Which Giants RB would you rather have in their prime...

In comment 16539492 Capt. Don said:

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Was his rookie year and he was the best back in the league. Unfortunately his prime was 1 year long. That said, his prime was better thank Tiki's.

This is just false. Tiki Barber had at least 2 seasons that were better than Saquons rookie season.

In comment 16539529 BigBlue7 said:

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vision and instincts

This. Tiki had an exceptional ability to set up his blocks. He would feign one direction in the backfield to fool the linebacker and run to daylight. I've never seen a back do it better.

The soundtrack probably has something to do with it.
Tiki Highlights - ( New Window )

Always thought he was underrated because his best was with the Cardinals. He was a workhorse with close to hall of fame production.

was very good.

Barkley has a name, but his production doesn't match up.

All day. He was the offense on horrible team and got it done. Put him on Tiki's teams and he explodes. As for Barkley he did on terrible team what Barkley couldn't do. He carried the team every week

Tiki.

7th overall if i Remember correctly.

Tiki was absolutely worth it.

...

In comment 16539529 BigBlue7 said:

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vision and instincts

Was reading this thread for this comment.
This is the real difference
Tiki not only know how to follow his blockers, he would even set up blocks.
That said, I do believe Tiki had a superior OL to Barkley for most of his career

saquon barkley will absolutely be one of the most overrated of the overrateds.

I’m glad to see Rodney Hampton getting sone love in this thread, he’s my guy. Hampton from 1990-1993 (and maybe 1994) before his knee slowed him down and he put on weight to be a power back was the full package. He had vision and great hands, a real playmaker. He rarely fumbled too, I remember when he retired he was in the top 3 all time in carries vs fumbles.

The TIKI MISSILE ALL DAY !! But, Ron Johnson will do also. Those Blue Shoes ran all over those Dern Eagles .

Tiki had the results.

In comment 16539753 Giants said:

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All day. He was the offense on horrible team and got it done. Put him on Tiki's teams and he explodes. As for Barkley he did on terrible team what Barkley couldn't do. He carried the team every week

Tiki Barber is the best RB the Giants have ever had. Why is this even a question? Stop throwing names out there. Hampton was a quality RB, yes. Not as good as Barber.

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I think there's some recency bias there. Tiki's prime was special. It doesn't matter how much you want to zoom in to a single year or a single game, Tiki is the better pick in all situations.

All he did was win!

where he was in the conversation for best in the league. One more season and a ring, and dude would have been an easy HOF entry.

Barkley was never that

In comment 16539964 widmerseyebrow said:

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I think there's some recency bias there. Tiki's prime was special. It doesn't matter how much you want to zoom in to a single year or a single game, Tiki is the better pick in all situations.

Anyone who would say Barkley has to be too young to watch the other backs mentioned. Otherwise, I can't explain it.

Some here were trying to pump up the line for Tiki. Watch the games, the man was a terrific back for his mind. Unlike Saquon. The 2004 OL was hardly very good.

...but Barkley was a solid player with a massive amount of hype that never really lived up to the expectations of a 2nd overall pick.

Barber transformed himself into a workhorse. He was underappreciated. He ranks second in career rushing yards (3,389) and single-season rushing yards (1,397); third in career all-purpose yards (4,869), single-season all-purpose yards (1,906) and single-game all-purpose yards (311); and seventh in career scoring (210) and single-season scoring (96).

And he will be 50 in April! Where does the time go?

Tiki had an all-time offensive line to run behind.

Barkley had historically bad linemen in front of him.

Also more durable

In comment 16539991 Vin_Cuccs said:

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Tiki had an all-time offensive line to run behind. Barkley had historically bad linemen in front of him.

Tiki left after 2006 - not sure he had the good line that they would put together soon. He did have part of it maybe 2005 and 2006.

In comment 16539991 Vin_Cuccs said:

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Tiki had an all-time offensive line to run behind. Barkley had historically bad linemen in front of him.

"all-time" is beyond a stretch. Combined in Tiki's career how many pro-bowls did his OL go to? 2?

Ron Stone (2) from what I can tell.

I think that might be it during Tiki's career.

Tiki never played with the Diehl Seubert O'Hara Snee McKenzie line

His best LT was Petitgout. lol. Or maybe 100-year old Lomas Brown.

Running behind this line:

Luke Petitgout
Wayne Lucier
Chris Bober
David Diehl
Ian Allen

So....yeah

Tiki vs Hampton would be more apples to apples. Tiki and Hampton had a much longer 'prime' than Barkley. Great/exceptional players are labeled that in part because they were able to have a prime career that extended multiple seasons. Barkley never had that.

Could Barkley have been a realistic challenger as the best RB ever? I think so, but it never happened.

Hampton's career was probably tougher to achieve in terms of the Giants not having any other weapons which allowed defenses to focus on him without much threat of getting beat deep.

Tiki's was trending toward HOF had he played longer.

If I had to choose one game where Barkley and Barber were both at their best? It is really hard to not choose Barber because Barber had learned how to run in the NFL (he had to learn this and was close to being cut early in his career). While Barkley at his best (2018 imo) still had learning to do how to run at the NFL level.

Barkley came into the NFL as absolute amazing athlete (similar to Bo Jackson). Then proceeded to have an excellent rookie year which prematurely projected him as a lock to be one of the best RB's in the league.

TC returned the franchise to emphasize the critical importance of the OL (TC's said they would do this in his initial press conference) and running game. So TB had the right HC and system to maximize his great potential. Just in 2004, Giants added its best OL (Snee, O'Hara also added).

