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Okereke on Giants D

JCassmen : 7/10/2024 3:23 pm
The Giants changed defensive coordinators this offseason and the move from Wink Martindale to Shane Bowen was not a minor one.

Martindale’s attacking scheme is very different from the one Bowen employed with the Titans, which is something linebacker Bobby Okereke noted when asked about the shift during a Wednesday appearance on Up & Adams. Okereke said there is a night and day difference in the approach of the two men and that he thinks Bowen’s style is going to produce very positive results during the 2024 season.

“It’s almost about as 180 of a flip as it can be,” Okereke said. “Going from Wink — I loved that system, attacking, blitzing all the time — to Shane, very methodical, probably one of the most cerebral defensive coordinators I’ve ever been around. Just the way he sees the game, the way he’s gonna call it, the way he coaches it, the attention to detail. Yeah, I think we’re gonna dominate this year, and it’s gonna be led by him.”

The Giants took a step backward on both sides of the ball in 2023. Okereke and Bowen won’t be able to do much for the offense, but that unit’s turnaround won’t have to be quite as drastic if the defense comes together as Okereke believes it will.
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Step backward on both sides?  
5BowlsSoon : 7/10/2024 3:39 pm : link
You sure about that?
Wink didn't have the talent level players  
thrunthrublue : 7/10/2024 3:40 pm : link
to succeed, while blitzing the qb, because if you blitz but fail.... your defensive backfield and defensive pass coverage is laid bare and that was evident in just how many third and plenty conversions the Wink scheme was devastated with. Especially Thibs, who has GOT to get better at making a defense double team him....as opposed to tight ends one on one washing him out of plays.
20/20 Hindsight, Wink Seemed To Be A 'One Trick Pony'  
Trainmaster : 7/10/2024 3:49 pm : link
in terms of the personnel packages and schemes he could employ.

I think his stubbornness in the way he tried (very unsuccessfully) to defend against Dallas is an example.

RE: 20/20 Hindsight, Wink Seemed To Be A 'One Trick Pony'  
Eric on Li : 7/10/2024 3:50 pm : link
In comment 16551263 Trainmaster said:
Quote:
in terms of the personnel packages and schemes he could employ.

I think his stubbornness in the way he tried (very unsuccessfully) to defend against Dallas is an example.


he truly was the 3rd ryan brother. they all had similar nfl conclusions.
I've watched enough football to know "cerebral"  
j_rud : 7/10/2024 3:55 pm : link
often translates to "steep learning curve". Especially a zone heavy system that will require communication and familiarity with your teammates.
You're 100% right thru'n-thru ....  
Manny in CA : 7/10/2024 4:24 pm : link

Wink defense is a morphed reincarnation of Buddy Ryan's 1985's "46" defense.

Pressure, pressure, pressure; Biggest results difference was Buddy had NINE Pro Bowlers (and one ALL PRO - Steve McMichael). Who and how many are you gonna double-team ??

Buddy had high calibre ammunition in '85, Wink's 2023 Giants had one bullet (Dex), the rest cap pistol rounds.

Buddy was shootin' a snub nose 500 S&W. Check out this little girl handling this cannon ....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foQsqTeZFqc


RE: Step backward on both sides?  
Jack Stroud : 7/10/2024 7:47 pm : link
In comment 16551249 5BowlsSoon said:
Quote:
You sure about that?
Yes, especially on the defense that suddenly became soft in the middle. The defense got gashed up the middle giving up big runs late in games that cost them a few victories.
RE: RE: Step backward on both sides?  
gridirony : 7/11/2024 6:37 am : link
In comment 16551418 Jack Stroud said:
Quote:
In comment 16551249 5BowlsSoon said:


Quote:


You sure about that?

Yes, especially on the defense that suddenly became soft in the middle. The defense got gashed up the middle giving up big runs late in games that cost them a few victories.


Giving up the big runs is currently looking like a good pay off, with getting Nabors.
Wink  
Archer : 7/11/2024 8:11 am : link
I would have liked to see Burns playing for Wink.

Wink's defense is designed to put players in a position to win a one-on-one situation.

RE: RE: Step backward on both sides?  
HBart : 7/11/2024 8:37 am : link
In comment 16551418 Jack Stroud said:
Quote:
In comment 16551249 5BowlsSoon said:


Quote:


You sure about that?

Yes, especially on the defense that suddenly became soft in the middle. The defense got gashed up the middle giving up big runs late in games that cost them a few victories.

