It’s mind boggling the short fuses and low level of loyalty Giant fans have now.
Then again, maybe it’s nothing new.
Many people wanted Phil Simms gone after 1981 because he was injury prone. Many people wanted Eli gone after the 4 interception Darren Sharper game.
So, when it comes to “the base” evaluating Giant QBs?
Maybe Giant fans aren’t as football intelligent as they think they are.
I was banging my steering wheel today listening to a NY sports talk radio
guy complaining and ranting about how he can’t believe in the team while DJ is QB. He said “While he had some success 2 years ago, last year was a disaster.”
Yes, it was a disaster:
1) The offensive line was beyond abysmal early on. No running lanes meant no running game and no pass protection meant
no passing game .
2) His “go to guy” Waller was washed up - hence his retirement this year.
3) He was relentlessly pummeled and was crushed from his blindside and basically suffererd whiplash.
4) He tore his ACL AND STILL TRIED TO KEEP PLAYING.
How the hell can you ignore 2022 and not give Daniel the benefit of the doubt?
Look at how hard he’s worked and how he’s apparently ready for the start of training camp.
Check out this video.
1) He looks rock solid
2) He seems relaxed, focused and unaffected
3) He looks like a confident leader
You guys who want him out the door?
HAVE AT IT.
Me, personally?
I think this 27-year old NY Giants QB has the talent, drive, work ethic and mental toughness to have a super amazing season IF the offensive line just gives him just DECENT play upfront.
DJ is a star player who has had incredibly bad luck.
Don’t wish him away - GET BEHIND HIM. I can’t believe that I have to attempt to convince Giant fans to believe in their QB.
Because all of you who want him gone for someone else?
You’ll be the same people pushing the next QB out the door as well.
We’ve upgraded the offensive line.
We can only pray that Evan Neal becomes the player we thought he was.
Devin Singletary is a solid - still young - running back.
Malik has star potential and may make Hyatt a better player.
Burns is a great addition to the defense.
I could go on and on about the upside of this team.
But for once?
Can we all rally behind the guy quarterbacking our team and give him a shot?
If he plays badly? (which he won’t )
Then fine, we move on.
Let’s just start the season collectively as Giants fans and pull for our QB to have a breakout season.
It’s not like he’s Ryan f****** Leaf.
Leader of the team - (
New Window )
That is the baseline and expectation when paying your QB 20% of the salary cap.
But I just wish management and the coaching staff this is the a full on prove it year for Jones. Complete open QB competition and no excuses. Go compete for the division and put up 30TDs with 3K yards. Otherwise we need a new QB.
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In comment 16535095 4xchamps said:
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To repost all of the DJ hate when he wins 10-11 games this year. FU haters!
That's not the goal for any pro QB. The goal is much higher than that.
You saw it in 2022. The bar has been lowered for Jones to the point where he is only compared to himself. If he throws 3 TDs in any single game this year - even if the Giants lose it to fall to 2-6 - there will be posts about how good Jones is and how the team is failing him again.
I think it is the same frame of reference the front office uses. Improvement from terrible to below average is celebrated as progress.
You are absolutely right - years from now they'll have college courses in Sports Psychology or Sport Management about Confirmation Bias in sports with DJ being the primary case study in the chapter.
If he is not, then next year the Giants will need to find a new QB. It’s really that simple.
Oddly enough, he's actually NEVER had a 3 TD throwing game. Sure, he's had 4 or 5, but never exactly 3, which is very weird.
If he is not, then next year the Giants will need to find a new QB. It’s really that simple.
Problem is I think if he has an average season, he's getting a 7th season next year.
I have changed that attitude after seeing him recover as well as he has, and he has faced the endless media questions with nothing but class and tact.
I really want DJ to shine this up-coming season, and I want his playing to silence the nay-sayers throughout the NFCE!
I am over-the-moon happy that Schoen acquired good veteran players to join the OL, and I hope DJ has a good relationship with the OL in front of him. I want the opposing teams think that this Giants team is the same as every recent past year, and I want the rebuilt OL to aid DJ to excel.
Daniel Jones is a classy guy, and he's a good role model for younger players to emulate, because most QB's who've dealt with what DJ has encountered would have given up long ago.
