and i am probably going to get killed for this but i honestly think there is talent on this team, the reason it looks so fricken bad is because the QB cant compelte an easy 10 yard in route..
You want to blame Schoen and Daboll for Jones? i am not going to argue that anymore but then give them credit for Dexter Lawrence and Andrew Thomas..
Are Schoen and Daboll perfect? absolutely not, no GM or coach is...
You get competent QB play and everything looks better and doesnt look as bad, look at 22 average qb play and daboll is coach of the year
They had a number of different moves they could have made at the QB position this offseason and yet they stood pat (actually downgraded).
Dottino stated on the BBI podcast they were never serious about Maye. Not to mention there were 6 1st QBs taken in the top 12 picks and we had a chance at 3 of them. Again, nothing. They could have pulled the trigger on Wilson or Fields or dabbled elsewhere in the QB FA market. Instead we get Drew Lock.
No one, especially Daboll, gets to sit back and point the finger at Jones for self preservation at this point. They're all in it together.
They had a number of different moves they could have made at the QB position this offseason and yet they stood pat (actually downgraded).
Dottino stated on the BBI podcast they were never serious about Maye. Not to mention there were 6 1st QBs taken in the top 12 picks and we had a chance at 3 of them. Again, nothing. They could have pulled the trigger on Wilson or Fields or dabbled elsewhere in the QB FA market. Instead we get Drew Lock.
No one, especially Daboll, gets to sit back and point the finger at Jones for self preservation at this point. They're all in it together.
I don't believe Dotino for a second.
They weren’t here when drafted. Daboll is a bad coach. If he doesn’t have the balls to stand up to the owner - then we shouldn’t want him anyways. You think Mike tomlin, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, etc… would go into this year with Jones?
If they are puppets for Mara - they shouldn’t be in this organization either.
They weren’t here when drafted. Daboll is a bad coach. If he doesn’t have the balls to stand up to the owner - then we shouldn’t want him anyways. You think Mike tomlin, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, etc… would go into this year with Jones?
If they are puppets for Mara - they shouldn’t be in this organization either.
Because they re-signed them?
They had a number of different moves they could have made at the QB position this offseason and yet they stood pat (actually downgraded).
Dottino stated on the BBI podcast they were never serious about Maye. Not to mention there were 6 1st QBs taken in the top 12 picks and we had a chance at 3 of them. Again, nothing. They could have pulled the trigger on Wilson or Fields or dabbled elsewhere in the QB FA market. Instead we get Drew Lock.
No one, especially Daboll, gets to sit back and point the finger at Jones for self preservation at this point. They're all in it together.
I cant argue that, if you think they deserved to be fired for missing on the QB,thats fine, i am not ready to do that
Our WRs I bet you will see where getting NFL level separation
Our RB is an average NFL guy
Our QB just sucks, and he makes the whole offense look horrible, All he wants to do is checkdown to a 5 yd pass (even on 3rd and 10). He refuses the throw to relatively open receivers, he panics after 1 read, and he is not accurate when he does throw it. He also has zero pocket presence and runs into sacks.
The defense will improve, I think we have some good young talent. They weren't all that bad, giving up 21 pts, 300 yds, and getting 2 turnovers. Also remember they were on the field all the time because the offense did nothing. Without looking at the stats, I bet a bunch of teams won this week with defenses having stats like ours.
They weren’t here when drafted. Daboll is a bad coach. If he doesn’t have the balls to stand up to the owner - then we shouldn’t want him anyways. You think Mike tomlin, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, etc… would go into this year with Jones?
If they are puppets for Mara - they shouldn’t be in this organization either.
Who would Mara hire that wouldn't be a puppet?...
He likes his company men.
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Get credit for Thomas or Lawerence?
They weren’t here when drafted. Daboll is a bad coach. If he doesn’t have the balls to stand up to the owner - then we shouldn’t want him anyways. You think Mike tomlin, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, etc… would go into this year with Jones?
If they are puppets for Mara - they shouldn’t be in this organization either.
Because they re-signed them?
I am not giving credit for re-signing all pros. That’s ridiculous. What about the rest of the roster that has been horrible? This is Schoens team and Daboll coaches it.
The stink of Gettleman is wearing off and a new stench is in town.
Like I said - if these two are puppets for Mara - then we are more fucked than originally thought.
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Get credit for Thomas or Lawerence?
They weren’t here when drafted. Daboll is a bad coach. If he doesn’t have the balls to stand up to the owner - then we shouldn’t want him anyways. You think Mike tomlin, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, etc… would go into this year with Jones?