Not grokking this.

The Giants had Dex and Leo, plus Robinson who was amongst the very best run stuffers in the league last season. Plus Okereke playing like a beast. And yet we had the second worst run defense in the NFL. Wink had the right horses.

But we're going to take a step backwards?
RE: RE: RE: Step backward on both sides?  
Angel Eyes : 7/11/2024 9:10 am : link
In comment 16551561 HBart said:
Quote:
In comment 16551418 Jack Stroud said:


Quote:


In comment 16551249 5BowlsSoon said:


Quote:


You sure about that?

Yes, especially on the defense that suddenly became soft in the middle. The defense got gashed up the middle giving up big runs late in games that cost them a few victories.


Not grokking this.

The Giants had Dex and Leo, plus Robinson who was amongst the very best run stuffers in the league last season. Plus Okereke playing like a beast. And yet we had the second worst run defense in the NFL. Wink had the right horses.

But we're going to take a step backwards?

I'd chalk it up to Wink liking to use edges in a standup position, making them easier to root out.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Step backward on both sides?  
HBart : 7/11/2024 9:16 am : link
In comment 16551578 Angel Eyes said:
Quote:
In comment 16551561 HBart said:


Quote:


In comment 16551418 Jack Stroud said:


Quote:


In comment 16551249 5BowlsSoon said:


Quote:


You sure about that?

Yes, especially on the defense that suddenly became soft in the middle. The defense got gashed up the middle giving up big runs late in games that cost them a few victories.


Not grokking this.

The Giants had Dex and Leo, plus Robinson who was amongst the very best run stuffers in the league last season. Plus Okereke playing like a beast. And yet we had the second worst run defense in the NFL. Wink had the right horses.

But we're going to take a step backwards?


I'd chalk it up to Wink liking to use edges in a standup position, making them easier to root out.

Sounds like Bowen agrees with you with his comment about 4 guys with hands in the dirt
RE: I've watched enough football to know  
Brown_Hornet : 7/11/2024 9:35 am : link
In comment 16551271 j_rud said:
Quote:
often translates to "steep learning curve". Especially a zone heavy system that will require communication and familiarity with your teammates.
I read this more as understanding what the player sees rather than just going 100mph in the wrong direction.
Less about being familiar with teammates and more about trusting them and simply doing your job.
As an example, a player's gap responsibility is more important than simply "beating your man."
RE: I've watched enough football to know  
HBart : 7/11/2024 9:48 am : link
In comment 16551271 j_rud said:
Quote:
often translates to "steep learning curve". Especially a zone heavy system that will require communication and familiarity with your teammates.

You should watch the Schmeelk defensive player interviews. To a a man they all said this scheme was much simpler, and really excited about it.
RE: Wink  
mfsd : 7/11/2024 9:51 am : link
In comment 16551543 Archer said:
Quote:
I would have liked to see Burns playing for Wink.

Wink's defense is designed to put players in a position to win a one-on-one situation.


I actually disagree with this. Wink’s scheme was designed to overload the pass blocking and allow a blitzer to come free. This often meant the edge player’s job was to occupy blockers and keep contain, not try to beat their man one on one. I think this is why top edge rushers haven’t often racked up huge sack numbers under Wink, but his defenses typically have more sacks by blitzing DBs (wasn’t KT the first edge to have double digit sacks in a Wink defense last year?)

From what we’ve read, Bowen’s scheme is much more predicated on relying on the front four to beat their man one on one (and potentially better for KT and Burns to have big individual seasons)
RE: RE: RE: Step backward on both sides?  
jhibb : 7/11/2024 9:59 am : link
In comment 16551561 HBart said:
Quote:
In comment 16551418 Jack Stroud said:


Quote:


In comment 16551249 5BowlsSoon said:


Quote:


You sure about that?

Yes, especially on the defense that suddenly became soft in the middle. The defense got gashed up the middle giving up big runs late in games that cost them a few victories.


Not grokking this.

The Giants had Dex and Leo, plus Robinson who was amongst the very best run stuffers in the league last season. Plus Okereke playing like a beast. And yet we had the second worst run defense in the NFL. Wink had the right horses.

But we're going to take a step backwards?


The quote from the article was saying that they took a step backwards last year from the year before, not that they are taking a step backwards with the change in DC.
Daboll Said It In Hard Knocks  
Costy16 : 7/11/2024 1:39 pm : link
Wants a DC who knows how to scheme to stop the run. Wink's defenses were atrocious against the run.
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