Look, it’s a Duh! to say Evan Neal has been a huge disappointment. Doesn’t have the feet to play NFL OT and is constantly hurt.
While I’m sure it’s little comfort to Schoen, I have yet to hear a draft analyst give me the OT they would have taken in the 2022 draft over Neal. He was pretty much #1 on everyone’s board.
But hay, Schoen is paid to get it right. The buck stops with him. No one cares that most everyone also got taking Neal wrong, they didn't take him, we did.
Who would you have taken instead of Neal? Hutchinson and Sauce were gone. While KT has shown some promise, he has not been stellar. But I guess you can’t pass on taking a top quality edge. So assuming you still take KT at 5, who would you have taken at 7.
Looking at the rest of the top 10, the obvious answer is WR Garret Wilson. But do Giants with a piss poor OL really walk away from a draft where they have 2 top 10 picks and not take a OT?
Other #1 OTs taken: Ikem Ekwonu, Charles Cross, Trevor Penning, Tyler Smith . Smith is the best of that bunch, a pro bowler and far better than Neal. But do you kill Schoen for passing on (not trading down for) a kid from Tulsa over Neal the consensus #1 OT from Bama?
We are all disappointed by what Neal appears to be, but was it obvious he would stink? Avoidable? I looked at Sy's review of Neal from 2022. He had his concerns about Neal not making positive steps forward in his last year at BAMA, but he felt those issues were correctable. Some times prospects just don’t pan out.
My general approach.....
If roster sucks with a ton of wholes.....I would want more draft picks.
If roster is solid.....I would focus on BPA.
If roster is strong....targeting more blue chippers...by trading up...fine tuning.
Trading down may have actually have been possible and gotten a good return as I am sure there were other teams that wanted Neal.
I don't see how anyone can kill the Giants about the pick.
PS - I have not given up on Neal. Lets see what he can do if he is able to get healthy and stay healthy.
All that said, while it’s hard to bash Schoen too much for taking Neal given that he was almost universally seen as a top 10 pick, his refusal to work out even at his pro day should have raised some red flags.
Thibs would have been the prospect I would have reconsidered at the time of the draft. Still would.
If not Wilson, Hamilton would’ve been great (DPOY type year) but I don’t think Schoen likes the positional value there.
So if Schoen didn’t go Wilson, I think it would’ve been Charles Cross.
If not Wilson, Hamilton would’ve been great (DPOY type year) but I don’t think Schoen likes the positional value there.
So if Schoen didn’t go Wilson, I think it would’ve been Charles Cross.
Alt went before our pick of Nabers and I think we would have been idiots to reach for Latham like Tennessee did. Some of the red flags we see with Neal I see again with Latham.
But at the time, Evan Neal was considered a top pick and he "fell" to seven. I do not remeber anyone on this board complaining about the pick. He was highly rated and at one point considered the top pick in the draft.
But, as noted above, no one was complaining about the Neal pick at the time. I just can't believe he's been this bad.
In retrospect, none of them have lived up to their draft hype, so that pick was likely to be a miss no matter what. But it's not like Schoen was alone in having Neal ranked so high. We know DAL had him #1, for example. Whatever was missed in Neal's pre-draft analysis eluded a lot of people paid a lot of money by multiple organizations.
I have not given up on Neal yet. I remember a lot of people on BBI had given up on Andrew Thomas.
I have not given up on Neal yet. I remember a lot of people on BBI had given up on Andrew Thomas.
This …. Neal was the absolute no brainer at that point, with maybe a slight and distant argument for Cross. He has this year to get his shit together.
Once Gettleman made the trade, however, the pick in 2021 should have been Christian Darrisaw, a solid tackle who would have complemented Thomas perfectly, instead of Kadarius Toney. Schoen would have then taken Garrett Wilson in 2022 and ended up with an all pro calibre wide receiver. Two talented players with very bright NFL futures, instead of two massive busts.
Thibs would have been the prospect I would have reconsidered at the time of the draft. Still would.
Agree 100% with this comment. This year IMO is going to be the year we all know if either of these picks were worth being a top ten pick. I still believe Neal may pan out if healthy. Thibs on the other hand….. I just haven’t see. It from a skill perspective. I’ve watched him in person and I just don’t see it at all on a consistent basis. He may be average at best.
Ya never know about the draft
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to focus in on and Schoen made a very reasonable pick where the investment hasn't paid off. While it hasn't started off at all well for him but it still could work out. Although Neal can't be a liability for much longer, maybe another 8 games or so?
Thibs would have been the prospect I would have reconsidered at the time of the draft. Still would.
Agree 100% with this comment. This year IMO is going to be the year we all know if either of these picks were worth being a top ten pick. I still believe Neal may pan out if healthy. Thibs on the other hand….. I just haven’t see. It from a skill perspective. I’ve watched him in person and I just don’t see it at all on a consistent basis. He may be average at best.
Average at best?
Wow…inconsistent at times…yes
Think you need to watch the games a bit closer as that isn’t even a remotely accurate observation
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In comment 16549602 ThomasG said:
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to focus in on and Schoen made a very reasonable pick where the investment hasn't paid off. While it hasn't started off at all well for him but it still could work out. Although Neal can't be a liability for much longer, maybe another 8 games or so?
Thibs would have been the prospect I would have reconsidered at the time of the draft. Still would.
Agree 100% with this comment. This year IMO is going to be the year we all know if either of these picks were worth being a top ten pick. I still believe Neal may pan out if healthy. Thibs on the other hand….. I just haven’t see. It from a skill perspective. I’ve watched him in person and I just don’t see it at all on a consistent basis. He may be average at best.
Average at best?
