Maybe getting paid took away some of the desire and drive? I think with his back against the wall and his career on the line along with a far more well rounded cast he has a big season.
Being ready for camp was on the optimistic, but not unrealistic side of the return window.
He had surgery on November 22 and 8 months forward is July 22.
At first glance I was a little skeptical he'd be ready, but after researching how quickly other players have returned recently, I was convinced his ACL injury wasn't going to be a factor in him being a Giant/starter this year.
It's simply not a devastating injury for a quarterback.
It looks like he’s worked on shortening up his release. Looks more compact than in years past and more use of different angles.
The other thing I noticed is he is moving with a more narrow base. He did one of these workouts last year and I felt like his base was very wide and put him in what looked to be slightly awkward posture to throw out of.
Of course let’s see if any of this carries over to the regular season. Also needs to be better at reading a defense if he’s going to truly take the next step as a QB.
The only thing PUP does at this point is preclude him from practicing. He still counts against the 90-man roster.
The only incentive to PUP him would be if they thought he was a risk to not be ready opening day, and the roster exemption that provides. And that would require him to miss 4 games.
They'll likely just manage his workload accordingly, and not PUP him.
of his career. His range of outcomes is so wide. He can either be the starting QB of the Giants next year as the team continues to upgrade the roster around him or he could be a backup QB sonewhere with a 90% pay cut. Huge stakes for DJ in 2024.
If Jones plays at the start of the season he will need to be a pocket
Doubt he gets much time in preseason games. I expect some early season issues getting acclimated to live action again.
He was getting a little gun shy imv during that really horrific three game stretch of SF, Sea, and Mia. OL and run game were dreadful which made it exceptionally hard on DJ.
Be interesting to see if any lingering impact early.
Big, strong, agile, and accurate. But then sucks on the field. There has to be a mental side of the game that has not clicked with Jones.
I think his issues have always been 100% mental. The question is why? And is it correctable? He’s got 3 big improvements going for him this year: OC stability, a much better OL coach that should translate, and much better talent all around him. There can be no more excuses or rationalizations.
RE: If Jones plays at the start of the season he will need to be a pocket
QB only, which takes away a lot of his effectiveness. Not sure he can perform as a "pocket only" guy
Probably not but if the OL can just be average, which is something we’ve barely seen with Jones here, he has a shot to be solid without running. Add in an elite talent like Nabers and there’s something to get excited about, IMO.
If he's working on throwing from different slots or has his release point lowered?
You notice he's using very little lower body and almost "whipping" the ball, however I don't know if this is possibly intentional as QBs like Mahomes and Rogers use a similar arm slot to shorten their release in certain situations.
RE: If Jones plays at the start of the season he will need to be a pocket
Has he really always played well in shorts? There was a lot of criticism of his 2022 training camp and he followed that up by earning $82M in guarantees when the pads came on.
He seemed to lock onto his primary receiver and he lacked a quick release. Neither of these shortcomings involve mobility. It will be interesting to see if there's improvement.
he dragged his back foot so much. Is that intentional, from a mechanics standpoint I mean?
He's stepping into his throws.
That's a good thing.
Stepping in with the front, but I thought dragging the back took away velocity. At least that's something I was taught throwing a baseball a thousand years ago.
Maybe getting paid took away some of the desire and drive? I think with his back against the wall and his career on the line along with a far more well rounded cast he has a big season.
Honestly I hope he does. I hope he has a winning season and over 30 total TDs.
I'm sure Cutcliffe set him up with David Morris/QB Country. Cut coached Morris at Ole Miss. And DJ looks markedly more built, too. Hope he serves a lot of crow this year.
Maybe getting paid took away some of the desire and drive? I think with his back against the wall and his career on the line along with a far more well rounded cast he has a big season.
That would certainly poke a lot of holes in the "nobody works harder than Daniel" declaration we've heard ad nauseum.
RE: RE: If Jones plays at the start of the season he will need to be a pocket
QB only, which takes away a lot of his effectiveness. Not sure he can perform as a "pocket only" guy
Why? He looks terriffic, and said he's actually already making sharper cuts now than prior to the injury.
Players don't just recover from these things immediately. He is in shorts, so it doesn't mean all that much. Wait until he gets under real pas pressure, and wait until he takes a hit or two. These things are as much mental as physical. He will be worried the knee will break again, get tentative and protect it a little, etc. Everyone does until they regain full confidence. Just because he runs around in shorts with no pressure doesn't mean he's all the way back. I would bet it takes 1/4 of the season for him to feel comfortable again.
