The past two day’s most of us on BBI have sorted through thread after thread bashing the Mara family, specifically John, for the 10+ years of bad football we’ve recently witnessed. Criticism of ownership is fair, specifically since John Mara’s presence has been the only constant since the losing started, however, complaining is not productive nor does it help the matter.
In spirit of above, I’ve put together 5 pieces of advice for John that may help him better run this team moving forward:
1 - As the leader and owner of this team, fully understand that when you speak your words have a greater impact:
Everything you say is going to be analyzed differently by the media, your employees and the fans. A good example would be past statements on Daniel Jones and Saquon Barkley. Whether or not you’ve given Joe Schoen 100% autonomy to make decisions, it’s known or perceived publicly that Jones and Barkley are “your guys”. Not only does this cloud your GM’s thought process, it also makes it hard for him to negotiate when contracts come up. If you don’t think agents were sitting in a room saying “we’re going to dig in and hold tight, John will force Joe to pay us” in the Jones negotiations, your nuts.
You unintentionally inserted yourself in these personnel decisions which is very easy to fix, in the future when asked about a specific player pivot the conversation to the team as a whole. When asked about a contract, push the conversation to Schoen for comment. Only comment on specific players after they’ve been here a while, have consistently played well and aren’t near a contract extension.
2 – Since Super Bowl XLVI this is a losing franchise. Accept it, but most importantly understand when you keep talking about “The Giants Way”, this isn’t resonating with fans. It is time to accept that “The Giants Way” is losing and embrace change:
Us fans have been through this one too many times in the past 10 years. Bad season, coach fired (but not GM), new coach hired, we get lip service about “having to get back to the Giants Way”, coach stinks and is fired in the next couple of years, wash, rinse, repeat…
This mantra must go, not only has “The Giants Way” proven to be ineffective, but it stifles current and perspective employees from creativity. Instead of looking for people to do things “The Giants Way”, start looking for people that are ahead of the curve, seeing something the rest of the NFL isn’t and willing to think outside of the box. We need innovators if we’re going to compete, not historians.
3 – Commit to things when you do them, no half measures:
Despite 10+ years of losing, this team has never actually gone through a rebuild. I know we’ve had a lot of turnover in players, but let’s be real here, have you ever let a GM come in, trade good players for draft capital, utilize it to bring in all of “their guys” and build the team to their vision? No.
When Gettleman came in the team took the stance that they just needed to add a couple of players around Manning. You drafted Barkley, it didn’t help the matter. The next season you get a new QB, change very little about the team, expect different results and don’t get them, so you fired the coach. What did you do from there? Brought in another coach, let him meddle around with someone else’s team, then fired him. Finally, after this you at least brought in a GM and head coach as a pair, but you saddled them with someone else’s QB who had already been ruined…
We have not been a consistent 8-9/9-8 team looking to tweak 1 or 2 things to get to the next level. Teams, processes and systems need to be completely rebuilt. No half measures, commit to what you’re doing.
4 – Keep Mara family members out of the football side of things:
I’m sorry, maybe your brother Chris really was a good talent evaluator but look how the past few years have went for him. Rather than retiring as a productive member of the organization he instead is hated by fans and widely viewed as having a strong hand in ruining this once proud franchise. His role was never big enough to where he was “needed” in the building, yet he’s taken a ton of blame for what went wrong.
It's a zero-sum gain…
You currently have your nephew Tim working in the football personnel department. Move him underneath you into the business side of things, let your GM replace him with a person who A) is a career football guy and B) he can fire if he stinks…
I’ll take this one step further. Never saddle an employee with another that he really isn’t in charge of. Would you really support Joe firing Tim?
5 – Winning should be priority one and football decisions should be made with the thinking “what is best for our team as a whole”:
John, I’m sure you think that you do this, but from an outside view it sure doesn’t look like it. When talking about Daniel Jones you famously said, “We did everything we could to screw him up” and while this may be correct, it’s irrelevant. What is relevant is that you just didn’t build a very good team… In the past few years your public comments have given the perception that you’re more concerned about doing right by the players you like, Jones and Barkley, than you are building a winning football team.
