Bobby Skinner
@BobbySkinner_
Giants Training Camp Day 9 thoughts
•Last day before joint practices so seemed like a light day
•Brian Burns is stacking great practices. Even getting wins v. Andrew Thomas
•Greg Van Roten hasn’t taken a single Guard snap in camp
•DT Elijah Chatman is quick and getting more opportunities. Think he could be a preseason darling
•Seems Andru Phillips has establish himself as the nickel CB
Daniel Jones went 9/11 in practice 9 of Giants camp with 1 TD & 1 INT.
Light day but touchdown was probably a Brian Burns sack when Greg Van Roten snapped the ball early. Interception was a drop from Daniel Bellinger to Jason Pinnock.
Pat Leonard
@PLeonardNYDN
Daniel Jones completed several early passes to multiple receivers today, then Daniel Bellinger dropped a pass that Jason Pinnock INTd.
Had Brian Burns down for two sacks in a limited practice that included a long, late walkthrough with the #Lions joint practices starting tomorrow vs #Giants
Drew Lock also hit Isaiah McKenzie for a TD on a slant with Tre Herndon trailing in coverage
Ryan Dunleavy
@rydunleavy
·
1m
#Giants Daniel Jones started 5 for 5 passing to 4 different receivers until this INT. A little high but catchable and through Daniel Bellinger’s hands to Jason Pinnock https://x.com/rydunleavy/status/1820107870785995004 - ( New Window )
Jordan Raanan
@JordanRaanan
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4m
Giants players + coaches greeting fans after lighter practice Sunday. Makes sense with Lions coming for joint practices on Monday and Tuesday.
QB Daniel Jones looked good in the limited team reps Sunday. But so did Brian Burns. A few completions could’ve been would-be sacks.
Bobby Skinner
@BobbySkinner_
Giants Training Camp Day 9 thoughts
•Last day before joint practices so seemed like a light day
•Brian Burns is stacking great practices. Even getting wins v. Andrew Thomas •Greg Van Roten hasn’t taken a single Guard snap in camp
•DT Elijah Chatman is quick and getting more opportunities. Think he could be a preseason darling
•Seems Andru Phillips has establish himself as the nickel CB
Daniel Jones went 9/11 in practice 9 of Giants camp with 1 TD & 1 INT.
Light day but touchdown was probably a Brian Burns sack when Greg Van Roten snapped the ball early. Interception was a drop from Daniel Bellinger to Jason Pinnock.
Is this true? I thought he got some reps at RG when another C was in.
Hopefully the FA's added don't get hurt but even with those players the OL seems a bit light.
Giants FO has screwed up the OL for close to fifteen years now. Failed to replace the last good Giants OL and then they relied on FA's who didn't pan out and then reached in the draft. Taking Toney over a RT was huge mistake.
OL should be added every year in the draft. You should also try to replace either a starter or depth player every year with a more talented and cost effective player.
Roseman's draft style is you always take the OL/DL in the draft when BPA.
Eagles always have 12 draft picks. We always have 6.
Bobby Skinner
@BobbySkinner_
Giants Training Camp Day 9 thoughts
•Last day before joint practices so seemed like a light day
•Brian Burns is stacking great practices. Even getting wins v. Andrew Thomas
•Greg Van Roten hasn’t taken a single Guard snap in camp
•DT Elijah Chatman is quick and getting more opportunities. Think he could be a preseason darling
•Seems Andru Phillips has establish himself as the nickel CB
Daniel Jones went 9/11 in practice 9 of Giants camp with 1 TD & 1 INT.
Light day but touchdown was probably a Brian Burns sack when Greg Van Roten snapped the ball early. Interception was a drop from Daniel Bellinger to Jason Pinnock.
Is this true? I thought he got some reps at RG when another C was in.
I guess it is true. I went back and looked. When he was signed, all the beats said C and RG. However, in the practice tweets, there have only been mentions of C during practice.
obviously DJ is the #1 thing this season that will determine success
But the regime will get a mulligan on DJ and an out even though they gave him the contract.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Hopefully the FA's added don't get hurt but even with those players the OL seems a bit light.
Giants FO has screwed up the OL for close to fifteen years now. Failed to replace the last good Giants OL and then they relied on FA's who didn't pan out and then reached in the draft. Taking Toney over a RT was huge mistake.
OL should be added every year in the draft. You should also try to replace either a starter or depth player every year with a more talented and cost effective player.
Roseman's draft style is you always take the OL/DL in the draft when BPA.
Eagles always have 12 draft picks. We always have 6.
And yet we have 4 Super Bowls and they have 1.
Great. Why bother looking at the present when you can lose yourself in the past?
RE: obviously DJ is the #1 thing this season that will determine success
But the regime will get a mulligan on DJ and an out even though they gave him the contract.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Why would you want to bring in a veteran at safety for a team with Belton, Pinnock, and Nubin already on the roster? Riley and Mills are here as vets. Owens and Johnson are flashing. That makes no sense.
But the regime will get a mulligan on DJ and an out even though they gave him the contract.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Most of this most is plain BS. The line isn't swapping play to play like last year. They are filling holes from injury but the IOL is IOL and the OTs are OTs. And you must familiarize a number of players with other spots - they only carry 8 OL on game day.
