He didn't have a strong season last year, but Wink's D was tough to learn for the entire Defensive players. Adoree Jackson won't have the role of CB1, but he's familiar with Bowen, isn't he?
to think. He does not seem to meet Bowen's tackling requirements.
I put this in the other thread... He only had about a 7.5% combined for '21/'22 miss tackle rate compared to 12.5% in 2023, while having 113 tackle in 23 games for '21/'22 which is pretty good for a CB.
He played in the slot last year, where you're more involved in stopping the run. He'll be back outside in this defense.
More zone from Bowen, which I assume is somewhat easier for an older (but not necessarily old) CB to play? That is, he won't be asked to "be out on an island" as much in Winks, defense I assume.
Didn't love bringing back a guy who so clearly half assed it last year, but I don't think he's making much difference. This defense is going to have plenty of people back in coverage; Burns and Thibodeaux are going to determine if they sink or swim.
I actually feel pretty good about the defense. I hated Martindale's defense - the best QBs are begging you to blitz.
Jackson failed, except for Dex, everybody else looked bad at one time or the other. Now under Bowen it’s a four man rush, with better players all over the field. No reason not to expect to good Adoree in ‘24.
Initially I liked the idea of Wink's ultra aggressive blitz defense. But it seemed like Wink was pretty much a "one trick pony" and to your point, the QBs that make you pay for blitzing really made Wink pay. The two Dallas games last year were atrocious defense.
I ended up agreeing with you about Wink's defense, especially the two DL look on obviously rushing downs.
Titians 2022 couldnt stop the pass. Titans 2023 couldn’t stop the run and the pass in the same game, it was one or the other but not both. I think there is room for skepticism.
The Giants have to be one of the laughing stocks of the NFL. They made no attempt to re-sign Jackson and there wasn’t exactly a crowd trying to sign him. Then, a week before the season, when they realize their appraisal of the secondary was deficient, he’s the savior. Check.
Titians 2022 couldnt stop the pass. Titans 2023 couldn’t stop the run and the pass in the same game, it was one or the other but not both. I think there is room for skepticism.
The Giants have to be one of the laughing stocks of the NFL. They made no attempt to re-sign Jackson and there wasn’t exactly a crowd trying to sign him. Then, a week before the season, when they realize their appraisal of the secondary was deficient, he’s the savior. Check.
Titians 2022 couldnt stop the pass. Titans 2023 couldn’t stop the run and the pass in the same game, it was one or the other but not both. I think there is room for skepticism.
The Giants have to be one of the laughing stocks of the NFL. They made no attempt to re-sign Jackson and there wasn’t exactly a crowd trying to sign him. Then, a week before the season, when they realize their appraisal of the secondary was deficient, he’s the savior. Check.
Smart strategy if they brought his price down. If not, not so much. Wasn't it said yesterday that we have less than $3M in cap space? I thought we had $10M after the Thomas restructure
The other guys had their chance to win the job
Adoree is the better option
And those worrying about the morale of the other CBs
They had their chance
What about the morale of the other 50 guys who want to win?
Didn't love bringing back a guy who so clearly half assed it last year, but I don't think he's making much difference. This defense is going to have plenty of people back in coverage; Burns and Thibodeaux are going to determine if they sink or swim.
I actually feel pretty good about the defense. I hated Martindale's defense - the best QBs are begging you to blitz.
+1, I completely agree. I am fine with Jackson back because he is guy who CAN play at a higher level. A lot of our other guys are trying to prove they can play at a high level.. Jackson just needs to be like the 2022 version- but no PR's..
emerge so we don't sign have to Kenny Golladay. ;)
Anyway, I was really hoping we would roll with the young corners and live with the growing pains. I never mind OTJT.
I think the posters who are critical of this move based on AJax's performance last raise good points. I have never been a big fan of rewarding bad behavior. But sometimes second chances do work...
on Flott all along, going back to last year. As many have said, we don't yet know what we have in Banks. As for AJ's '23, maybe he punted, but '23 was such a shit show from 4 minutes into Q1 of Game 1, reminds me of Jackrabbit who could still play but who clearly quit about mid way through 2017 season when it became clear the season was down the tubes. That doesn't excuse either one, but you do see it happen. We'll know soon enough
Well, they definitely taught AJ a lesson about dogging it in games
But what does a room like this do to morale? Guy isn’t on the team all offseason, misses all of training camp, and like two days later he’s back.
Do guys in the locker room care? Any resentment? Or as long as he helps them win, no one cares?
You do realize Strahan missed the whole camp the 07 superbowl season, right?
Lots of similarities to 2007. Very eerie.
Disrespected QB (Eli are you elite?)
Late to sign veteran (Strahan/Jackson)
Franchise RB leaves team (Barkley/Tiki)
"Stud" TE leaves team (Waller/Shockey)
New d-coordinator (Spags/Bowen)
OC under fire Kildrive/Kafka
I’m of two minds. Hate that one of the young guys didn’t take it but also like having a veteran out there. Also allows Flott to set a floor if the rookie struggles early on in the slot.