I just wish he'd grow the beard back.
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And why did he play for Duke? Right, because he wasn't good enough in high school to get any D-I offers so he had to walk on at Duke.
Why did Josh Allen play at Wyoming? A lot of times NFL QB's play at mediocre schools. The point is they don't have great talent level around them as a team.
Josh Allen played at Wyoming because he was an extremely raw specimen who didn't get a lot of exposure because of where he grew up.
Everything a QB can do, Allen does better than Jones, and Jones is the one who got high-level QB coaching from the time he was in high school.
But that-in all reality-isn’t going to happen. That doesn’t mean he’s a bad dude or whatever. It just means he’s not a franchise QB & we should all want one.
Daniel Jones has had a blessed life. People shouldn’t feel sorry for him.
But AGAIN...
He's had three serious injuries and is probably one neck injury away from retirement. (People also forget he missed games in 2019 and 2020 with lesser injuries too).
He had a rookie season filled with good and bad. His next two years were bad. His 2022 was arguably his best, but it wasn't that good. They had to basically dumb down the offense for him. We know what happened to him last year and there wasn't a noticeable difference between him and Taylor and DeVito (the latter being particularly damning).
These are all facts, despite what his clingers argue.
He's out of excuses so he had better stay healthy and have a good year.
He was never outplayed by Devito and Tyrod. If Tyrod was so great, the Giants wouldn't have let him go. Also, who was Jones throwing to in 2022? Richie James? You can't make chicken salas out of chicken shit. The only teams I can think of off the top of my head who won SB's with mediocre WR's was Tom Brady and the Patriots in 03' and 04' and the Eagles in '17, but they had an elite TE in Ertz. You need a legit, great receiver in this league to be successful, period. Now Jones has one in Nabers.
If Jones stays healthy he'll regain his crown as king of the mid tier quarterbacks.
If the breaks go their way they'll win 8/9 or so games and compete for a wildcard. If the breaks don't they'll win 6/7 and pick outside of the top 5.
The 40M AAV Jones makes will be around 15th among quarterbacks, and the 30M in new cash he's owed next year will be low enough to trigger the "what other choice do they have?" refrain.
The Giants won't be in the same stratosphere as the teams legitimately competing for a title, but it will be enough to run it all back again.
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Criticism from other areas can be used as an objective indicator of what Jones is.
Here's a quote on the Giants' QB situation from someone who was once objective, but is for good reason no longer able to speak freely on the subject...
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“They’re gonna wanna get me the ball so I’m sure they’re gonna wanna get a QB that can do that”
Malik Nabers on the Giants QB situation in March - ( New Window )
Holy taking the quote out of context Batman. Have you ever heard of a leading question? That would be an example of one. The reporter implied that the Giants were probably going in a different direction at QB, and Nabers responding to the question as if that were going to be the case. That didn't happen. Nothing to see there.
A leading question is one that essentially gives the answer in the question and leads to the answer desired (typically yes/no) instead of an open-ended answer.
Hard to say this was actually a leading question, per se.
The fact that this is even a debate is damning in itself.
Games with more than 2 TD passes since 2019
UDFA Tommy DeVito: 1 (6 starts)
#6 overall pick Daniel Jones: 0 (47 starts)
The fact that this is even a debate is damning in itself.
The is a difference between "no discernible difference" and outplaying. And the reason I believe there was little discernable difference is because the offensive line was playing significantly worse in the early part of the season when Jones playing, as compared to later in when Tyrod and Devito were playing.
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LOL.
& this is why other fans of other teams laugh at us.
Nope. Other fan bases laugh at our fan base because it it a disloyal, piece of $hit, old fat guy fanbase that want to win the Superbowl every year or they are miserable.
I'm pretty sure when they say things like "who's your QB? lmao" it has nothing to do with a "disloyal, piece of $hit, old fat guy fanbase" but whatever helps you sleep at night in your DJ underoos, I guess.
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He was never outplayed by Devito and Tyrod.
Games with more than 2 TD passes since 2019
UDFA Tommy DeVito: 1 (6 starts)
#6 overall pick Daniel Jones: 0 (47 starts)
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read it then you will be like "oh yeah..."
I was citing that around here at the end of 2019 when it was clear there was an issue with Jones.