The secondary I think will be ok. I like the young guys being out there. They seem to be doing well. CB2 is the biggest ?? and they have a mix of vets and young guys.
If they want a vet or two, the best time is after cut day. There will be plenty of decent players looking for a spot and available if Bowen needs a DB.
RE: RE: RE: Neal and JMS both need to work which makes this worse
Hopefully the FA's added don't get hurt but even with those players the OL seems a bit light.
Giants FO has screwed up the OL for close to fifteen years now. Failed to replace the last good Giants OL and then they relied on FA's who didn't pan out and then reached in the draft. Taking Toney over a RT was huge mistake.
OL should be added every year in the draft. You should also try to replace either a starter or depth player every year with a more talented and cost effective player.
Roseman's draft style is you always take the OL/DL in the draft when BPA.
Eagles always have 12 draft picks. We always have 6.
And yet we have 4 Super Bowls and they have 1.
And that matters in the present how?
RE: RE: obviously DJ is the #1 thing this season that will determine success
But the regime will get a mulligan on DJ and an out even though they gave him the contract.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Why would you want to bring in a veteran at safety for a team with Belton, Pinnock, and Nubin already on the roster? Riley and Mills are here as vets. Owens and Johnson are flashing. That makes no sense.
i think this secondary group is ranked as one of the lowest in the nfl for a reason. while yes belton/pinnock/belton sound nice, but there is a lot of unprovenness youth here. Mills hasnt practiced once. I wish we had a sure fire starter at CB2.
But the regime will get a mulligan on DJ and an out even though they gave him the contract.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Most of this most is plain BS. The line isn't swapping play to play like last year. They are filling holes from injury but the IOL is IOL and the OTs are OTs. And you must familiarize a number of players with other spots - they only carry 8 OL on game day.
The secondary I think will be ok. I like the young guys being out there. They seem to be doing well. CB2 is the biggest ?? and they have a mix of vets and young guys.
If they want a vet or two, the best time is after cut day. There will be plenty of decent players looking for a spot and available if Bowen needs a DB.
disagree he had JE at G all spring now all of a sudden switch to T.
Greg Van Roten is a G, now playing a lot of C in his first few days despite playing almost no C in his life, same with Runyan.
Runyan was on his opposite side/C till recently.
you signed Schlottmann to a 2 year some gtd money to be the backup C, play him at C, and let the other 4 guys gel.
you need to trust backups to fill in instead of swapping 2-3 guys at a time.
we see who starts this Thursday vs the lions.
The proof will be in the pudding this season, the OL excuses for daboll/schoen will run out eventually. Their approach cant be dismissed as part of the equation.
But the regime will get a mulligan on DJ and an out even though they gave him the contract.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Why would you want to bring in a veteran at safety for a team with Belton, Pinnock, and Nubin already on the roster? Riley and Mills are here as vets. Owens and Johnson are flashing. That makes no sense.
Simmons is technically a safety too; at least he was part of the safety room interviews.
There are very few busts that are the product of a player not having the talent or the care to succeed. I believe most are a combination of injuries and then whatever impact that has on a player's motivation plus physical ability.
I feel really bad for Evan Neal the person, who is obviously very talented. But the Giants absolutely cannot rely on Evan Neal the player.
It's worse than that. Schmitz is falling into that category now. We don't really have a starting center.
I think there is a very good argument to be made drafting offensive lineman high is a bad investment.
Most lineman need substantial development to succeed in the NFL, moreso than other positions.
And when you factor in the dice roll of injuries, I think it's far better to plug in lower cost veterans and draft lineman regularly in the late rounds to develop.
The Giants are in a quagmire with JMS and Neal. Both high picks, both need development, both aren't getting it because of injury. And when they do get healthy they'll be behind, relatively expensive, and burned through a few years of cost control.
This is precisely what we did this year.
Whether the Giants made this conclusion or not, idk. But I think, to some degree, they knew their OL wasn’t performing even adequately, their college scouting process had failed them (Neal, JMS, Ezeudu), so they trusted their pro personnel to scout proven NFL functional performing OL instead.
Interesting that you use the phrase "college scouting process" instead of "college scouts". I guess the direction of what to look for in a candidate comes from the GM & HC while the evaluation includes the position coaches. So enough consensus participation to diffuse accountability.
RE: RE: RE: obviously DJ is the #1 thing this season that will determine success
disagree he had JE at G all spring now all of a sudden switch to T.
Greg Van Roten is a G, now playing a lot of C in his first few days despite playing almost no C in his life, same with Runyan.
Runyan was on his opposite side/C till recently.
you signed Schlottmann to a 2 year some gtd money to be the backup C, play him at C, and let the other 4 guys gel.
you need to trust backups to fill in instead of swapping 2-3 guys at a time.
we see who starts this Thursday vs the lions.
The proof will be in the pudding this season, the OL excuses for daboll/schoen will run out eventually. Their approach cant be dismissed as part of the equation.
Nobody gives a rats ass about OTAs. They expected Neal to be ready. But you would have to be dense not to realize Eluemunor was brought here to be the fall back should Neal not recover or faulter.
Stop thinking about OTAs - they are walkthroughs and class room sessions.
