) opinion? I’ll give you one “ignorant”. I could come up with a bunch of those type names but I don’t get offended by those with different opinions as you seem to. May I suggest finding a safe space?
I didn't say that all are smug. But there are more than a few of them out there. I routinely get lambasted for not having a "we're going to suck, end of story" attitude shared by many. This is despite laying out my reasons logically and being very clear that I am not saying the team will be good, just pointing out that there are points to be made in both directions. I have openly acknowledged the negative possibilities and have been very clear in my belief that there are a broad range of outcomes. So don't start with this I'm blind or not open to others who don't agree with me nonsense. I'm just not going to be as gracious as I have in the past. It's a courtesy that frankly hasn't been reciprocated.
but with all that went wrong last year, we still won 6 and left a couple of wins on the table. 5 wins is possible, but so too is 9 or 10. Much depends on health. My current guess is 7 or 8 wins as a likely scenario with reasonable health and minimal improvement of the team. Some decent player development/health puts 8 or 9 easily within reach.
It's going to take a lot of things going wrong to have 5, or fewer, wins. Bad coaching, poor health, player regression, bad bounces of the ball, etc.
If you are predicting 5 or less wins, you likely aren't too high on his coaching ability.
My problem with Daboll goes back to not having this team ready for the beginning of last season. You don’t get blown out against a division rival at home in the season opener.
win 4-9 games, it will be a matter of the the little things that make and break a game. 2 examples this year; Taylor in Buffalo and the Pats missing the game tying FG.
Right now, I dont see them winning more than 6 games but things will change during the season. I think their schedule is harder than last season, even if the Giants have improved, they aren't as good (on paper) as the Eagles, Cowboys and AFC North. Add in a game @ Seattle and @ Atlanta later in the year and you're looking at 10 loses. You have a playoff team, Tampa Bay coming north, should be a win but will be a battle. How will Indy be with a full roster? Will the Commanders still be struggling with a rookie QB when they play a 2nd time? Before everyone goes batsh*t crazy on me, I stated that things can change in the season and the opinion of these games can change.
Only games I have marked as definitive wins are: Panthers
Should beat: Wash (wk 2) Saints home, Minn
50/50: Wash (wk 9), TB, Indy
4-13 or 7-10, get a couple of breaks and its 8-9/9-8
Is giants fans look at this team and sees question marks even at areas that the Giants addressed. When they look at other teams they see positives.
Washington got a quarterback therefore they are improved. We draft a wide receiver and we don't know what we have. We aren't beating Pittsburgh with Wilson or Cleveland with Watson and yet we have no idea how either of them will perform, but some state as fact we have no chance.
We won 9 games in 2022, how many predicted those wins? Green Bay was an automatic loss. Baltimore? No shot, that's a loss. I can go on and on. Who thought we had a shot against Philly last year, raise your hand. This stuff is all nonsense especially before we even see what they can or can't do.
Once again, I have seen some really horrible teams to where I felt that starters wouldn't even make the 53rd roster spot on other teams. Hyatt, Robinson, Nabers, even slayton would be a starter on other teams. Thomas, Runyan, Eluemunor and JMS would be starters on another team. Singletary would start.
Dexter, Thibs, Burns, Roches, okereke, Banks, ojulari, pinnock, Nubin and Simmons would be starters (and rotational players) on other teams.
Every other team has solved their issues and gotten better and we haven't addressed a single issue and we got worse.
Let me add a little to what TrueBlue stated above. Fact is nobody has any idea how the Giants will fare this season. They won 6 games this past season in which just about everything that could go wrong went wrong and of course it could happen again, but that likely suggests that the floor is 5-6 wins. Fact also is that we have no idea how the loss of Saquon wll impact the team; we have no idea how Jones will play given that on one hand he's coming back from injury and on the other could actually finally have some decent talent around him; we have no idea what kind of impact Nabers will have on the offence; and we have no idea what kind of impact Burns will have on the defence. Otherwise people are just throwing shit at the wall based more on their emotional investment than on any non-emotional objective analysis.
My own sense is that this has a little feel of 1984 to it; again not to try and predict that history will repeat itself but even thru the ups and downs then one could feel the team slowly getting better by adding more and more good players and I'm seeing something along those lines now. But it is a process as teams don't usually go from 4 wins to 14 is a couple of seasons.
RE: I’ve maintained 4-6 wins so this kind of falls into line
As does my prediction of a last place finish. This is a bad football team until it isn’t.
Then why are you predicting a last place finish? According to your belief system there is nothing to predict: they are a 3rd place team in the NFC East until they aren't. How come you aren't predicting Washington to finish last? They finished last in 2023, so aren't they a last place team until they aren't (according to your version of wisdom, that is)?
Daboll and Jones will both have something to prove and are just itching to do so. That doesn't mean either will, but both are professional competitors with significant fortunes at stake. I expect better years from both and both of them coming out of the gate much faster and less shell shocked then last year.
Scared of:
The Secondary and OL. Looking at both units it would be a stretch to say the bulk of starters for these units would start for most other teams. Quantity <> Quality. Are those units competitive?
I can see the Giants easily being one of the 3 worst teams in the league to being in contention for a wildcard.
If they did bottom out to 3 wins, it's an easy offseason to fire everyone from Schoen to to his support staff down to Daboll and cutting Jones.
7-10 which is more likely will be a much more complicated decision.
This team has talented players that can make plays. We have seen teams in the past where we had absolutely no one on a top level or barely even had starting caliber players. It was easy to see a 5 win team. This is not that team despite what some may claim.
I agree with this. I think 7-10 / 8-9 is a realistic season assuming health. If I had to bet the 6.5 total, I'd bet the over because of Daboll.
