…Eli and Peyton first half jets @ niners….wow, little bill is the most knowledgeable nfl coach on the planet, if he’d take the helm of the giants in ‘25, all JM will need to do is have someone find the key where they keep those four Lombardi’s cause their little brother is arriving soon!
It's just painful not enjoying watching the team and this is over a decade of my football-watching-life that has been lost.
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unfamiliar with BB's history with the Giants?
he wants no part of this mess. he wanted out of this place 30 years ago for the same reason we are suffering now.
don't get your hopes up.
I'm not sure that's really how it happened. George Young didn't want Belichik as HC so he had to leave to be the head man. Was there more to it than that?
Your memory is correct. BB left because Young didn’t think he was head coach material. This was before grumpy BB could show up to a press conference and disgustedly mumble responses to reporters.
BB did not try to get away from the Giants. He wanted to be a head coach and he couldn’t do that in NY.
Bring him in. Imagine this franchise shrugging their shoulders and passing on Belichick. We are so far behind and someone like Ben Johnson has no chance. Belichick would at minimum get the train back on the tracks.
Fine. But I could list a ton of players who he drafted who were great.
Seymour is in the Hall of Fame. Brady and Gronk are going to get in. And guys like Wilfork, Chander Jones and Edleman have good chances, too.
His teams were among the worst in the league in his last few years. The D was fine, but the O was the worst. I take nothing away from his accomplishment- arguably the GOAT - but time is well past.
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He talks a good game, but the personnel decisions after Brady leave A LOT to be desired
Fine. But I could list a ton of players who he drafted who were great.
Seymour is in the Hall of Fame. Brady and Gronk are going to get in. And guys like Wilfork, Chander Jones and Edleman have good chances, too.
Plenty of times the game passes a person by as it pertains to talent evaluation. As a coach he still has abilities, but in terms of scouting college players I don’t see it.
he wants no part of this mess. he wanted out of this place 30 years ago for the same reason we are suffering now.
don't get your hopes up.
Weren’t the Browns and Pats terrible when he chose to coach them? Coaches generally inherit a bad team to turn it around. He made Cleveland a playoff team after a couple years. Bill has a big ego, he’d love to be the one to come here and turn it around. And what better year to do it than getting to draft his QB from day one….
He passed on Brady six times. He was never good at personnel decisions. He lucked into the best QB of all time.
Exactly. If he was coach Jones would be benched for the season.
Plenty of times the game passes a person by as it pertains to talent evaluation. As a coach he still has abilities, but in terms of scouting college players I don’t see it.
Everyone has an expiration date. But he did leave a lot of talent on the defensive side of the ball.
But everyone has a blind spot and BB's was hitting on the next franchise QB and WR. Of course, finding a QB is very challenging.
You have to give Belichick credit for how he managed free agency and trades. He was tremendous at finding undervalued assets like Chris Hogan, Amendola, Van Noy, Dillon, Welker, Woodhead, etc.
He needs to pick an executive to run the football operations and then simply get out of the way. His instincts when it comes to football and football front offices is terrible.
He has the right to pick anyone he wants, but at some point he needs to realize he may be single biggest impediment to the Giants winning.
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a lot of belichick's assistants failed but vrabel didnt and mayo already has a nice win. flores record is over .500 i think.
Vrabel never coached for Belichick.
the obvious point is that he learned from belichick having played under him for almost a decade, then gotten his start coaching at the NFL level under one of his assistants. ive never read the exact coaching tree rules but im pretty sure that's enough proximity to qualify. google bill walsh coaching tree and there are like 30 guys on it and many never directly coached under him.
He needs to pick an executive to run the football operations and then simply get out of the way. His instincts when it comes to football and football front offices is terrible.
He has the right to pick anyone he wants, but at some point he needs to realize he may be single biggest impediment to the Giants winning.
The problem is there were 2 guys recently available which would have been perfect. Sean Payton and Jim Harbaugh. Those are the type of people needed to turn this around. Given the family dynamics with this organization, it needs to be someone with pelts on the wall who can run the show and manage the ownership dynamic.
the obvious point is that he learned from belichick having played under him for almost a decade, then gotten his start coaching at the NFL level under one of his assistants. ive never read the exact coaching tree rules but im pretty sure that's enough proximity to qualify. google bill walsh coaching tree and there are like 30 guys on it and many never directly coached under him.
No, it's not an obvious point.
I'm not giving Belichick credit for guys like Vrabel or Ryans. They were never in BB's program where they were in coaching meetings, evaluations, game-planning, etc.
Ryans gets credit for being under Shanahan's tree.
Bill O'Brien, on the other hand, coached under Belichick. Include him. And he's been very solid.
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the obvious point is that he learned from belichick having played under him for almost a decade, then gotten his start coaching at the NFL level under one of his assistants. ive never read the exact coaching tree rules but im pretty sure that's enough proximity to qualify. google bill walsh coaching tree and there are like 30 guys on it and many never directly coached under him.
No, it's not an obvious point.