Look at what they are doing on the field. When it became clear Neal was behind, they brought in Van Roten to fill the guard spot next to Eluemunor because Eluemunor was moving to RT. JMS going down moved Van Roten to C but staying with the starters.
What they are doing is minimal swapping, but what would have been done anyway without injuries. The interior line has stayed interior sans Eluemunor who likely would have had RT time anyway.
The Giant Take Podcast
@TheGiantTakePod
Drew Lock to Isaiah Hodgins https://x.com/TheGiantTakePod/status/1820113561181376666 - ( New Window )
Watching Boogie Basham on these, he just so feels like JAG, the way he always looks … not sure he deserves a roster spot
I thought this trade was solely to fit Martindale's scheme; more big than athletic, in the mold of Jihad Ward. Basically Schoen traded for him so that he could spell Ward when needed. I don't see that he has a use on this defense.
I think it’s telling if we are referring to the team as ‘rebuilding’ considering the $ the QB is making and this being year 3 of Schoen/Dabs.
Beat me to it. But I would switch "telling" to "strange".
We have a premier LT, apparently a WR1, new additions to improve the OL, a good stable of RBs and TEs, three pass rushers, a terrific Mike, and a $160M QB under the tutelage of a wonderful offensive mind.
it is clear the Giants identify CB as one of the top needs. In a year where it is universally accepted the Giants won't be competing, why mortgage the future for a stop-gap that won't move the needle for a team not vying for a championship? Let the young guys they have fight for the spot and see if anyone develops.
At this point, the o-line has been pretty consistent of terms of the starting 5 and the current line-up forced by injuries. Aside from the first couple days of camp I haven't seen reports of the starting players being moved all over the line like last season. JMS and Neal have missed enough time now that for continuity sake I think they should both ride the bench unless there's an injury or they've earned their spot back. Or if Van Roten is awful at C.
I'm getting mentally prepared for the reports tomorrow when they get pushed around by a Super Bowl contending team, I don't think it's going to be pretty.
I think it’s telling if we are referring to the team as ‘rebuilding’ considering the $ the QB is making and this being year 3 of Schoen/Dabs.
Beat me to it. But I would switch "telling" to "strange".
We have a premier LT, apparently a WR1, new additions to improve the OL, a good stable of RBs and TEs, three pass rushers, a terrific Mike, and a $160M QB under the tutelage of a wonderful offensive mind.
Nothing strange about it. We have a very young team and no QB.
It would be stranger if we had an old team and no QB.
it is clear the Giants identify CB as one of the top needs. In a year where it is universally accepted the Giants won't be competing, why mortgage the future for a stop-gap that won't move the needle for a team not vying for a championship? Let the young guys they have fight for the spot and see if anyone develops.
At this point, the o-line has been pretty consistent of terms of the starting 5 and the current line-up forced by injuries. Aside from the first couple days of camp I haven't seen reports of the starting players being moved all over the line like last season. JMS and Neal have missed enough time now that for continuity sake I think they should both ride the bench unless there's an injury or they've earned their spot back. Or if Van Roten is awful at C.
I'm getting mentally prepared for the reports tomorrow when they get pushed around by a Super Bowl contending team, I don't think it's going to be pretty.
The problem is when you lose guys like Neal and Schmitz, who you were counting on in at least some role (and in this case starting), that impacts your depth. So you're second-team line now has 3rd teamers on it. Hence, you see guys like Mayfield and Miles playing on the second unit.
it is clear the Giants identify CB as one of the top needs. In a year where it is universally accepted the Giants won't be competing, why mortgage the future for a stop-gap that won't move the needle for a team not vying for a championship? Let the young guys they have fight for the spot and see if anyone develops.
At this point, the o-line has been pretty consistent of terms of the starting 5 and the current line-up forced by injuries. Aside from the first couple days of camp I haven't seen reports of the starting players being moved all over the line like last season. JMS and Neal have missed enough time now that for continuity sake I think they should both ride the bench unless there's an injury or they've earned their spot back. Or if Van Roten is awful at C.
I'm getting mentally prepared for the reports tomorrow when they get pushed around by a Super Bowl contending team, I don't think it's going to be pretty.
The problem is when you lose guys like Neal and Schmitz, who you were counting on in at least some role (and in this case starting), that impacts your depth. So you're second-team line now has 3rd teamers on it. Hence, you see guys like Mayfield and Miles playing on the second unit.
Very true, if Neal and JMS injuries last well into the season they are pretty much fucked the moment someone goes down. Giants have not had good luck with any player they say is 'day-to-day' or is being monitored without clarification of the injury.
I think it’s telling if we are referring to the team as ‘rebuilding’ considering the $ the QB is making and this being year 3 of Schoen/Dabs.
Why don't you give the whole website a break and take a month off from making ANY reference to Daniel Jones. You have been relentless making your opinion known in a thousand and one ways. Is enough ever enough.
I think it’s telling if we are referring to the team as ‘rebuilding’ considering the $ the QB is making and this being year 3 of Schoen/Dabs.
Beat me to it. But I would switch "telling" to "strange".
We have a premier LT, apparently a WR1, new additions to improve the OL, a good stable of RBs and TEs, three pass rushers, a terrific Mike, and a $160M QB under the tutelage of a wonderful offensive mind.