If they are puppets for Mara - they shouldn’t be in this organization either.
Who would Mara hire that wouldn't be a puppet?...
He likes his company men.
Our two best coaches in our history are anything but that. You think prime Parcells or Coughlin will be puppets to Mara?
Lock and Cutlets are polar opposites. One has impressive physical talent and a 10 cent head. The other has nice intanglibles to go along w low end college talent.
Neither of them were hired by John Mara.
Yes, Jones is problem #1, but the D rolled over yesterday. Dex was the only one who showed up to play. They made Sam Fucking Darnold look like vintage Joe Montana.
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In comment 16601848 JT039 said:
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Get credit for Thomas or Lawerence?
They weren’t here when drafted. Daboll is a bad coach. If he doesn’t have the balls to stand up to the owner - then we shouldn’t want him anyways. You think Mike tomlin, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, etc… would go into this year with Jones?
If they are puppets for Mara - they shouldn’t be in this organization either.
Because they re-signed them?
I am not giving credit for re-signing all pros. That’s ridiculous. What about the rest of the roster that has been horrible? This is Schoens team and Daboll coaches it.
The stink of Gettleman is wearing off and a new stench is in town.
Like I said - if these two are puppets for Mara - then we are more fucked than originally thought.
So you kill them for bringing back Jones but they dont get the credit for bringing back good players?
And is there talent on this roster? Wrs? DBs? LBs? Ol? DL?
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Our two best coaches in our history are anything but that. You think prime Parcells or Coughlin will be puppets to Mara?
Neither of them were hired by John Mara.
But both would tell them to go to hell if Mara told them how to do their job.
Our WRs I bet you will see where getting NFL level separation
Our RB is an average NFL guy
Our QB just sucks, and he makes the whole offense look horrible, All he wants to do is checkdown to a 5 yd pass (even on 3rd and 10). He refuses the throw to relatively open receivers, he panics after 1 read, and he is not accurate when he does throw it. He also has zero pocket presence and runs into sacks.
The defense will improve, I think we have some good young talent. They weren't all that bad, giving up 21 pts, 300 yds, and getting 2 turnovers. Also remember they were on the field all the time because the offense did nothing. Without looking at the stats, I bet a bunch of teams won this week with defenses having stats like ours.
When we upgrade the QB, we have the talent to make the playoffs. Suck it up for one more horrible year - and hopefully we get a good one in the draft. This is frustrating, as we made the playoffs with this QB and less talent.
But, the QB situation is so bad that it clouds it all so much.
Greg you are 100% right i am not completely absolving them from anything
They weren’t here when drafted. Daboll is a bad coach. If he doesn’t have the balls to stand up to the owner - then we shouldn’t want him anyways. You think Mike tomlin, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, etc… would go into this year with Jones?
If they are puppets for Mara - they shouldn’t be in this organization either.
Schoen did sign both to good contracts. nygiants16 is clearly saying if he owns Jones because of the contract, he also owns Thomas & Lawrence for their contracts.
Call up Bobby Bowden!
But... Our defense gave up 21 points (taking out the pick 6). There are QBs in this league that would have not thrown a pick six plus found a way to put 22 up yesterday and the list of guys isn't just Pat Mahomes.
If you go up a level - say Herbert or Stafford - we would be competitive with some of the better teams in the conference. Not necessarily better than the top teams, but capable of being on the field with them.
That's not to say Schoen has done a good job. The 2 best players were here already. But the roster this year is not a disaster. It could be competitive.
Dexter
Thomas
Burns
Okereke
Nabers
Those guys could play for just about everyone. Other than that - meh.
If you go up a level - say Herbert or Stafford - we would be competitive with some of the better teams in the conference. Not necessarily better than the top teams, but capable of being on the field with them.
That's not to say Schoen has done a good job. The 2 best players were here already. But the roster this year is not a disaster. It could be competitive.
Did you watch that defense yesterday?
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If you drop a Geno Smith or Baker Mayfield into this team that we'd be a real wild card contender.
If you go up a level - say Herbert or Stafford - we would be competitive with some of the better teams in the conference. Not necessarily better than the top teams, but capable of being on the field with them.
That's not to say Schoen has done a good job. The 2 best players were here already. But the roster this year is not a disaster. It could be competitive.
Did you watch that defense yesterday?
Agree. Daniel Jones is certainly problem 1A, but after the first Minnesota drive the resulted in the fumble, Sam Darnold had all day to sit and scan the field waiting for someone to come open. I can't put that on Jones.
