Giants offered Josh Jacobs monster contract

In comment 16592905 Section331 said:

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But the article indicates that Jacobs is the source of that offer. He could be BS’ing.

Yes, it's not good reporting to present a player's version as fact without something solid from another source to back it up.

"Josh Jacob says" should be the headline. And people can take that for what it's worth.

mind-fuck if true.

What is the philosophy here?

That said - I do like Jacobs more than Barkley. He's an old school, do everything runner.

I have no doubt Schoen talked his agent as part of the due diligence process but there is no way, at least in the world of logic I am familiar with, that there would be an offer like the one reported from Schoen - based all available data/information.

My sense is Schoen's issue was with Barkley, not running back. The deal Jacobs received is a bit of a paper tiger. The Packers have effectively committed 2/23M to him. The Giants could have offered offered a big sticker deal, with limited guarantees.

I believe we talked to his agent. I don't believe we put an offer like that on the table.

a little bit on Hard Knocks being the end all be all guys. I'm sure tons of stuff happened that wasn't visible on the show, and a lot of it probably didn't align with what was.

Whether the offer was real or just an initial discussion with his agent, it is another data point indicating the Giants appear to be a rudderless mess. How can you possibly have a roster building thesis based on the religion of positional value, literally pushing out our best playmaker because of the idea that running backs are low value commodities, and then aggressively pursue a less talented running back in Jacobs and offer exactly what Saquon wanted in the first place?

Maybe what really happened was, the Giants thought they could bully Saquon into submission with the crafty "positional value argument" to take a below market discount to help pay for the ludicrous contract given to DJ. When that blew up in their face, they tried to get an alternative top flight playmaker, but Jacobs just laughed in their face given what they did to Barkley. So then Schoen was forced to get a second tier running back in Singletary, and actually pay 50% more than what Houston paid last year for an average to below average player. So now the shadows of both Saquon and Jacobs will loom over Singletary's every carry this year.

Another brilliant move to boost locker room morale. Trust the process? My ass.

§

That the Giants offered 15 mill a year to a guy who had 3.5 YPC last season. FOH.

In comment 16592894 sb from NYT Forum said:

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In comment 16592891 djm said: Quote: In comment 16592878 sb from NYT Forum said: Quote: In comment 16592877 sb from NYT Forum said: Quote: ...Jacobs is exactly the type of guy that the Giants didn't want. A RB with significant wear on the tires with declining production. fixed (freakin typos) It does seem a bit contradictory. It is the athletic though. Who knows. Maybe a rumor spread by his agent to justify why he didn't get a big payday for his client? Kind of like "Hey, I got my guy a big deal, but he didn't want to play in NY!"

I could buy that.

None of it makes sense...

they would offer Jacobs such a large contract and nothing to barkley?

Jacobs would turn down THAT MUCH more money because of the market?

My guess is the offer was 8-9 million if they even made an offer at all.

That said, I think they will be fine with Singletary

It's not how JS is allocating money.

I don't care how we did it, just that we got rid of 26.

the Giants list, thinking he might be able to be signed at a discount due to the uneven season he had last year. But I simply do not buy that he was ever offered nearly what GB signed him for. The timing doesn’t work either, as Dunleavy points out, Jacob’s was signed before Saquon was.

In comment 16592968 ZogZerg said:

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It's not how JS is allocating money.

+1

In comment 16592914 Toth029 said:

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Although they could have discussed it. I feel once Barkley flew the coop, Daboll and Schoen were set with signing Motor.

This is what I think too. It’s entirely possible someone from the Giants staff had a conversation with Jacob’s agents to ask what kind of money they were looking for.

It’s possible said convo included discussion about Jacobs not necessarily loving NYC, concerns about the home turf, and that it might take a premium for NY to sign him away from other interested parties

But that doesn’t equate to the Giants making a firm offer for a few million more per year, that was rejected

And my own opinion here - no fucking way a 26 year old RB is taking a few million less per year. He knows this was likely his last best shot at getting paid

Notable the article’s author isn’t Duggan or Charlotte Carroll, the 2 who cover the Giants for the Athletic. The writer looks to be a NFL generalist

In comment 16592873 eli4life said:

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In comment 16592867 penkap75 said: Quote: I thought as business entity NYG are NY in name only and is NJ based. NJ taxes ain't cheat either, but its not NY taxes. Tax guys earn their money with these guys. It’s got to be a nightmare keeping all that straight since taxes are based on the state in which each game is played

That's also my understanding. Jacobs could set up residency in FL which has no income tax and then pay income tax to whatever state he plays in on a given play date.

money that Barkley, before Barkley had even left?

Yeah I believe that one.