See my comment above to SFGFNCGiantsFan and add you to same relentless people about Daniel Jones. Beyond tiresome
Dan Duggan
@DDuggan21
Notes from today's practice:
• Daniel Jones was accurate/efficient on a steady diet of short/intermediate passes. He had an interception on a pass that went right through Daniel Bellinger's hands to Jason Pinnock. Bellinger only has one catch from Jones in team drills during camp.
• Jones hit Wan'Dale Robinson for a long TD on an ugly play for both sides. Some of the OL didn't move immediately when Greg Van Roten snapped the ball. Robinson ran straight up the seam from the slot. He ran right past Pinnock, who raised his hands after the play toward rookie corner Dru Phillips, who was covering a receiver on the outside on the play. Brian Burns would have had a sack on the play.
• Phillips has been getting first-team reps at slot corner the past three practices. Didn't see Nick McCloud get any reps in team periods today. Likely just a rest day.
• Cor'Dale Flott has been better the best two practices. Seems like his coverage is better on underneath routes. His problem has been the deep ball.
• Burns was in the backfield a lot. On one play, Andrew Thomas shifted to the right side pre-snap and Burns beat him. Jones was trying to go deep on the play and then scrambled after the Burns "sack."
• Elijah Chatman continues to get a first-team reps. He had a "sack" today.
• Isaiah McKenzie has been more active recently. He would have had a TD on a slant catch-and-run from Drew Lock after beating Tre Herndon, who was getting second-team slot corner reps.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Neal and JMS both need to work which makes this worse
I think it’s telling if we are referring to the team as ‘rebuilding’ considering the $ the QB is making and this being year 3 of Schoen/Dabs.
Why don't you give the whole website a break and take a month off from making ANY reference to Daniel Jones. You have been relentless making your opinion known in a thousand and one ways. Is enough ever enough.
Thanks!! Was waiting for someone to say that. What an insufferable bore.
People can't see two different statements being true at the sane time. Yes, we paid our QB but at the sane time the team was rebuilding. Why can't you see that?
Giants went 9-7-1 in 2022 and made the playoffs, with one playoff win on the road. *At the same time that team had skill players like Issaih Hodgins, Marcus Johnson, Richie James and Kenny Golladay. Our TE's were Bellinger, Hudson and Myarick..
2023 was a disaster but we know our skill positions are getting improved but our Oline was epically bad..
So 2024, we have a QB who needs to prove his worth or is gone but our rebuilding continues with a MUCH better skill position group, supposedly better Oline and possibly at TE..
None of this includes all our defensive changes..
We are still rebuilding the roster but our talent is definitely improved since 2022..
People can't see two different statements being true at the sane time. Yes, we paid our QB but at the sane time the team was rebuilding. Why can't you see that?
Giants went 9-7-1 in 2022 and made the playoffs, with one playoff win on the road. *At the same time that team had skill players like Issaih Hodgins, Marcus Johnson, Richie James and Kenny Golladay. Our TE's were Bellinger, Hudson and Myarick..
2023 was a disaster but we know our skill positions are getting improved but our Oline was epically bad..
So 2024, we have a QB who needs to prove his worth or is gone but our rebuilding continues with a MUCH better skill position group, supposedly better Oline and possibly at TE..
None of this includes all our defensive changes..
We are still rebuilding the roster but our talent is definitely improved since 2022..
I know he pisses a lot of people off but I think the switch in DCs would help him out with his style of play.
Two things: Seems Phillips is impressing at slot rendering Holmes a bit on the bubble, given that, holding warts and all, was the position he’d mostly played for 4 years; and as far as a possible boundary CB, staff may be preoccupied with the other candidates, since they likely know what they have in Holmes.
We are still rebuilding the roster but our talent is definitely improved since 2022..
Well, you don't know definitively. Like all of us, you are guessing and hoping.
On paper, our roster is different and could be better. But the results will reveal exactly what we have.
I disagree a bit with your point. We do know- Nabers, WDR , Hyatt and Slayton is better than our 2022 group. They just are. The Oline is better- on paper, the TE group is at least equal but has more potential. The defense up front is superior to 22- we are rebuilding but the talent level is better.. Proven results to come of course but the talent levels have improved.
@Connor_J_Hughes
Very light day for the #Giants. Understandable with the #Lions coming to town tomorrow.
Daniel Jones was 7 of 9 passing with an interception. It was not his fault. Ball went in-and-out of Daniel Bellinger’s hands, who’s had a quiet camp.
Three sacks by Brian Burns erased two other completions — one a touchdown to WanDale Robinson. No pads, so defense has edge.
@Connor_J_Hughes
Very light day for the #Giants. Understandable with the #Lions coming to town tomorrow.
Daniel Jones was 7 of 9 passing with an interception. It was not his fault. Ball went in-and-out of Daniel Bellinger’s hands, who’s had a quiet camp.
Three sacks by Brian Burns erased two other completions — one a touchdown to WanDale Robinson. No pads, so defense has edge.
BTW, with Connor's tweets (on trends), keep in mind he spends half his days with the Jets.