Plus as pointed out above, its never really about his physical attributes it is about his mental ones. If as I suggest he stays in the pocket a lot more, that puts even more emphasis on his processing and ability to anticipate. So far in his career these are not his strongest points.
From what I've read, and the info might be a bit......
dated at this point, the risk of reinjuring the knee after an ACL redo is substantially higher at 8 months when returning to full athletic competition. Ten months you should be good to go.
This may be what Schoen was alluding to when he mentioned Jones might not be a go until 3 or 4 weeks into the season.
And I know others have come back at 8 months (Adrian Peterson).
Peterson's return in eight months and two weeks is regarded as the greatest, most successful one from a torn ACL and knee reconstruction in recent sports history. National stories on Peterson in that 2012 NFL season had headlines such as “Adrian Peterson: Best ACL recovery ever?”
Has he really always played well in shorts? There was a lot of criticism of his 2022 training camp and he followed that up by earning $82M in guarantees when the pads came on.
What a heartwarming tale. Almost as much fun to remember as thinking back to when you were still a credible poster instead of a DJ fanboi.
An alarming lack of velocity, accuracy, and overall arm talent that will only get worse when you add a pass rush.
WOW! That's great, you can analyze all that from a 10 second tape.
Did you see on hard knocks where Schoen and his PR guy were talking about the mouth breathers trying to analyze body language during press conferences. Same thing here. Anyone who attempts to garner anything beyond Jones moving around pretty good 8 months post op from that tape is an idiot.
Big, strong, agile, and accurate. But then sucks on the field. There has to be a mental side of the game that has not clicked with Jones.
I think his issues have always been 100% mental. The question is why? And is it correctable? He’s got 3 big improvements going for him this year: OC stability, a much better OL coach that should translate, and much better talent all around him. There can be no more excuses or rationalizations.
Big, strong, agile, and accurate. But then sucks on the field. There has to be a mental side of the game that has not clicked with Jones.
I think his issues have always been 100% mental. The question is why? And is it correctable? He’s got 3 big improvements going for him this year: OC stability, a much better OL coach that should translate, and much better talent all around him. There can be no more excuses or rationalizations.
I can answer the question: OL
Weird that he has the same problems now as he did in college despite everyone around him being different
He is clearly there with the upper tier of QBs in terms of athleticism, but it’s between the ears that has him rated so poorly IMO. He hasn’t been able to read defenses well enough and get the ball out to the right read. Pressure will do that, however it’s been noted that even when he’s had a little bit of time, that he still has the same processing issues. If he’s a one read and go guy, then he clearly will be gone after next season.
Maybe getting paid took away some of the desire and drive? I think with his back against the wall and his career on the line along with a far more well rounded cast he has a big season.
He’s barely pushing off on his right leg, I think it’s pretty easy to see this isn’t a velocity drill, it’s just reps.
He had surgery on November 22 and 8 months forward is July 22.
At first glance I was a little skeptical he'd be ready, but after researching how quickly other players have returned recently, I was convinced his ACL injury wasn't going to be a factor in him being a Giant/starter this year.
It's simply not a devastating injury for a quarterback.
The other thing I noticed is he is moving with a more narrow base. He did one of these workouts last year and I felt like his base was very wide and put him in what looked to be slightly awkward posture to throw out of.
Of course let’s see if any of this carries over to the regular season. Also needs to be better at reading a defense if he’s going to truly take the next step as a QB.
The only thing PUP does at this point is preclude him from practicing. He still counts against the 90-man roster.
The only incentive to PUP him would be if they thought he was a risk to not be ready opening day, and the roster exemption that provides. And that would require him to miss 4 games.
They'll likely just manage his workload accordingly, and not PUP him.
That’s his injured leg, don’t think we are seeing his full lower half motion.
That's a good thing.
He was getting a little gun shy imv during that really horrific three game stretch of SF, Sea, and Mia. OL and run game were dreadful which made it exceptionally hard on DJ.
Be interesting to see if any lingering impact early.
I think his issues have always been 100% mental. The question is why? And is it correctable? He’s got 3 big improvements going for him this year: OC stability, a much better OL coach that should translate, and much better talent all around him. There can be no more excuses or rationalizations.