I’ll say this, I don’t recall anyone here calling this one. Bit of a curve ball from Schaboll.
RE: I feel like some people expect the Giants to sign a Pro Bowler on 8/30
He is a proven veteran at a position where we don't have tons of veterans or depth. I'll take it.
No, I think we were hoping that the front office and the coaches knew what they were doing going into preseason with Flott, McCloud or Hawkins at CB2. But apparently not.
lack of interest that the league had in him will both humble and inspire Adoree. He hasn’t played well as a Giant . His post-game comments have always been blame-shifting , “dog ate my homework,” “I had my coverage down, he …” variety . I’ve said this before : his act is reminiscent of a Jackson from a different era-Terry Jackson .
He might be an improvement . But he probably won’t be. I can see the Giants being pretty good this season. If Daboll and Nabers help raise the play of their QB, maybe even better than that . But this is a “coverages” oriented defense . The corners worry me. I’m not completely convinced by Banks yet .
Titians 2022 couldnt stop the pass. Titans 2023 couldn’t stop the run and the pass in the same game, it was one or the other but not both. I think there is room for skepticism.
The Giants have to be one of the laughing stocks of the NFL. They made no attempt to re-sign Jackson and there wasn’t exactly a crowd trying to sign him. Then, a week before the season, when they realize their appraisal of the secondary was deficient, he’s the savior. Check.
The “laughing stock of the NFL” because they signed a veteran CB which is the biggest weakness on the team and outside of offensive line- the biggest demand in the NFL. A veteran CB who hasn’t lost athleticism and is now a fraction of the cost.
You’re constantly a laughing stock here and my guess is most likely in your life you miserable old fuck.
No one will miss you as usual when things eventually turn well and you disappear- and I have a feeling that’s also the same in your life outside here as well.
We are in for a long season cause Adoree Jackson is past his prime and the guys behind them aren't starters.
You pray Banks is superb especially in the redzone.
You pray Nubin, Belton, Phillips and Pinnock all develop quickly together and make for a formidable group.
We can't afford to lose our first two games because our secondary gets exploited by weaker teams who can feast on a new scheme and young guys.
If we start 0 - 2 it is OVER for this season. There isn't enough talent to do better than 3-3 the next six tougher games and hope to come out better than .500 the rest of the way. The pundits may be right and perhaps we are in for a six win season despite a better overall talent base than last year.
Schoen missed on E. Neal and JMS (maybe...TBD) and that crushes the future cause if they were both Top 10 or 12 we'd be strong on offense this year without a doubt.
He is a proven veteran at a position where we don't have tons of veterans or depth. I'll take it.
No, I think we were hoping that the front office and the coaches knew what they were doing going into preseason with Flott, McCloud or Hawkins at CB2. But apparently not.
Kind of like last year with RG and swing tackle.
Great point. These coaches are fucking morons for letting the their planned CB2 get hurt and miss all preseason. Hard to believe any team would employ such yokels.
As an aside, I'm not worried yet about Banks, but he's had a rough summer apparently.
It is already Banks CB#1 and whomever CB#2
Exactly. But instead of one version or the other, my guess is that it's something in between the two. Let's just call that a hunch.
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Let's hope the '22 Adoree shows up, not the '23 version.
Exactly. But instead of one version or the other, my guess is that it's something in between the two. Let's just call that a hunch.
That’s both a reasonable expectation and still a needed upgrade
When does drafting good players become part of the process we should trust?
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to think. He does not seem to meet Bowen's tackling requirements.
I put this in the other thread... He only had about a 7.5% combined for '21/'22 miss tackle rate compared to 12.5% in 2023, while having 113 tackle in 23 games for '21/'22 which is pretty good for a CB.
He played in the slot last year, where you're more involved in stopping the run. He'll be back outside in this defense.
Flott and McCloud as back ups......not yikes
It might be a trade option down the road to pikcup addtional draft picks too.
As Bill said he’s probably the best we have.
He played in the slot last year, where you're more involved in stopping the run. He'll be back outside in this defense.
He was asked to play slot at the beginning of the year, when Hawkins played outside, but after Hawkins failed, Jackson moved out there.
PFF has 457 coverage snaps for Jackson in 2023: 336 outside and 115 in the slot.
I actually feel pretty good about the defense. I hated Martindale's defense - the best QBs are begging you to blitz.
I ended up agreeing with you about Wink's defense, especially the two DL look on obviously rushing downs.
Good point
My thought too. He doesn’t like contact as it is and prefers to hold on until help arrives.
Burns and maybe Chapman will make him a better corner.
The Giants have to be one of the laughing stocks of the NFL. They made no attempt to re-sign Jackson and there wasn’t exactly a crowd trying to sign him. Then, a week before the season, when they realize their appraisal of the secondary was deficient, he’s the savior. Check.