That's not to say going 7-10 or 8-9 is good. It might actually be the worst outcome if it means running in all back in 2025. But, I think that's the most likely scenario. I think Daboll is a strong head coach who has some personality concerns.
Daboll will have the team competing. Ultimately the QB play will put a ceiling on anything significant, but I see 7 wins about. The talk of 3 or 4 wins doesn't make much sense.
If the argument is what's the different between 3 and 7, they are both shitty seasons? I agree with that. I just don't see this as a top 3 pick in the NFL draft bad team.
Quote:
.
Looks like they predict he will miss 5 games to me…
LoL!
This team has talented players that can make plays. We have seen teams in the past where we had absolutely no one on a top level or barely even had starting caliber players. It was easy to see a 5 win team. This is not that team despite what some may claim.
Agree
Drafting a potential franchise quarterback will have that effect.
Whatever you think of Jones, he's coming off of an ACL and he's a running QB.
The defensive line has Dexter Lawrence ... and bodies.
And finally ... the schedule is brutal.
I hope the team wins more, and I hope our young players mature so the team can compete, but on paper, this team isn't there yet.
Quote:
In comment 16525387 Milton said:
Quote:
It's a young and talented team that will get better as the season progresses. If the injury gods are good to us, I expect 10 to 12 wins.
No offense, but 10-12 wins? Please explain.
I think that is loco.
Milton absolutely loves him some Daniel Jones.
I’ll leave it to you to figure out what that means for his football acumen…
10-12 wins is a loooooong stretch. We've hit double digit wins twice in the last 15 years with some arguably better teams. It is possible but is it probable? Not to me. To me if we get anywhere close to .500, that would be an achievement, but 5 - 7 wins is more likely and I don't see DJ still upright at the end of the year if he starts week 1.
Yes! Get your QB the first year. Trade the pick the next year to set the team up for the next several years.
Quote:
I seriously doubt we lose more games than last year. But I’m tired of trying to convince anyone. Just drop the smugness if/when proven wrong.
So it’s “smug” to think that a team that has sucked for over a decade will suck again? That’s an interesting way of looking at it. So what to we call those that blindly believe the team will be good? I’m guessing you have a cute, cuddly description for their (your) opinion? I’ll give you one “ignorant”. I could come up with a bunch of those type names but I don’t get offended by those with different opinions as you seem to. May I suggest finding a safe space?
I didn't say that all are smug. But there are more than a few of them out there. I routinely get lambasted for not having a "we're going to suck, end of story" attitude shared by many. This is despite laying out my reasons logically and being very clear that I am not saying the team will be good, just pointing out that there are points to be made in both directions. I have openly acknowledged the negative possibilities and have been very clear in my belief that there are a broad range of outcomes. So don't start with this I'm blind or not open to others who don't agree with me nonsense. I'm just not going to be as gracious as I have in the past. It's a courtesy that frankly hasn't been reciprocated.
It's going to take a lot of things going wrong to have 5, or fewer, wins. Bad coaching, poor health, player regression, bad bounces of the ball, etc.
My problem with Daboll goes back to not having this team ready for the beginning of last season. You don’t get blown out against a division rival at home in the season opener.
Right now, I dont see them winning more than 6 games but things will change during the season. I think their schedule is harder than last season, even if the Giants have improved, they aren't as good (on paper) as the Eagles, Cowboys and AFC North. Add in a game @ Seattle and @ Atlanta later in the year and you're looking at 10 loses. You have a playoff team, Tampa Bay coming north, should be a win but will be a battle. How will Indy be with a full roster? Will the Commanders still be struggling with a rookie QB when they play a 2nd time? Before everyone goes batsh*t crazy on me, I stated that things can change in the season and the opinion of these games can change.
Only games I have marked as definitive wins are: Panthers
Should beat: Wash (wk 2) Saints home, Minn
50/50: Wash (wk 9), TB, Indy
4-13 or 7-10, get a couple of breaks and its 8-9/9-8
Washington got a quarterback therefore they are improved. We draft a wide receiver and we don't know what we have. We aren't beating Pittsburgh with Wilson or Cleveland with Watson and yet we have no idea how either of them will perform, but some state as fact we have no chance.
We won 9 games in 2022, how many predicted those wins? Green Bay was an automatic loss. Baltimore? No shot, that's a loss. I can go on and on. Who thought we had a shot against Philly last year, raise your hand. This stuff is all nonsense especially before we even see what they can or can't do.
Once again, I have seen some really horrible teams to where I felt that starters wouldn't even make the 53rd roster spot on other teams. Hyatt, Robinson, Nabers, even slayton would be a starter on other teams. Thomas, Runyan, Eluemunor and JMS would be starters on another team. Singletary would start.
Dexter, Thibs, Burns, Roches, okereke, Banks, ojulari, pinnock, Nubin and Simmons would be starters (and rotational players) on other teams.
Every other team has solved their issues and gotten better and we haven't addressed a single issue and we got worse.
Makes all the sense in the world to me.
My own sense is that this has a little feel of 1984 to it; again not to try and predict that history will repeat itself but even thru the ups and downs then one could feel the team slowly getting better by adding more and more good players and I'm seeing something along those lines now. But it is a process as teams don't usually go from 4 wins to 14 is a couple of seasons.
Daboll and Jones will both have something to prove and are just itching to do so. That doesn't mean either will, but both are professional competitors with significant fortunes at stake. I expect better years from both and both of them coming out of the gate much faster and less shell shocked then last year.
Scared of:
The Secondary and OL. Looking at both units it would be a stretch to say the bulk of starters for these units would start for most other teams. Quantity <> Quality. Are those units competitive?
I can see the Giants easily being one of the 3 worst teams in the league to being in contention for a wildcard.