Wow…inconsistent at times…yes
Think you need to watch the games a bit closer as that isn’t even a remotely accurate observation
You need to read more closely. He said he was inconsistent - which you agreed with. The suggestion that an inconsistent player "may" be average at best is not incorrect - it is an opinion about a future outcome.
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In comment 16549644 NJLCO said:
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In comment 16549602 ThomasG said:
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to focus in on and Schoen made a very reasonable pick where the investment hasn't paid off. While it hasn't started off at all well for him but it still could work out. Although Neal can't be a liability for much longer, maybe another 8 games or so?
Thibs would have been the prospect I would have reconsidered at the time of the draft. Still would.
Agree 100% with this comment. This year IMO is going to be the year we all know if either of these picks were worth being a top ten pick. I still believe Neal may pan out if healthy. Thibs on the other hand….. I just haven’t see. It from a skill perspective. I’ve watched him in person and I just don’t see it at all on a consistent basis. He may be average at best.
Average at best?
Wow…inconsistent at times…yes
Think you need to watch the games a bit closer as that isn’t even a remotely accurate observation
You need to read more closely. He said he was inconsistent - which you agreed with. The suggestion that an inconsistent player "may" be average at best is not incorrect - it is an opinion about a future outcome.
I would say that his improvement year one to year two illustrates my point that he is not “average at best”….but is still a work in progress….ex: setting the edge better on the run
Also on that post…saying that he just “doesn’t see it”
That is what I was referring to when I said to watch the games a bit closer
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to focus in on and Schoen made a very reasonable pick where the investment hasn't paid off. While it hasn't started off at all well for him but it still could work out. Although Neal can't be a liability for much longer, maybe another 8 games or so?
Thibs would have been the prospect I would have reconsidered at the time of the draft. Still would.
Agree 100% with this comment. This year IMO is going to be the year we all know if either of these picks were worth being a top ten pick. I still believe Neal may pan out if healthy. Thibs on the other hand….. I just haven’t see. It from a skill perspective. I’ve watched him in person and I just don’t see it at all on a consistent basis. He may be average at best.
Yes NJLCO. Also somewhat concerned that Thibs' mentality is that he thinks he is already doing what he should from a production aspect. Taking full advantage of weak OLs like Washington and the Jets is great but there needs to be a true edge presence showing up weekly and against the top competition. Maybe that concern isn't the case but seems to fit his pre-draft profile.
Neal is the bigger concern (and the subject of this OP) but both 2022 draft guys need to deliver more.
This
Dallas apparently had him #1 on their draft board and you know how they pick OL! Superbly.
Do we give up on him after two injury filled seasons? Do we let Carmen get some time with him?
My point is that we wouldn't have passed on him at 5 because we needed OL in the worst way and he was the consensus #1 OT!
The shit luck is it was a bad QB draft. For all the shit Schoen gets about Jones, I'm very confident QB would have been the pick if it was literally any other year.
Giants picked Butch Woolfolk before Joe Morris; Eric Moore before Jumbo Elliott.
Neal was the “right” pick at the time but hasn’t played well. It happens. It really stings with a top 10 pick, but it happens.
I liked Cross the best but Bobby Skinner review made me second guess myself. So I was on the Ekwonu train but he got selected first. Neal scared me, but was super excited to get him. Even though he scared me with his technique and falling on the ground I still thought he would be good, just not top 10 good. But really what’s the difference between top 10 and top 15 in the big scheme of things so no problem taking him where they did.
I still think he can be good. And have high hopes for him.
Can he please be healthy!!!!
Once Gettleman made the trade, however, the pick in 2021 should have been Christian Darrisaw, a solid tackle who would have complemented Thomas perfectly, instead of Kadarius Toney. Schoen would have then taken Garrett Wilson in 2022 and ended up with an all pro calibre wide receiver. Two talented players with very bright NFL futures, instead of two massive busts.
Think about this, thanks to that move, we not only missed out on a perennial All Pro pass rusher, but we also ended up with Kadarius Toney, Evan Neal and Darren Waller. OUCH!!!
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to focus in on and Schoen made a very reasonable pick where the investment hasn't paid off. While it hasn't started off at all well for him but it still could work out. Although Neal can't be a liability for much longer, maybe another 8 games or so?
Thibs would have been the prospect I would have reconsidered at the time of the draft. Still would.
Agree 100% with this comment. This year IMO is going to be the year we all know if either of these picks were worth being a top ten pick. I still believe Neal may pan out if healthy. Thibs on the other hand….. I just haven’t see. It from a skill perspective. I’ve watched him in person and I just don’t see it at all on a consistent basis. He may be average at best.
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That draft pick should never have happened in the first place. Gettleman should have taken Micah Parsons in 2021 instead of trading back for the pick that turned into Evan Neal. A classic case of stealing defeat from the jaws of victory.
Once Gettleman made the trade, however, the pick in 2021 should have been Christian Darrisaw, a solid tackle who would have complemented Thomas perfectly, instead of Kadarius Toney. Schoen would have then taken Garrett Wilson in 2022 and ended up with an all pro calibre wide receiver. Two talented players with very bright NFL futures, instead of two massive busts.
Think about this, thanks to that move, we not only missed out on a perennial All Pro pass rusher, but we also ended up with Kadarius Toney, Evan Neal and Darren Waller. OUCH!!!
Yes exactly! You can't make these kinds of mistakes as it relates to evaluating talent. They are fatal! And precisely explain why this team is where it is...
Shit happens and guys do not pan out.
Because I'm guessing he's a large part of the problem/solution.
I think I still wanted Kavon at 5 and I liked Neal over the pick that went right before him
6'7" 360, doing this !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6iUcHNH5BZ8
He's still young, flashed before he got hurt. His story is not over.