I'm not giving Belichick credit for guys like Vrabel or Ryans. They were never in BB's program where they were in coaching meetings, evaluations, game-planning, etc.
Ryans gets credit for being under Shanahan's tree.
Bill O'Brien, on the other hand, coached under Belichick. Include him. And he's been very solid.
My bad on Ryans.
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Behind the modern NFL. Picking a coach like BB is more of the same.
He needs to pick an executive to run the football operations and then simply get out of the way. His instincts when it comes to football and football front offices is terrible.
He has the right to pick anyone he wants, but at some point he needs to realize he may be single biggest impediment to the Giants winning.
The problem is there were 2 guys recently available which would have been perfect. Sean Payton and Jim Harbaugh. Those are the type of people needed to turn this around. Given the family dynamics with this organization, it needs to be someone with pelts on the wall who can run the show and manage the ownership dynamic.
I would agree on Payton, not on Harbaugh. Jim is cut out for the college game. I would take John Harbaugh in a minute.
I don’t know who the answer is, but I know that person needs complete autonomy to build an infarstructure they want which is likely not possible in NY because you have to keep Chris Mara and the Nephew which is a problem for any serious candidate.
He needs to pick an executive to run the football operations and then simply get out of the way. His instincts when it comes to football and football front offices is terrible.
He has the right to pick anyone he wants, but at some point he needs to realize he may be single biggest impediment to the Giants winning.
Mara has been trying to join the modern NFL once out from under the Accorsi/Coughlin umbrella: McAdoo, Shurmur, Judge, Daboll. Throw Schoen into that too.
In a perfect world the Maras would take a permanent vacation. Absent that, I think they need veteran leadership.
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Behind the modern NFL. Picking a coach like BB is more of the same.
He needs to pick an executive to run the football operations and then simply get out of the way. His instincts when it comes to football and football front offices is terrible.
He has the right to pick anyone he wants, but at some point he needs to realize he may be single biggest impediment to the Giants winning.
Mara has been trying to join the modern NFL once out from under the Accorsi/Coughlin umbrella: McAdoo, Shurmur, Judge, Daboll. Throw Schoen into that too.
In a perfect world the Maras would take a permanent vacation. Absent that, I think they need veteran leadership.
What do all of those guys (except Judge) have in common? They were all viewed as QB whisperers and offensive geniuses who were trying to solve a QB problem without changing the QB. THAT is the problem.
We need to stop hiring coaches for a position and hire a guy with a vision and plan for the team that is not focused only on the QB.
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In comment 16603824 Mike from Ohio said:
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Behind the modern NFL. Picking a coach like BB is more of the same.
He needs to pick an executive to run the football operations and then simply get out of the way. His instincts when it comes to football and football front offices is terrible.
He has the right to pick anyone he wants, but at some point he needs to realize he may be single biggest impediment to the Giants winning.
Mara has been trying to join the modern NFL once out from under the Accorsi/Coughlin umbrella: McAdoo, Shurmur, Judge, Daboll. Throw Schoen into that too.
In a perfect world the Maras would take a permanent vacation. Absent that, I think they need veteran leadership.
What do all of those guys (except Judge) have in common? They were all viewed as QB whisperers and offensive geniuses who were trying to solve a QB problem without changing the QB. THAT is the problem.
We need to stop hiring coaches for a position and hire a guy with a vision and plan for the team that is not focused only on the QB.
I won't argue that. Personally I would like to see the Goats become a team that invests its prime resources in the QB, OL, and DL. Build a team that can compete in the northeast in December and January.
Start with that as a north star and work from there. Malik Nabers played a fine game yesterday - he looked dynamic and he generated a lot of separation...and it meant dick because there's no QB.
What a stupid fucking pick.
Schoen and Daboll bet on Daniel Jones again this year and it bit them on the ass again this year.
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Behind the modern NFL. Picking a coach like BB is more of the same.
He needs to pick an executive to run the football operations and then simply get out of the way. His instincts when it comes to football and football front offices is terrible.
He has the right to pick anyone he wants, but at some point he needs to realize he may be single biggest impediment to the Giants winning.
The problem is there were 2 guys recently available which would have been perfect. Sean Payton and Jim Harbaugh. Those are the type of people needed to turn this around. Given the family dynamics with this organization, it needs to be someone with pelts on the wall who can run the show and manage the ownership dynamic.
That would take a lot from Mara to hire either Payton/Harbaugh.
Two successful HCs with strong wills...
Daboll has not managed to get the Giants offense on track despite that being his specialty.
A big part of that is the QB and Daboll has to own that decision as well.
As a GM, that’s an interesting idea.
On the O side, get back to being a high level running team with the RB's (never should have moved from this). He has great respect for the Shanahan's and that O. Be great if he can identify someone who can implement that system.
Great D with a ball control high achieving run game is a great spot for a rookie (or any) QB. Want a big PA game? Run the ball well and get your QB under center more.
Jim Harbaugh is a great HC. Foolish to say otherwise. All the guy does is win big everywhere he has been. He would have been a great hire. Very TC like with the critical nature of having strong fronts and running the ball.