Flip franchises for a moment and say you own the 49er’s instead. Your line of thinking would have you still quadrupling down on Trey Lance while a legitimate starter in Brock Purdy would probably be off your team already. There’s something to learn here. The 49er’s didn’t care about “fixing” Trey Lance or waiting for him to develop, they instead saw that their 7th round pick was out performing him and playing Purdy would be best for the team, so they did it. You would not have handled the situation this way, I’m sorry, but you wouldn’t have. I also don’t think your coaches or GM’s would have felt supported if they wanted to.
In conclusion I know you won’t read this, but I think history has shown us someone in the organization will, so possibly some of it gets to you? Who knows??? However, the reality is that your fan base cares and wants to see this team win, but we’re frustrated. Remember your fans are by and large blue-collar people who routinely make what is a large investment to them in order to show up to games, buy merchandise and feel like part of the team. You have what you have in life because of people like this. Rather than have a combative relationship between fans and ownership, let’s work together to build a winning franchise. Change is hard, I completely understand that, but I think we can all agree it’s necessary and as President of this organization you need to be the catalyst.
I'm not sure how much Mara pressured Schoen to resign Jones. In hindsight, Schoen should have over payed Barkley to lock him up long term and franchise tag Jones. However, I don't think anyone could have predicted have far Jones has fallen for whatever reason. Forget franchise QB, he is virtually unplayable now.
It is year 3, this is on Schoen and Daboll. They could have drafted McCarthy at 6. They stuck with Jones and didn't get us a better backup going into this year.
I don't think it is fair to blame Mara for this year. For the Gettleman era sure, but this is Schoen's team. He and Dabooll need to own it.
I'm not sure how much Mara pressured Schoen to resign Jones. In hindsight, Schoen should have over payed Barkley to lock him up long term and franchise tag Jones. However, I don't think anyone could have predicted have far Jones has fallen for whatever reason. Forget franchise QB, he is virtually unplayable now.
It is year 3, this is on Schoen and Daboll. They could have drafted McCarthy at 6. They stuck with Jones and didn't get us a better backup going into this year.
I don't think it is fair to blame Mara for this year. For the Gettleman era sure, but this is Schoen's team. He and Dabooll need to own it.
I'm not sure I 100% agree. While I'm not going to argue the point that after this franchises lone playoff win in the past 10 years moving off of Jones would have been hard, I fully believe that Mara's involvement at the very least influenced the contract negotiations.
As I said in point one, Jones' agents had have known and leveraged the fact that Mara openly supported Jones and wanted him as the franchise QB. Even if no "sign Jones or else" mandate, John's public positions cost the team money in this case. I also think Barkley's camp dug in and played hardball thinking John would swoop in last minute and force a contract.
So to the point I made about not commenting publicly, his past statements and public appearances influenced the contract negotiations.
This is an option as well
6: resign as CEO.
This.
It all just reeks of a complete lack of self awareness, a culture where people cannot ask hard questions, and just overall incompetent leadership.
I don't think it is fair to blame Mara for this year. For the Gettleman era sure, but this is Schoen's team. He and Dabooll need to own it.
Mara is the guy who chose those 2 to run the team. The buck stops at his desk. Daboll and Schoen own their actions but Mara owns them
He can’t help himself.
Giants have 4.
The Maras ARE The Giants, so get used to it.
Giants have 4.
The Maras ARE The Giants, so get used to it.
And this is relevant in 2024 because?
That doesn’t mean that the CEO won’t be in the loop or not have a say in any transactions, but the ultimate personnel decisions have to be made by the PFO and his or her staff. And yeah, stop hyping players you like, you are hurting your own negotiating stance.
Giants have 4.