@BobbySkinner_
Giants Training Camp Day 9 thoughts
•Last day before joint practices so seemed like a light day
•Brian Burns is stacking great practices. Even getting wins v. Andrew Thomas
•Greg Van Roten hasn’t taken a single Guard snap in camp
•DT Elijah Chatman is quick and getting more opportunities. Think he could be a preseason darling
•Seems Andru Phillips has establish himself as the nickel CB
Daniel Jones went 9/11 in practice 9 of Giants camp with 1 TD & 1 INT.
Light day but touchdown was probably a Brian Burns sack when Greg Van Roten snapped the ball early. Interception was a drop from Daniel Bellinger to Jason Pinnock.
@PLeonardNYDN
Daniel Jones completed several early passes to multiple receivers today, then Daniel Bellinger dropped a pass that Jason Pinnock INTd.
Had Brian Burns down for two sacks in a limited practice that included a long, late walkthrough with the #Lions joint practices starting tomorrow vs #Giants
Drew Lock also hit Isaiah McKenzie for a TD on a slant with Tre Herndon trailing in coverage
@TheGiantTakePod
·
1m
New York #Giants Training Camp Day 9 KEY TAKEAWAY…
https://x.com/TheGiantTakePod/status/1820127027401494748 - ( New Window )
Quote:
Ryan Dunleavy
@rydunleavy
·
1m
#Giants Daniel Jones started 5 for 5 passing to 4 different receivers until this INT. A little high but catchable and through Daniel Bellinger’s hands to Jason Pinnock https://x.com/rydunleavy/status/1820107870785995004 - ( New Window )
That pass wasn't high. Ryan's high.
LOL. And true.
@JordanRaanan
·
4m
Giants players + coaches greeting fans after lighter practice Sunday. Makes sense with Lions coming for joint practices on Monday and Tuesday.
QB Daniel Jones looked good in the limited team reps Sunday. But so did Brian Burns. A few completions could’ve been would-be sacks.
@BobbySkinner_
Giants Training Camp Day 9 thoughts
•Last day before joint practices so seemed like a light day
•Brian Burns is stacking great practices. Even getting wins v. Andrew Thomas
•Greg Van Roten hasn’t taken a single Guard snap in camp
•DT Elijah Chatman is quick and getting more opportunities. Think he could be a preseason darling
•Seems Andru Phillips has establish himself as the nickel CB
Daniel Jones went 9/11 in practice 9 of Giants camp with 1 TD & 1 INT.
Light day but touchdown was probably a Brian Burns sack when Greg Van Roten snapped the ball early. Interception was a drop from Daniel Bellinger to Jason Pinnock.
Is this true? I thought he got some reps at RG when another C was in.
And a win if he turns out to be a pro bowl OL. The point is it's WAY too eary...
LOL What?!?!?! It is August 4.
Quote:
Hopefully the FA's added don't get hurt but even with those players the OL seems a bit light.
Giants FO has screwed up the OL for close to fifteen years now. Failed to replace the last good Giants OL and then they relied on FA's who didn't pan out and then reached in the draft. Taking Toney over a RT was huge mistake.
OL should be added every year in the draft. You should also try to replace either a starter or depth player every year with a more talented and cost effective player.
Roseman's draft style is you always take the OL/DL in the draft when BPA.
Eagles always have 12 draft picks. We always have 6.
And yet we have 4 Super Bowls and they have 1.
Quote:
Bobby Skinner
@BobbySkinner_
Giants Training Camp Day 9 thoughts
•Last day before joint practices so seemed like a light day
•Brian Burns is stacking great practices. Even getting wins v. Andrew Thomas
•Greg Van Roten hasn’t taken a single Guard snap in camp
•DT Elijah Chatman is quick and getting more opportunities. Think he could be a preseason darling
•Seems Andru Phillips has establish himself as the nickel CB
Daniel Jones went 9/11 in practice 9 of Giants camp with 1 TD & 1 INT.
Light day but touchdown was probably a Brian Burns sack when Greg Van Roten snapped the ball early. Interception was a drop from Daniel Bellinger to Jason Pinnock.
Is this true? I thought he got some reps at RG when another C was in.
I guess it is true. I went back and looked. When he was signed, all the beats said C and RG. However, in the practice tweets, there have only been mentions of C during practice.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
@giantswfan
·
25m
#Giants100 Thomas - trying to see that neal doesnt get discouraged...not easy to be out but he has right mindset
@Schmeelk
Here's what happened at
@Giants
practice on Sunday.
https://x.com/Schmeelk/status/1820133824300458076 - ( New Window )
Quote:
In comment 16567909 Lines of Scrimmage said:
Quote:
Hopefully the FA's added don't get hurt but even with those players the OL seems a bit light.
Giants FO has screwed up the OL for close to fifteen years now. Failed to replace the last good Giants OL and then they relied on FA's who didn't pan out and then reached in the draft. Taking Toney over a RT was huge mistake.
OL should be added every year in the draft. You should also try to replace either a starter or depth player every year with a more talented and cost effective player.
Roseman's draft style is you always take the OL/DL in the draft when BPA.
Eagles always have 12 draft picks. We always have 6.
And yet we have 4 Super Bowls and they have 1.
Great. Why bother looking at the present when you can lose yourself in the past?