No one wanted to hear it.
He also liked Haskins better and said his comp was Big Ben. We've all seen DJ and don't need to re-read some scouts opinion from 5 years ago.
Also, I don't remember reading about how he'd handle being saddled with historically bad offensive lines for 95% of his time and no weapons for 100%.
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He was never outplayed by Devito and Tyrod.
Games with more than 2 TD passes since 2019
UDFA Tommy DeVito: 1 (6 starts)
#6 overall pick Daniel Jones: 0 (47 starts)
I need him to be the procuring cause of those wins as well.
Otherwise we can get the same production for much. much less.
I think.....the people who think he is garbage....and you know who you are....are not very knowledgeable.....almost ridiculous, when they claim every QB in draft is Mahomes, Allen, Rodgers, now
At 40 million, the Giants can find a replacement in the draft for much cheaper.
Jones must step up this year and win....or he will be gone.
I agree he is likely between 10-20. However the way people underplay the effects of the overall roster on the Giants suckitude over the past 12 years is baffling. It's NOT just on the QB folks. The rest of the roster actually does matter, believe it or not.
Yes - the most relevant bit of data is a game from FIVE years ago. Much more germane than his last four seasons of play.
And when he doesn't, will you STFU and go away?
Of course not. Zero stakes for you. Shut up.
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By almost every statistical measure, Taylor and DeVito outplayed Jones.
The fact that this is even a debate is damning in itself.
The is a difference between "no discernible difference" and outplaying. And the reason I believe there was little discernable difference is because the offensive line was playing significantly worse in the early part of the season when Jones playing, as compared to later in when Tyrod and Devito were playing.
He doesn't get that benefit of the doubt anymore. He just doesn't. As soon as Taylor and DeVito did what they did in comparison with Jones, it was a horrific look for Jones. And I said so at the time.
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In comment 16535199 Eightshamrocks said:
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He was never outplayed by Devito and Tyrod.
Games with more than 2 TD passes since 2019
UDFA Tommy DeVito: 1 (6 starts)
#6 overall pick Daniel Jones: 0 (47 starts)
And if you included 2019 Jones had a 5 TD game. I see what you did there.
Matt Flynn threw 6 TDs in a game once.
Have higher standards.
If Jones stays healthy he'll regain his crown as king of the mid tier quarterbacks.
If the breaks go their way they'll win 8/9 or so games and compete for a wildcard. If the breaks don't they'll win 6/7 and pick outside of the top 5.
The 40M AAV Jones makes will be around 15th among quarterbacks, and the 30M in new cash he's owed next year will be low enough to trigger the "what other choice do they have?" refrain.
The Giants won't be in the same stratosphere as the teams legitimately competing for a title, but it will be enough to run it all back again.
This scenario has been obvious since they didn't draft a QB with any of their 2024 picks.
Sure, they "tried" to trade up for Drake Maye, but there's no indication they ever had a realistic chance of that happening. My guess is at the top of the organization they were thrilled at that outcome.
If we win 7 or fewer games, we'll get the excuses du jour: his supporting cast let him down, he got hurt, it's Kafka's fault...
Rinse. Repeat.
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In comment 16535213 Greg from LI said:
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In comment 16535199 Eightshamrocks said:
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He was never outplayed by Devito and Tyrod.
Games with more than 2 TD passes since 2019
UDFA Tommy DeVito: 1 (6 starts)
#6 overall pick Daniel Jones: 0 (47 starts)
And if you included 2019 Jones had a 5 TD game. I see what you did there.
Matt Flynn threw 6 TDs in a game once.
Have higher standards.
Trubisky too.
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At best, he falls between 10-20, but is dependent of having a good OL and a decent team around him.
I think.....the people who think he is garbage....and you know who you are....are not very knowledgeable.....almost ridiculous, when they claim every QB in draft is Mahomes, Allen, Rodgers, now
At 40 million, the Giants can find a replacement in the draft for much cheaper.
Jones must step up this year and win....or he will be gone.
I agree he is likely between 10-20. However the way people underplay the effects of the overall roster on the Giants suckitude over the past 12 years is baffling. It's NOT just on the QB folks. The rest of the roster actually does matter, believe it or not.