I read somewhere that Bill stopped looking for the most talented players and started looking for the players he'd most enjoy coaching.
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In comment 16603857 Go Terps said:
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In comment 16603824 Mike from Ohio said:
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Behind the modern NFL. Picking a coach like BB is more of the same.
He needs to pick an executive to run the football operations and then simply get out of the way. His instincts when it comes to football and football front offices is terrible.
He has the right to pick anyone he wants, but at some point he needs to realize he may be single biggest impediment to the Giants winning.
Mara has been trying to join the modern NFL once out from under the Accorsi/Coughlin umbrella: McAdoo, Shurmur, Judge, Daboll. Throw Schoen into that too.
In a perfect world the Maras would take a permanent vacation. Absent that, I think they need veteran leadership.
What do all of those guys (except Judge) have in common? They were all viewed as QB whisperers and offensive geniuses who were trying to solve a QB problem without changing the QB. THAT is the problem.
We need to stop hiring coaches for a position and hire a guy with a vision and plan for the team that is not focused only on the QB.
I won't argue that. Personally I would like to see the Goats become a team that invests its prime resources in the QB, OL, and DL. Build a team that can compete in the northeast in December and January.
Start with that as a north star and work from there. Malik Nabers played a fine game yesterday - he looked dynamic and he generated a lot of separation...and it meant dick because there's no QB.
What a stupid fucking pick.
It's like a mini-version of the Barkley pick.
I'm all for a BB bringing in Josh McDaniels to run the offense, with a hand chosen rookie QB. The defense will be solid.
Idk about Bill being the GM too since that was an issue in the later years in New England.
But I know I'm done with these "offensive gurus". McAdoo, Shurmur, Daboll. Give a coach that wants to restore the Big Blue Wreckinh crew. I want the #1 defense in the league.
I think there's a lot of over-reacting right now - not Jones and Daboll - but everywhere else that doesn't stand out.
These guys don't play in preseason and then have to go full tilt Week 1 and the results are predictable at an individual level.
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In comment 16603857 Go Terps said:
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In comment 16603824 Mike from Ohio said:
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Behind the modern NFL. Picking a coach like BB is more of the same.
He needs to pick an executive to run the football operations and then simply get out of the way. His instincts when it comes to football and football front offices is terrible.
He has the right to pick anyone he wants, but at some point he needs to realize he may be single biggest impediment to the Giants winning.
Mara has been trying to join the modern NFL once out from under the Accorsi/Coughlin umbrella: McAdoo, Shurmur, Judge, Daboll. Throw Schoen into that too.
In a perfect world the Maras would take a permanent vacation. Absent that, I think they need veteran leadership.
What do all of those guys (except Judge) have in common? They were all viewed as QB whisperers and offensive geniuses who were trying to solve a QB problem without changing the QB. THAT is the problem.
We need to stop hiring coaches for a position and hire a guy with a vision and plan for the team that is not focused only on the QB.
I won't argue that. Personally I would like to see the Goats become a team that invests its prime resources in the QB, OL, and DL. Build a team that can compete in the northeast in December and January.
Start with that as a north star and work from there. Malik Nabers played a fine game yesterday - he looked dynamic and he generated a lot of separation...and it meant dick because there's no QB.
What a stupid fucking pick.
I fear that we'll be looking at the Nabers pick in the same light as the Barkley & Beckham picks
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Belichick would be light years' improvement over what the Giants are currently doing.
Bring him in. Imagine this franchise shrugging their shoulders and passing on Belichick. We are so far behind and someone like Ben Johnson has no chance. Belichick would at minimum get the train back on the tracks.
It's an absolute no brainer hire. The Giants need someone that will command instant respect and Belichick is one of the few that can do that. They need to stabilize this organization, it's been one of, if not the worst organization in the NFL over the last 12 years
Thank you. The time to hire Belichick was in 1991. or again in 1995.
Then he’ll be 73. Firing Schoen and Daboll would mean another rebuild, how long would BB want to stick around? The one last thing I will add, if they were able to bring BB back here, I damn well want him to choose his GM. Whatever his record is for picking talent, and it is spotty, I’d much rather have him do it than any combo of Chris Mara, Tim McDonnell and Kevin Abrams.
But I just don't think that's going to happen.
As noted, he is very old. And also consider that if we are looking for a program builder, the post Brady program he built sucked ass. Complete dead end assistant coaches, horrendous talent, awful offensive philosophy. It's going to take years to recover for the NE offense. This is what his program produced.
Again, I am not taking away from his accomplishments. Merely assessing where he is right now.
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He talks a good game, but the personnel decisions after Brady leave A LOT to be desired
He passed on Brady six times. He was never good at personnel decisions. He lucked into the best QB of all time.
Stop it. The whole league passed on Brady 6 times. And there isn't another coach who would have staked his career on a 6th round pick over a former #1 overall with a Super Bowl appearance on his resume with the same franchise. That took major balls.