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Why would you want to bring in a veteran at safety for a team with Belton, Pinnock, and Nubin already on the roster? Riley and Mills are here as vets. Owens and Johnson are flashing. That makes no sense.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Most of this most is plain BS. The line isn't swapping play to play like last year. They are filling holes from injury but the IOL is IOL and the OTs are OTs. And you must familiarize a number of players with other spots - they only carry 8 OL on game day.
The secondary I think will be ok. I like the young guys being out there. They seem to be doing well. CB2 is the biggest ?? and they have a mix of vets and young guys.
If they want a vet or two, the best time is after cut day. There will be plenty of decent players looking for a spot and available if Bowen needs a DB.
Quote:
In comment 16567909 Lines of Scrimmage said:
Quote:
Hopefully the FA's added don't get hurt but even with those players the OL seems a bit light.
Giants FO has screwed up the OL for close to fifteen years now. Failed to replace the last good Giants OL and then they relied on FA's who didn't pan out and then reached in the draft. Taking Toney over a RT was huge mistake.
OL should be added every year in the draft. You should also try to replace either a starter or depth player every year with a more talented and cost effective player.
Roseman's draft style is you always take the OL/DL in the draft when BPA.
Eagles always have 12 draft picks. We always have 6.
And yet we have 4 Super Bowls and they have 1.
And that matters in the present how?
Quote:
But the regime will get a mulligan on DJ and an out even though they gave him the contract.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Why would you want to bring in a veteran at safety for a team with Belton, Pinnock, and Nubin already on the roster? Riley and Mills are here as vets. Owens and Johnson are flashing. That makes no sense.
i think this secondary group is ranked as one of the lowest in the nfl for a reason. while yes belton/pinnock/belton sound nice, but there is a lot of unprovenness youth here. Mills hasnt practiced once. I wish we had a sure fire starter at CB2.
Sitting Nubin or Belton for a vet is just stupid.
Quote:
But the regime will get a mulligan on DJ and an out even though they gave him the contract.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Most of this most is plain BS. The line isn't swapping play to play like last year. They are filling holes from injury but the IOL is IOL and the OTs are OTs. And you must familiarize a number of players with other spots - they only carry 8 OL on game day.
The secondary I think will be ok. I like the young guys being out there. They seem to be doing well. CB2 is the biggest ?? and they have a mix of vets and young guys.
If they want a vet or two, the best time is after cut day. There will be plenty of decent players looking for a spot and available if Bowen needs a DB.
disagree he had JE at G all spring now all of a sudden switch to T.
Greg Van Roten is a G, now playing a lot of C in his first few days despite playing almost no C in his life, same with Runyan.
Runyan was on his opposite side/C till recently.
you signed Schlottmann to a 2 year some gtd money to be the backup C, play him at C, and let the other 4 guys gel.
you need to trust backups to fill in instead of swapping 2-3 guys at a time.
we see who starts this Thursday vs the lions.
The proof will be in the pudding this season, the OL excuses for daboll/schoen will run out eventually. Their approach cant be dismissed as part of the equation.
Sitting Nubin or Belton for a vet is just stupid.
i wouldnt go so far as rebuilding. This team should compete for 8-9 wins and a chance at the 7 seed imo.
having young/inexperienced all over the place at one position group/secondary group is often not a recipe for success.
This is a valid criticism. This is not outlandish to say.
Quote:
But the regime will get a mulligan on DJ and an out even though they gave him the contract.
but the OL and the secondary are on the GM/HC.
3 season of the OL especially.
Schoens failed/constantly injured draft picks.
Daboll unwillingness to let an OL gel and let people play positions that they have had success and natural position. this constant position switching could be his nail in the coffin if this teams goes 5-12. we cant say its the OL coach any more, this is coming from the top. 2nd OL coach now doing this stuff.
part of a HC job is to not let one position group ruin a team, get a position group to respectable. he has not managed to do that thus far.
the youth at secondary, with 10m+ cap space. there are legit starters out there that could be bought in that would be upgrades at S/CB. Mills has been hurt who was supposed to provide some experience. I understand we dont want to restructure but relying on the amount of young players with little to no experience we have all together at the same time is very scary. This is more on Schoen.
These two areas of the team so far are standing out like a sore thumb.
Why would you want to bring in a veteran at safety for a team with Belton, Pinnock, and Nubin already on the roster? Riley and Mills are here as vets. Owens and Johnson are flashing. That makes no sense.
Simmons is technically a safety too; at least he was part of the safety room interviews.
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In comment 16567860 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
There are very few busts that are the product of a player not having the talent or the care to succeed. I believe most are a combination of injuries and then whatever impact that has on a player's motivation plus physical ability.
I feel really bad for Evan Neal the person, who is obviously very talented. But the Giants absolutely cannot rely on Evan Neal the player.
It's worse than that. Schmitz is falling into that category now. We don't really have a starting center.
I think there is a very good argument to be made drafting offensive lineman high is a bad investment.
Most lineman need substantial development to succeed in the NFL, moreso than other positions.
And when you factor in the dice roll of injuries, I think it's far better to plug in lower cost veterans and draft lineman regularly in the late rounds to develop.