SB didn't have the coaching (imv) and near the talent around him that Tiki had. If he did he would be an over 2k yard RB if he stayed healthy. The issues SB did have (getting the tough yds. would have been fixed sooner imv). Unfortunately, SB played behind the already long established poorer OL.

Hampton would have been great behind that 2004-08 group. When TB did retired the run game production stayed the same.

Tiki could do it all.

In comment 16540050 Lines of Scrimmage said:

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TC returned the franchise to emphasize the critical importance of the OL (TC's said they would do this in his initial press conference) and running game. So TB had the right HC and system to maximize his great potential. Just in 2004, Giants added its best OL (Snee, O'Hara also added). SB didn't have the coaching (imv) and near the talent around him that Tiki had. If he did he would be an over 2k yard RB if he stayed healthy. The issues SB did have (getting the tough yds. would have been fixed sooner imv). Unfortunately, SB played behind the already long established poorer OL. Hampton would have been great behind that 2004-08 group. When TB did retired the run game production stayed the same.

Tiki had 1984 total yards in 2002 (before the offensive line fix). 2004 he had over 2000 yards total and that was still the start of the offensive line rebuild. Mckenzie would come in 2005.

We are also talking about talent. Very rarely dud you see Tiki go for a negative gain and Tiki could run a 3rd or 4th and short. Tiki also had game awareness to stay in bounds, to get out of bounds to save the clock. He also avoided the big hits that would allow him to stay on the field.

Saquon's 5th gear was electric and different for a RB. But Tiki blew him out of the water in terms of patience and vision, even accounting for the better OL.

One of the most damning Saquon stats is his lack of 1st downs created. Whereas Tiki was a 1st down machine. Their top 1st down seasons...

Saquon
2018: 80 1st downs
2022: 72
2023: 67
2019: 59


Tiki
2006: 103 1st downs
2004: 102
2005: 96
2002: 95
2003: 94
2001: 70

Tiki had 5 seasons with significantly more 1st downs than Saquon's best season. It's not apples to apples as their supporting cast was different, but even taking that into account I think Tiki was just a lot better at keeping drives alive with consistent patient running vs. Barkley's HR hitting style.

was ultimately disappointing. Other than the rookie year, it was characterized by shit teams, OLs that couldn't block, 9 man fronts, injuries that slowed him, and coaches who never fully used him as a pass catcher.

Tiki's career wasn't disappointing -- at least on the field.

Tiki is the clear cut answer. Not even remotely close.

Was the best Giant running back. Unfortunately, injuries cut short his career.

I think OJ Anderson’s overall career is better . But his best years were with the Cardinals. I always look at total TDs. He has Barber by something like 81 to 57. They both rushed for slightly over 10K. But, again , as a Giant it’s not even close . Saquon was in a class by himself as far as peak value . But the injuries cost him his burst early in his career .

Note here about Ron Johnson, who is Top 5 on my all-time Giants list . His career was relatively short . I think he scored over 40 TDs and was , by far, the best receiving Giant RB. In fact I always thought he should have been a WR.

Many years ago I did a brief interview with him at the Alexander’s on Kingsbridge in the Bronx. It must have been 1976 after he called it quits during the Cowboys camp. He was making a promotional-autograph appearance . I asked him if he would have been better served moving to WR like Paul Warfield , Bobby Mitchell or Charlie Taylor . He smiled when he said , “Maybe but I did pretty good , right ?” Yes you did . R.I.P.

Always want an honorable mention to Rob Carpenter . Yeah it was basically for 1981. But that was such an important year . There would be setbacks . Another coaching change . Very neatly yet another coaching change that would have been catastrophic . A stupid quarterback decision by a great coach . But Robbie was foundational .

years and should be mentioned

In comment 16540516 xman said:

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years and should be mentioned

He did, yes. Good RB. But Tiki for 3 or 4 years was HoF level. Joes was not.

Go Tiki here.

His prime is a much lesser version of that guy. Tiki's best seasons were on par w his one. So not even a close choice. Tiki

Up the blitz.

My choice - David Wilson; he was like Haley's comet, comes by every 70 years andThen dazzles, then he's gone. It was a heart-break (as I recall, he was damaged goods coming out of college).

https://www.giants.com/video/rb-david-wilson-breaks-84yd-td-10944925

Then Saquon, then all the rest.

Then give me:
Barkley
Ron Johnson
Tiki
Morris
Hampton

In comment 16540999 Manny in CA said:

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My choice - David Wilson; he was like Haley's comet, comes by every 70 years andThen dazzles, then he's gone. It was a heart-break (as I recall, he was damaged goods coming out of college). https://www.giants.com/video/rb-david-wilson-breaks-84yd-td-10944925 Then Saquon, then all the rest.

David Wilson was an awful pick at the end of Rd 1. Not only a complete over-draft by probably 2 rounds based on his talent, but this was an awful RB draft to even invest in altogether. The NY Giants desperately needed to re-tool at LB and this draft was extremely deep at that position and we passed on every one.

The 2011 and 2012 NYG drafts were as bad as you can get. Might as well not even show up to pick players based on what happened.

In comment 16541005 PatersonPlank said:

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Then give me: Barkley Ron Johnson Tiki Morris Hampton

I don't think Prime means what you think it means

What DOES "Prime" mean ?

As far as Wilson - Maybe the Giants should have drafted a linebacker that year, but that wasn't his fault. Who knows how good he COULD have been if it wasn't for that neck injury.

https://www.tiktok.com/@bigblueunited/video/7313330787888139550

My apologies for the bad link (you may have to paste it in to your browser address window)

Wilson's story is similar to another Giants halfback of the past - Tucker Fredrickson.