In comment 16592896 MNP70 said:

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In comment 16592863 81_Great_Dane said: Quote: than the Tri-State Area, there's not a lot the Giants can do about that. Taxes, same, though the extra money might have taken care of that. Gary Zimmerman didn't want to live and work in the NY area, either. Whatcha gonna do? Zimmerman was a stud, too. I remember when that happened and Giants fans were NOT happy about it.

Of course not! They could have had Reggie White!

who confirmed that the report was BS and then the question became whether or not Jacobs actually said it and if there is something going on with him if he did.

This "report" comes from a supposed interview Jacobs gave where he also said the Chiefs made him a better offer but that he hates them with a passion and wouldn't play there

This could be a case of Pompei just looking for clicks or it could be Jacobs intentionally trolling people - but the question to that would be to ask why

In comment 16592997 nochance said:

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In comment 16592896 MNP70 said: Quote: In comment 16592863 81_Great_Dane said: Quote: than the Tri-State Area, there's not a lot the Giants can do about that. Taxes, same, though the extra money might have taken care of that. Gary Zimmerman didn't want to live and work in the NY area, either. Whatcha gonna do? Zimmerman was a stud, too. I remember when that happened and Giants fans were NOT happy about it. Of course not! They could have had Reggie White!

This still haunts me.

The story was that Parcells wanted White. Zimmerman became a Hall of Famer and the Giants ended up with terrific players after the trade.

But holy hell, can you imagine that Giants' defense with White?

Even if they felt he was a grand improvement over Barkley.

I stand by my assessment that Daboll is a proponent of RBBC.

Jacobs got $12.5 million guaranteed for what essentially is a one year upper RB market deal.

That's only $3 million more than Singletary on a 3-year with 2 year out deal. Might the Giants have offered $15MM guaranteed to Jacobs for a similar 2/3 deal? Sure. I wouldn't call that a monster contract.

In comment 16592874 Scuzzlebutt said:

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He got $12MM per, so the article is suggesting they offered $15-$16MM per. That’s ridiculous and I don’t think it fits with this regime’s philosophy.

Agree, I'm calling BS on this one.

But it all seems like a crock of sh**!!!

I think a lot of people conflate offer and discuss in these types of situations. Regardless of the nature of the conversation, if the numbers traded were 10 years and a billion dollars, if the guarantees were close to what Green Bay gave him that's not a monster contract.

They weren't ever going to pay Jacobs "Saquon" money....

In comment 16592869 Joey in VA said:

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Schoen specifically said he didn't want a $40 million QB handing off to a RB making $12 million.

This. No way they were giving a RB 4 years either. People would had for ale shit over anything even close to that GB deal.

The practical guaranteed cash in his deal is all paid the first 2 years. There are literally no guarantees in year 3 & 4.

If Green Bay so chooses, it can be a 2/23M agreement. That would have been a fine commitment for the Giants to make.

and "I turned down more money to be in GB" is great PR for that player.

In comment 16593068 christian said:

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The practical guaranteed cash in his deal is all paid the first 2 years. There are literally no guarantees in year 3 & 4. If Green Bay so chooses, it can be a 2/23M agreement. That would have been a fine commitment for the Giants to make.

Completely agree and Jacobs is a slightly better player than Singletary.

They literally singled out Jacobs on hard knocks as someone they weren't that impressed with at his age.

In comment 16593068 christian said:

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The practical guaranteed cash in his deal is all paid the first 2 years. There are literally no guarantees in year 3 & 4. If Green Bay so chooses, it can be a 2/23M agreement. That would have been a fine commitment for the Giants to make.

His guaranteed $$ for year 2 is mostly roster bonus. Yhey can move on if they want. Really it's a one year $12.5MM deal.

In comment 16593084 HBart said:

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The practical guaranteed cash in his deal is all paid the first 2 years. There are literally no guarantees in year 3 & 4. If Green Bay so chooses, it can be a 2/23M agreement. That would have been a fine commitment for the Giants to make. His guaranteed $$ for year 2 is mostly roster bonus. Yhey can move on if they want. Really it's a one year $12.5MM deal.

If Jacobs is cut after 2024, his total cash paid and corresponding cap charges will be 14.8M.

He has a 2024 1.2M salary + 600K workout bonus (that's presumably been earned) + 500K per game roster bonus + 12.5M signing bonus.

The only scenario where Jacobs would have cost them 12.5M is if they cut him during camp.

If he has a complete disaster of a season he'll be cut before the league year begins in 2025. Otherwise they'll keep him for a total incremental cash cost of 8.17M for 2025.