The Giants are in a quagmire with JMS and Neal. Both high picks, both need development, both aren't getting it because of injury. And when they do get healthy they'll be behind, relatively expensive, and burned through a few years of cost control.
This is precisely what we did this year.
Whether the Giants made this conclusion or not, idk. But I think, to some degree, they knew their OL wasn’t performing even adequately, their college scouting process had failed them (Neal, JMS, Ezeudu), so they trusted their pro personnel to scout proven NFL functional performing OL instead.
Interesting that you use the phrase "college scouting process" instead of "college scouts". I guess the direction of what to look for in a candidate comes from the GM & HC while the evaluation includes the position coaches. So enough consensus participation to diffuse accountability.
disagree he had JE at G all spring now all of a sudden switch to T.
Greg Van Roten is a G, now playing a lot of C in his first few days despite playing almost no C in his life, same with Runyan.
Runyan was on his opposite side/C till recently.
you signed Schlottmann to a 2 year some gtd money to be the backup C, play him at C, and let the other 4 guys gel.
you need to trust backups to fill in instead of swapping 2-3 guys at a time.
we see who starts this Thursday vs the lions.
The proof will be in the pudding this season, the OL excuses for daboll/schoen will run out eventually. Their approach cant be dismissed as part of the equation.
Nobody gives a rats ass about OTAs. They expected Neal to be ready. But you would have to be dense not to realize Eluemunor was brought here to be the fall back should Neal not recover or faulter.
Stop thinking about OTAs - they are walkthroughs and class room sessions.
Look at what they are doing on the field. When it became clear Neal was behind, they brought in Van Roten to fill the guard spot next to Eluemunor because Eluemunor was moving to RT. JMS going down moved Van Roten to C but staying with the starters.
What they are doing is minimal swapping, but what would have been done anyway without injuries. The interior line has stayed interior sans Eluemunor who likely would have had RT time anyway.
Quote:
The Giant Take Podcast
@TheGiantTakePod
Drew Lock to Isaiah Hodgins https://x.com/TheGiantTakePod/status/1820113561181376666 - ( New Window )
Watching Boogie Basham on these, he just so feels like JAG, the way he always looks … not sure he deserves a roster spot
I thought this trade was solely to fit Martindale's scheme; more big than athletic, in the mold of Jihad Ward. Basically Schoen traded for him so that he could spell Ward when needed. I don't see that he has a use on this defense.
having young/inexperienced all over the place at one position group/secondary group is often not a recipe for success.
This is a valid criticism. This is not outlandish to say.
The whole team is young.
You're living in la la land if you think this team is competing with the big boys. Let the young players play.
Thank you for being a voice of reason
Beat me to it. But I would switch "telling" to "strange".
We have a premier LT, apparently a WR1, new additions to improve the OL, a good stable of RBs and TEs, three pass rushers, a terrific Mike, and a $160M QB under the tutelage of a wonderful offensive mind.
At this point, the o-line has been pretty consistent of terms of the starting 5 and the current line-up forced by injuries. Aside from the first couple days of camp I haven't seen reports of the starting players being moved all over the line like last season. JMS and Neal have missed enough time now that for continuity sake I think they should both ride the bench unless there's an injury or they've earned their spot back. Or if Van Roten is awful at C.
I'm getting mentally prepared for the reports tomorrow when they get pushed around by a Super Bowl contending team, I don't think it's going to be pretty.
Quote:
I think it’s telling if we are referring to the team as ‘rebuilding’ considering the $ the QB is making and this being year 3 of Schoen/Dabs.
Beat me to it. But I would switch "telling" to "strange".
We have a premier LT, apparently a WR1, new additions to improve the OL, a good stable of RBs and TEs, three pass rushers, a terrific Mike, and a $160M QB under the tutelage of a wonderful offensive mind.
Nothing strange about it. We have a very young team and no QB.
It would be stranger if we had an old team and no QB.
At this point, the o-line has been pretty consistent of terms of the starting 5 and the current line-up forced by injuries. Aside from the first couple days of camp I haven't seen reports of the starting players being moved all over the line like last season. JMS and Neal have missed enough time now that for continuity sake I think they should both ride the bench unless there's an injury or they've earned their spot back. Or if Van Roten is awful at C.
I'm getting mentally prepared for the reports tomorrow when they get pushed around by a Super Bowl contending team, I don't think it's going to be pretty.
The problem is when you lose guys like Neal and Schmitz, who you were counting on in at least some role (and in this case starting), that impacts your depth. So you're second-team line now has 3rd teamers on it. Hence, you see guys like Mayfield and Miles playing on the second unit.
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it is clear the Giants identify CB as one of the top needs. In a year where it is universally accepted the Giants won't be competing, why mortgage the future for a stop-gap that won't move the needle for a team not vying for a championship? Let the young guys they have fight for the spot and see if anyone develops.
At this point, the o-line has been pretty consistent of terms of the starting 5 and the current line-up forced by injuries. Aside from the first couple days of camp I haven't seen reports of the starting players being moved all over the line like last season. JMS and Neal have missed enough time now that for continuity sake I think they should both ride the bench unless there's an injury or they've earned their spot back. Or if Van Roten is awful at C.