The Giants have to be one of the laughing stocks of the NFL. They made no attempt to re-sign Jackson and there wasn’t exactly a crowd trying to sign him. Then, a week before the season, when they realize their appraisal of the secondary was deficient, he’s the savior. Check.
Always the voice of reason
The Giants have to be one of the laughing stocks of the NFL. They made no attempt to re-sign Jackson and there wasn’t exactly a crowd trying to sign him. Then, a week before the season, when they realize their appraisal of the secondary was deficient, he’s the savior. Check.
Smart strategy if they brought his price down. If not, not so much. Wasn't it said yesterday that we have less than $3M in cap space? I thought we had $10M after the Thomas restructure
Adoree is the better option
And those worrying about the morale of the other CBs
They had their chance
What about the morale of the other 50 guys who want to win?
+1
Burns and maybe Chapman will make him a better corner.
3 things.
Chatman.
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to think. He does not seem to meet Bowen's tackling requirements.
Neither would Neon Sanders
No doubt. But he made the HoF.
I actually feel pretty good about the defense. I hated Martindale's defense - the best QBs are begging you to blitz.
+1, I completely agree. I am fine with Jackson back because he is guy who CAN play at a higher level. A lot of our other guys are trying to prove they can play at a high level.. Jackson just needs to be like the 2022 version- but no PR's..
I disagree.. Injuries held back the evaluations..
He's the proverbial "devil that you know."
Anyway, I was really hoping we would roll with the young corners and live with the growing pains. I never mind OTJT.
I think the posters who are critical of this move based on AJax's performance last raise good points. I have never been a big fan of rewarding bad behavior. But sometimes second chances do work...
I do hope he's on a short leash.
Do guys in the locker room care? Any resentment? Or as long as he helps them win, no one cares?
You do realize Strahan missed the whole camp the 07 superbowl season, right?
Perhaps so
His contract will tell the story there
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But what does a room like this do to morale? Guy isn’t on the team all offseason, misses all of training camp, and like two days later he’s back.
Do guys in the locker room care? Any resentment? Or as long as he helps them win, no one cares?
You do realize Strahan missed the whole camp the 07 superbowl season, right?
Lots of similarities to 2007. Very eerie.
Disrespected QB (Eli are you elite?)
Late to sign veteran (Strahan/Jackson)
Franchise RB leaves team (Barkley/Tiki)
"Stud" TE leaves team (Waller/Shockey)
New d-coordinator (Spags/Bowen)
OC under fire Kildrive/Kafka
Lets hope for the same result.
I’ll say this, I don’t recall anyone here calling this one. Bit of a curve ball from Schaboll.
No, I think we were hoping that the front office and the coaches knew what they were doing going into preseason with Flott, McCloud or Hawkins at CB2. But apparently not.
Kind of like last year with RG and swing tackle.
He might be an improvement . But he probably won’t be. I can see the Giants being pretty good this season. If Daboll and Nabers help raise the play of their QB, maybe even better than that . But this is a “coverages” oriented defense . The corners worry me. I’m not completely convinced by Banks yet .
The Giants have to be one of the laughing stocks of the NFL. They made no attempt to re-sign Jackson and there wasn’t exactly a crowd trying to sign him. Then, a week before the season, when they realize their appraisal of the secondary was deficient, he’s the savior. Check.
The “laughing stock of the NFL” because they signed a veteran CB which is the biggest weakness on the team and outside of offensive line- the biggest demand in the NFL. A veteran CB who hasn’t lost athleticism and is now a fraction of the cost.
You’re constantly a laughing stock here and my guess is most likely in your life you miserable old fuck.
No one will miss you as usual when things eventually turn well and you disappear- and I have a feeling that’s also the same in your life outside here as well.
You pray Banks is superb especially in the redzone.
You pray Nubin, Belton, Phillips and Pinnock all develop quickly together and make for a formidable group.
We can't afford to lose our first two games because our secondary gets exploited by weaker teams who can feast on a new scheme and young guys.
If we start 0 - 2 it is OVER for this season. There isn't enough talent to do better than 3-3 the next six tougher games and hope to come out better than .500 the rest of the way. The pundits may be right and perhaps we are in for a six win season despite a better overall talent base than last year.
Schoen missed on E. Neal and JMS (maybe...TBD) and that crushes the future cause if they were both Top 10 or 12 we'd be strong on offense this year without a doubt.
Do guys in the locker room care? Any resentment? Or as long as he helps them win, no one cares?
If guys care more about that than about improving the roster to win a championship, then I dont want those guys either.
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He is a proven veteran at a position where we don't have tons of veterans or depth. I'll take it.
No, I think we were hoping that the front office and the coaches knew what they were doing going into preseason with Flott, McCloud or Hawkins at CB2. But apparently not.
Kind of like last year with RG and swing tackle.
Great point. These coaches are fucking morons for letting the their planned CB2 get hurt and miss all preseason. Hard to believe any team would employ such yokels.