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@danpompei Okay so since this came out, a league source tells me the Giants never made an offer to Jacobs. Apologies for the spikes in blood pressures. And please permit Joe Schoen to see another sunrise.

Welp


Dan Pompei on X - ( New Window )

In comment 16593090 mac attack said:

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Quote: @danpompei Okay so since this came out, a league source tells me the Giants never made an offer to Jacobs. Apologies for the spikes in blood pressures. And please permit Joe Schoen to see another sunrise. Welp Dan Pompei on X - ( New Window )

Freakin' hack.

In comment 16593088 christian said:

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In comment 16593084 HBart said: Quote: The practical guaranteed cash in his deal is all paid the first 2 years. There are literally no guarantees in year 3 & 4. If Green Bay so chooses, it can be a 2/23M agreement. That would have been a fine commitment for the Giants to make. His guaranteed $$ for year 2 is mostly roster bonus. Yhey can move on if they want. Really it's a one year $12.5MM deal. If Jacobs is cut after 2024, his total cash paid and corresponding cap charges will be 14.8M. He has a 2024 1.2M salary + 600K workout bonus (that's presumably been earned) + 500K per game roster bonus + 12.5M signing bonus. The only scenario where Jacobs would have cost them 12.5M is if they cut him during camp. If he has a complete disaster of a season he'll be cut before the league year begins in 2025. Otherwise they'll keep him for a total incremental cash cost of 8.17M for 2025.

Exactly -- $12.5MM in guaranteed money.

used all the Giants media guys prior to Saquon leaving to put it out there they had a limit at the RB position.

Then asked to have a chance to match.

Now this....

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Really it's a one year $12.5MM deal.

It's not really a 12.5M deal. As the contract stands today if he's on the roster 1 year, it's a 14.8M deal. If he's on the roster 2 years, it's a 23M deal.

In comment 16592957 The Mike said:

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Whether the offer was real or just an initial discussion with his agent, it is another data point indicating the Giants appear to be a rudderless mess. How can you possibly have a roster building thesis based on the religion of positional value, literally pushing out our best playmaker because of the idea that running backs are low value commodities, and then aggressively pursue a less talented running back in Jacobs and offer exactly what Saquon wanted in the first place? Maybe what really happened was, the Giants thought they could bully Saquon into submission with the crafty "positional value argument" to take a below market discount to help pay for the ludicrous contract given to DJ. When that blew up in their face, they tried to get an alternative top flight playmaker, but Jacobs just laughed in their face given what they did to Barkley. So then Schoen was forced to get a second tier running back in Singletary, and actually pay 50% more than what Houston paid last year for an average to below average player. So now the shadows of both Saquon and Jacobs will loom over Singletary's every carry this year. Another brilliant move to boost locker room morale. Trust the process? My ass.

So basically you made this rant over a false story👍👍👍

Always thought this report was total BS

In comment 16593090 mac attack said:

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Quote: @danpompei Okay so since this came out, a league source tells me the Giants never made an offer to Jacobs. Apologies for the spikes in blood pressures. And please permit Joe Schoen to see another sunrise. Welp Dan Pompei on X - ( New Window )

Gotta love the guys here defending that it could have been true, lol. Derp!

In comment 16593128 Mbavaro said:

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In comment 16592957 The Mike said: Quote: Whether the offer was real or just an initial discussion with his agent, it is another data point indicating the Giants appear to be a rudderless mess. How can you possibly have a roster building thesis based on the religion of positional value, literally pushing out our best playmaker because of the idea that running backs are low value commodities, and then aggressively pursue a less talented running back in Jacobs and offer exactly what Saquon wanted in the first place? Maybe what really happened was, the Giants thought they could bully Saquon into submission with the crafty "positional value argument" to take a below market discount to help pay for the ludicrous contract given to DJ. When that blew up in their face, they tried to get an alternative top flight playmaker, but Jacobs just laughed in their face given what they did to Barkley. So then Schoen was forced to get a second tier running back in Singletary, and actually pay 50% more than what Houston paid last year for an average to below average player. So now the shadows of both Saquon and Jacobs will loom over Singletary's every carry this year. Another brilliant move to boost locker room morale. Trust the process? My ass. So basically you made this rant over a false story👍👍👍

The Giants only denied making him a formal offer. I absolutely believe that Jacobs and/or his agent had this discussion informally and have no doubt about the numbers since they are precisely what Saquon was looking for. Jacobs has no reason to lie. What does he possibly gain by trying to embarrass the Giants? Especially when we are playing their division rival this week.

The truth is, it is irrelevant what is in the media or posted on BBI. Jacobs is teammates with McKinney so whatever actually happened has been long well understood by all of the people who matter - the players in our locker room.

though as others have pointed out throughout the thread, kind of unsurprising give the implausibility of the report.