Probably not but if the OL can just be average, which is something we’ve barely seen with Jones here, he has a shot to be solid without running. Add in an elite talent like Nabers and there’s something to get excited about, IMO.
You notice he's using very little lower body and almost "whipping" the ball, however I don't know if this is possibly intentional as QBs like Mahomes and Rogers use a similar arm slot to shorten their release in certain situations.
Why? He looks terriffic, and said he's actually already making sharper cuts now than prior to the injury.
Quote:
he dragged his back foot so much. Is that intentional, from a mechanics standpoint I mean?
He's stepping into his throws.
That's a good thing.
Stepping in with the front, but I thought dragging the back took away velocity. At least that's something I was taught throwing a baseball a thousand years ago.
lol yeah no
Maybe getting paid took away some of the desire and drive? I think with his back against the wall and his career on the line along with a far more well rounded cast he has a big season.
Honestly I hope he does. I hope he has a winning season and over 30 total TDs.
He is moving well in the video. Should be ready for training camp
Maybe getting paid took away some of the desire and drive? I think with his back against the wall and his career on the line along with a far more well rounded cast he has a big season.
That would certainly poke a lot of holes in the "nobody works harder than Daniel" declaration we've heard ad nauseum.
Quote:
QB only, which takes away a lot of his effectiveness. Not sure he can perform as a "pocket only" guy
Why? He looks terriffic, and said he's actually already making sharper cuts now than prior to the injury.
Players don't just recover from these things immediately. He is in shorts, so it doesn't mean all that much. Wait until he gets under real pas pressure, and wait until he takes a hit or two. These things are as much mental as physical. He will be worried the knee will break again, get tentative and protect it a little, etc. Everyone does until they regain full confidence. Just because he runs around in shorts with no pressure doesn't mean he's all the way back. I would bet it takes 1/4 of the season for him to feel comfortable again.
Plus as pointed out above, its never really about his physical attributes it is about his mental ones. If as I suggest he stays in the pocket a lot more, that puts even more emphasis on his processing and ability to anticipate. So far in his career these are not his strongest points.
This may be what Schoen was alluding to when he mentioned Jones might not be a go until 3 or 4 weeks into the season.
And I know others have come back at 8 months (Adrian Peterson).
Peterson's return in eight months and two weeks is regarded as the greatest, most successful one from a torn ACL and knee reconstruction in recent sports history. National stories on Peterson in that 2012 NFL season had headlines such as “Adrian Peterson: Best ACL recovery ever?”
Quote:
I'm more worried about Sundays in pads.
Has he really always played well in shorts? There was a lot of criticism of his 2022 training camp and he followed that up by earning $82M in guarantees when the pads came on.
What a heartwarming tale. Almost as much fun to remember as thinking back to when you were still a credible poster instead of a DJ fanboi.
Phillip Rivers played the AFC Championship on a torn ACL and meniscus and had surgery and didn't miss a game the next season.
Let's see if he has a pocket this year. Last year it was more like a sieve.
WOW! That's great, you can analyze all that from a 10 second tape.
Yeah. Its called getting this shit knocked out of you in 0.8 seconds every drop back.
Lets see what happens if he has a little time and something that resembles a consistent pocket.
Quote:
An alarming lack of velocity, accuracy, and overall arm talent that will only get worse when you add a pass rush.
WOW! That's great, you can analyze all that from a 10 second tape.
Did you see on hard knocks where Schoen and his PR guy were talking about the mouth breathers trying to analyze body language during press conferences. Same thing here. Anyone who attempts to garner anything beyond Jones moving around pretty good 8 months post op from that tape is an idiot.
Quote:
Big, strong, agile, and accurate. But then sucks on the field. There has to be a mental side of the game that has not clicked with Jones.
I think his issues have always been 100% mental. The question is why? And is it correctable? He’s got 3 big improvements going for him this year: OC stability, a much better OL coach that should translate, and much better talent all around him. There can be no more excuses or rationalizations.
I can answer the question: OL
Quote:
In comment 16552366 JoeyBigBlue said:
Quote:
Big, strong, agile, and accurate. But then sucks on the field. There has to be a mental side of the game that has not clicked with Jones.
I think his issues have always been 100% mental. The question is why? And is it correctable? He’s got 3 big improvements going for him this year: OC stability, a much better OL coach that should translate, and much better talent all around him. There can be no more excuses or rationalizations.
I can answer the question: OL
Weird that he has the same problems now as he did in college despite everyone around him being different