And the rest of the roster continually gets rookies drafted into every position, starters are challenged by the depth chart, etc.
DJ has been completely unchallenged since being drafted. That's a problem. Let him win the job if he's so good. Stop gifting it to him.
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In comment 16535149 DC Gmen Fan said:
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read it then you will be like "oh yeah..."
I was citing that around here at the end of 2019 when it was clear there was an issue with Jones.
No one wanted to hear it.
He also liked Haskins better and said his comp was Big Ben. We've all seen DJ and don't need to re-read some scouts opinion from 5 years ago.
Also, I don't remember reading about how he'd handle being saddled with historically bad offensive lines for 95% of his time and no weapons for 100%.
No weapons? So you agree Barkley was a wasted pick?
We need that image of the "2022 Wild Card Win" banner.
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In comment 16534995 George from PA said:
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At best, he falls between 10-20, but is dependent of having a good OL and a decent team around him.
I think.....the people who think he is garbage....and you know who you are....are not very knowledgeable.....almost ridiculous, when they claim every QB in draft is Mahomes, Allen, Rodgers, now
At 40 million, the Giants can find a replacement in the draft for much cheaper.
Jones must step up this year and win....or he will be gone.
I agree he is likely between 10-20. However the way people underplay the effects of the overall roster on the Giants suckitude over the past 12 years is baffling. It's NOT just on the QB folks. The rest of the roster actually does matter, believe it or not.
And the rest of the roster continually gets rookies drafted into every position, starters are challenged by the depth chart, etc.
DJ has been completely unchallenged since being drafted. That's a problem. Let him win the job if he's so good. Stop gifting it to him.
It's not even that...over the course of the past 5 years almost EVERYONE has been replaced...mainly because they were so bad...including coaches/coordinators/FO people/etc...ONLY a few remain - none matter as much as one of them.
There is a constant here to consider.
If he has all the tools and intangibles to be a champion, imagine the downward forces he must have faced along the way to make his bona fides look like a bad quarterback. And if he's so cosmically unlucky, what are the chances that luck turns and he has several good luck seasons?
If Daniel Jones is really say the modern equivalent of Phil Simms, he's got a hell of a curse on him.
"depending on other things" = "depending on how easily we can conjure excuses to keep him for 2025 and beyond."
Based on what?
Last year he was no better than the 32nd best starter. What is the argument he is 10th?
There isn't one. It's just nonsense you are typing on a message board.
Analysts all over the country are rating him bottom-3. This is why our fanbase, and our management are a laughing stock. Treating a bad QB like he's maybe the 10th best. I can easily name 27 QBs I'd rather have. And most would agree.
We need that image of the "2022 Wild Card Win" banner.
Beat that drum!! Won’t be long you’ll have your mantra established.
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In comment 16535172 Go Terps said:
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In comment 16535149 DC Gmen Fan said:
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read it then you will be like "oh yeah..."
I was citing that around here at the end of 2019 when it was clear there was an issue with Jones.
No one wanted to hear it.
He also liked Haskins better and said his comp was Big Ben. We've all seen DJ and don't need to re-read some scouts opinion from 5 years ago.
Also, I don't remember reading about how he'd handle being saddled with historically bad offensive lines for 95% of his time and no weapons for 100%.
No weapons? So you agree Barkley was a wasted pick?
For similar reasons, yes. He wasn't Barry Sanders and couldn't do it behind bad lines. He never really provided enough in the passing game as a receiver or pass protection.
I do expect him to have a couple good seasons on the Eagles where he gets to play behind a functioning OL and other weapons that will not allow defenses to stack the box and stop one guy.
Some “producing” it under multiple handles.
I do expect him to have a couple good seasons on the Eagles where he gets to play behind a functioning OL and other weapons that will not allow defenses to stack the box and stop one guy.
Was he a weapon or not?
At a certain point, you have to stop blaming the spokes and check the hub.
Some “producing” it under multiple handles.
Ok dep.
My dad is dead. Go make yourself scarce now.
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To repost all of the DJ hate when he wins 10-11 games this year. FU haters!
And when he doesn't, will you STFU and go away?
Of course not. Zero stakes for you. Shut up.
LOL Bite me!