In comment 16593133 The Mike said:

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In comment 16593128 Mbavaro said: Quote: In comment 16592957 The Mike said: Quote: Whether the offer was real or just an initial discussion with his agent, it is another data point indicating the Giants appear to be a rudderless mess. How can you possibly have a roster building thesis based on the religion of positional value, literally pushing out our best playmaker because of the idea that running backs are low value commodities, and then aggressively pursue a less talented running back in Jacobs and offer exactly what Saquon wanted in the first place? Maybe what really happened was, the Giants thought they could bully Saquon into submission with the crafty "positional value argument" to take a below market discount to help pay for the ludicrous contract given to DJ. When that blew up in their face, they tried to get an alternative top flight playmaker, but Jacobs just laughed in their face given what they did to Barkley. So then Schoen was forced to get a second tier running back in Singletary, and actually pay 50% more than what Houston paid last year for an average to below average player. So now the shadows of both Saquon and Jacobs will loom over Singletary's every carry this year. Another brilliant move to boost locker room morale. Trust the process? My ass. So basically you made this rant over a false story👍👍👍 The Giants only denied making him a formal offer. I absolutely believe that Jacobs and/or his agent had this discussion informally and have no doubt about the numbers since they are precisely what Saquon was looking for. Jacobs has no reason to lie. What does he possibly gain by trying to embarrass the Giants? Especially when we are playing their division rival this week. The truth is, it is irrelevant what is in the media or posted on BBI. Jacobs is teammates with McKinney so whatever actually happened has been long well understood by all of the people who matter - the players in our locker room.

What does the "playing a division rival" point have to do with any of this? Kinda tossed that in there and I'm confused by it.

In comment 16592886 Orville Redenbacher said:

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In comment 16592869 Joey in VA said: Quote: Schoen specifically said he didn't want a $40 million QB handing off to a RB making $12 million. He also said it was better to wait in FA for a running back because the value was better and he did not stick to that so how are you so sure this is bullshit?

How ya feeling now? The author admitted it was shit. Get a read on who understands this whole thing before you call me out. Me 1. Popcorn dick 0.

The point was that Josh Jacobs has no reason to lie here. The only possible reason might be to leak something to distract a locker room immediately prior to a game. In this case, since the Giants are playing the Vikings, he would have no incentive to do so.

The fact that the Giants did not formally offer Jacobs a contract does not change the point that Jacobs is making. He simply chose to go to the Packers before the Giants made him that formal offer. Do I believe Jacobs? As I said, he has no reason to lie. Unless a valid reason exists for him to lie publicly about something that could be less relevant to anything that matters to him, and, since the Giants screwed up just about every possible aspect of Saquon's tenure here, I'll continue to give Jacobs the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise.

In comment 16593127 christian said:

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Quote: Really it's a one year $12.5MM deal. It's not really a 12.5M deal. As the contract stands today if he's on the roster 1 year, it's a 14.8M deal. If he's on the roster 2 years, it's a 23M deal.

Same as any other player. $12.5 million guaranteed = just that. He earned his roster bonus last week. Now he'll earn his salary. Then, after the last game this season, he's owed nothing. Not even his game worn jockstrap.

Like I said, essentially a one year deal.

Per game roster bonuses aren't typically paid before the season, rather as the name implies paid prorated per game.

Presumably his workout bonus was tied to participation in the non-mandatory offseason program, so that's been paid.

As a vested veteran his 2024 salary will be guaranteed the first day of the season.

I'm not disputing the Packers can cut Jacobs after the 2024 and not owe him new cash, but the full cash paid will be 14.8M, not the 12.5M you described. That's the point I'm disputing. The only hypothetical scenario it was essentially a 12.5M deal is if they signed him, then cut him before the season started.

And the real question becomes, how bad of a season would he have to have for the Packers to not elect to pay him 48% less a real cash for 2025.

In comment 16593194 christian said:

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Per game roster bonuses aren't typically paid before the season, rather as the name implies paid prorated per game. Presumably his workout bonus was tied to participation in the non-mandatory offseason program, so that's been paid. As a vested veteran his 2024 salary will be guaranteed the first day of the season. I'm not disputing the Packers can cut Jacobs after the 2024 and not owe him new cash, but the full cash paid will be 14.8M, not the 12.5M you described. That's the point I'm disputing. The only hypothetical scenario it was essentially a 12.5M deal is if they signed him, then cut him before the season started. And the real question becomes, how bad of a season would he have to have for the Packers to not elect to pay him 48% less a real cash for 2025.

Like any other player.

Once more with feeling: $12.5MM guaranteed. You can stop now.