Burns and Thibs can't be complete no-shows like they were yesterday.
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If you drop a Geno Smith or Baker Mayfield into this team that we'd be a real wild card contender.
If you go up a level - say Herbert or Stafford - we would be competitive with some of the better teams in the conference. Not necessarily better than the top teams, but capable of being on the field with them.
That's not to say Schoen has done a good job. The 2 best players were here already. But the roster this year is not a disaster. It could be competitive.
Did you watch that defense yesterday?
The defense got two turnovers, held the Vikings to 319 total yards and gave up 21 points while not getting any help from the offense. The defense wasn't good but they weren't bad either. The defense did enough to make the game competitive.
Minnesota basically gave up the 2nd half and especially in fourth quarter. After the pick 6 - they packed it in.
Let’s not act like that a defense that was stopping them either.
the players just voted him captain like a week and a half ago.
the defense was so demoralized by jones that even before the pick 6 they let sam darnold march up and down the field on them without an incompletion for half the game?
i think we've seen enough coaching incompetence since coughlin to recognize this for what it is.
The bottom line is that it is up to Schoen to bring in high end talent with top-10 picks and up to Daboll to get them to play up to their potential. Between the two of them, that isn't happening.
The bottom line is that it is up to Schoen to bring in high end talent with top-10 picks and up to Daboll to get them to play up to their potential. Between the two of them, that isn't happening.
The stench of Jones is stronger than that of Daboll and Schoen - but their stench is still lingering…
But... Our defense gave up 21 points (taking out the pick 6). There are QBs in this league that would have not thrown a pick six plus found a way to put 22 up yesterday and the list of guys isn't just Pat Mahomes.
No, the D, outside of Lawrence, wasn't good yesterday either.
Bitey's not saying the D was good, though. He's saying it wasn't the dumpster fire Jones was, and wasn't so bad that the Giants couldn't have been competitive in that game.
They had a number of different moves they could have made at the QB position this offseason and yet they stood pat (actually downgraded).
Dottino stated on the BBI podcast they were never serious about Maye. Not to mention there were 6 1st QBs taken in the top 12 picks and we had a chance at 3 of them. Again, nothing. They could have pulled the trigger on Wilson or Fields or dabbled elsewhere in the QB FA market. Instead we get Drew Lock.
No one, especially Daboll, gets to sit back and point the finger at Jones for self preservation at this point. They're all in it together.
Few here were terrible high on any of those 3 enough to grab them where we sat. Maybe a trade down, but no guarantee they would still be there.
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Get credit for Thomas or Lawerence?
They weren’t here when drafted. Daboll is a bad coach. If he doesn’t have the balls to stand up to the owner - then we shouldn’t want him anyways. You think Mike tomlin, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, etc… would go into this year with Jones?
If they are puppets for Mara - they shouldn’t be in this organization either.
Schoen did sign both to good contracts. nygiants16 is clearly saying if he owns Jones because of the contract, he also owns Thomas & Lawrence for their contracts.
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In comment 16601850 nygiants16 said:
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In comment 16601848 JT039 said:
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Get credit for Thomas or Lawerence?
They weren’t here when drafted. Daboll is a bad coach. If he doesn’t have the balls to stand up to the owner - then we shouldn’t want him anyways. You think Mike tomlin, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, etc… would go into this year with Jones?
If they are puppets for Mara - they shouldn’t be in this organization either.
Because they re-signed them?
I am not giving credit for re-signing all pros. That’s ridiculous. What about the rest of the roster that has been horrible? This is Schoens team and Daboll coaches it.
The stink of Gettleman is wearing off and a new stench is in town.
Like I said - if these two are puppets for Mara - then we are more fucked than originally thought.
So you kill them for bringing back Jones but they dont get the credit for bringing back good players?
And is there talent on this roster? Wrs? DBs? LBs? Ol? DL?
No, sorry, they don’t get credit for bringing back all pro-level players. Letting either of them go would be a fireable offense. And the cherry on the sundae was the Jones contract. This staff has shown me little to recommend that they know what they’re doing. This is year 3, Jones is now THEIR QB, 48 of the 53 roster players are theirs, there are no other excuses.
Jones was a more difficult decision. There was a wider field of choices. They chose poorly.
So while all of those players "belong" to Schoen and Daboll, it is also fair to say they nailed the easy decisions and fumbled the difficult ones (counting Barkley).
The Giants either refuse to do that, or come up short in their efforts.