I'm getting mentally prepared for the reports tomorrow when they get pushed around by a Super Bowl contending team, I don't think it's going to be pretty.
The problem is when you lose guys like Neal and Schmitz, who you were counting on in at least some role (and in this case starting), that impacts your depth. So you're second-team line now has 3rd teamers on it. Hence, you see guys like Mayfield and Miles playing on the second unit.
Very true, if Neal and JMS injuries last well into the season they are pretty much fucked the moment someone goes down. Giants have not had good luck with any player they say is 'day-to-day' or is being monitored without clarification of the injury.
Why don't you give the whole website a break and take a month off from making ANY reference to Daniel Jones. You have been relentless making your opinion known in a thousand and one ways. Is enough ever enough.
Quote:
I think it’s telling if we are referring to the team as ‘rebuilding’ considering the $ the QB is making and this being year 3 of Schoen/Dabs.
Beat me to it. But I would switch "telling" to "strange".
We have a premier LT, apparently a WR1, new additions to improve the OL, a good stable of RBs and TEs, three pass rushers, a terrific Mike, and a $160M QB under the tutelage of a wonderful offensive mind.
See my comment above to SFGFNCGiantsFan and add you to same relentless people about Daniel Jones. Beyond tiresome
@DDuggan21
Notes from today's practice:
• Daniel Jones was accurate/efficient on a steady diet of short/intermediate passes. He had an interception on a pass that went right through Daniel Bellinger's hands to Jason Pinnock. Bellinger only has one catch from Jones in team drills during camp.
• Jones hit Wan'Dale Robinson for a long TD on an ugly play for both sides. Some of the OL didn't move immediately when Greg Van Roten snapped the ball. Robinson ran straight up the seam from the slot. He ran right past Pinnock, who raised his hands after the play toward rookie corner Dru Phillips, who was covering a receiver on the outside on the play. Brian Burns would have had a sack on the play.
• Phillips has been getting first-team reps at slot corner the past three practices. Didn't see Nick McCloud get any reps in team periods today. Likely just a rest day.
• Cor'Dale Flott has been better the best two practices. Seems like his coverage is better on underneath routes. His problem has been the deep ball.
• Burns was in the backfield a lot. On one play, Andrew Thomas shifted to the right side pre-snap and Burns beat him. Jones was trying to go deep on the play and then scrambled after the Burns "sack."
• Elijah Chatman continues to get a first-team reps. He had a "sack" today.
• Isaiah McKenzie has been more active recently. He would have had a TD on a slant catch-and-run from Drew Lock after beating Tre Herndon, who was getting second-team slot corner reps.
Quote:
I think it’s telling if we are referring to the team as ‘rebuilding’ considering the $ the QB is making and this being year 3 of Schoen/Dabs.
Why don't you give the whole website a break and take a month off from making ANY reference to Daniel Jones. You have been relentless making your opinion known in a thousand and one ways. Is enough ever enough.
Thanks!! Was waiting for someone to say that. What an insufferable bore.
Giants went 9-7-1 in 2022 and made the playoffs, with one playoff win on the road. *At the same time that team had skill players like Issaih Hodgins, Marcus Johnson, Richie James and Kenny Golladay. Our TE's were Bellinger, Hudson and Myarick..
2023 was a disaster but we know our skill positions are getting improved but our Oline was epically bad..
So 2024, we have a QB who needs to prove his worth or is gone but our rebuilding continues with a MUCH better skill position group, supposedly better Oline and possibly at TE..
None of this includes all our defensive changes..
We are still rebuilding the roster but our talent is definitely improved since 2022..
Giants went 9-7-1 in 2022 and made the playoffs, with one playoff win on the road. *At the same time that team had skill players like Issaih Hodgins, Marcus Johnson, Richie James and Kenny Golladay. Our TE's were Bellinger, Hudson and Myarick..
2023 was a disaster but we know our skill positions are getting improved but our Oline was epically bad..
So 2024, we have a QB who needs to prove his worth or is gone but our rebuilding continues with a MUCH better skill position group, supposedly better Oline and possibly at TE..
None of this includes all our defensive changes..
We are still rebuilding the roster but our talent is definitely improved since 2022..
I totally agree !!!
We are still rebuilding the roster but our talent is definitely improved since 2022..
Well, you don't know definitively. Like all of us, you are guessing and hoping.
On paper, our roster is different and could be better. But the results will reveal exactly what we have.
McCloud played a lot of safety too, although he may be needed more at CB this year.
Two things: Seems Phillips is impressing at slot rendering Holmes a bit on the bubble, given that, holding warts and all, was the position he’d mostly played for 4 years; and as far as a possible boundary CB, staff may be preoccupied with the other candidates, since they likely know what they have in Holmes.
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We are still rebuilding the roster but our talent is definitely improved since 2022..
Well, you don't know definitively. Like all of us, you are guessing and hoping.
On paper, our roster is different and could be better. But the results will reveal exactly what we have.
I disagree a bit with your point. We do know- Nabers, WDR , Hyatt and Slayton is better than our 2022 group. They just are. The Oline is better- on paper, the TE group is at least equal but has more potential. The defense up front is superior to 22- we are rebuilding but the talent level is better.. Proven results to come of course but the talent levels have improved.