The Maras ARE The Giants, so get used to it.
The Pittsburgh Pirates have won 5 World Series titles.
Giants have 4.
The Maras ARE The Giants, so get used to it.
John Mara owns 5% of the Giants. John Mara has shown NO ability to run a franchise, sorry, but that is the truth. Even if he was the nominal CEO in 2011, the pieces were in place when he took over.
You know who else “IS the Giants”? The Tisches. If this season goes as south as many of us think it will, I’m going to guess that they are going to want significant changes. The Mara’s better have an answer for that more than “we’ll get back to The Giants Way!”
This line really resonated with me
And the Browns were a powerhouse in the '50s and '60s.
Things change.
I’ll take this one step further. Never saddle an employee with another that he really isn’t in charge of. Would you really support Joe firing Tim?
To me, this is the most bothersome thing. The nephew is going to be the next Giants team President/CEO. Why the hell is he involved in any part of the football personnel operation? What qualifies him to do that?
His entire football resume is based on the fact that he's a Mara. Hired directly out of college to go work for Charlie Weis, a former Giants assistant, at Notre Dame. His next job was with the Giants, starting in 2013. Now he's the Director of Player Personnel, for an organization that has been shitty for the entire time he's been here.
It's a joke.
daboll has worked for him before, if little bill thinks he's doing a good job then he can keep him but i trust him 10000x more than schoen or obviously mara to make that judgement.
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Bitey, the thing is after the playoff win in 2022 Schoen was in a tough spot with Daniel Jones. I think everyone forgets the entire stadium chanting Daniel Jones' name when we sealed our playoff spot.
I'm not sure how much Mara pressured Schoen to resign Jones. In hindsight, Schoen should have over payed Barkley to lock him up long term and franchise tag Jones. However, I don't think anyone could have predicted have far Jones has fallen for whatever reason. Forget franchise QB, he is virtually unplayable now.
It is year 3, this is on Schoen and Daboll. They could have drafted McCarthy at 6. They stuck with Jones and didn't get us a better backup going into this year.
I don't think it is fair to blame Mara for this year. For the Gettleman era sure, but this is Schoen's team. He and Dabooll need to own it.
I'm not sure I 100% agree. While I'm not going to argue the point that after this franchises lone playoff win in the past 10 years moving off of Jones would have been hard, I fully believe that Mara's involvement at the very least influenced the contract negotiations.
As I said in point one, Jones' agents had have known and leveraged the fact that Mara openly supported Jones and wanted him as the franchise QB. Even if no "sign Jones or else" mandate, John's public positions cost the team money in this case. I also think Barkley's camp dug in and played hardball thinking John would swoop in last minute and force a contract.
So to the point I made about not commenting publicly, his past statements and public appearances influenced the contract negotiations.
Bitey, I think you make fair points. Right now I'm more disappointed in Schoen & Daboll than Mara. They are highly paid executives. They should be able to upward manage John Mara. I expect better from Schoen and Daboll. I can't believe Daniel Jones is this bad, and I blame them for not doing more to upgrade the QB room.
There were a LOT of posters who said this guys is not a franchise QB before, during and after the 2022 season. Let's not pretend he was a really good player who's play fell off a cliff. He was a poor QB who compiled what could genuinely be described as an average year in a simplified offense that was not sustainable long term.
I particularly like #5 as it nicely puts this situation in perspective
he won 6 super bowls as a de facto gm?
there is validity to the fact that he misjudged life after brady but the last SB he won his defense held the rams to 3 points and they won scoring 13, so it wasnt all brady.
in fact in his last 5 years in NE his defenses never ranked lower than 15th in points or yards and were each year top 10 in at least one of them (twice top 5 in both). 4 of these years were obviously without brady.
yes it's a question whether or not he's equipped to figure out a modern offense and learned from his mistakes, but he is still an all time winner, gameday operator, and defensive coach. ill take my chances on that if the alternative is another first timer.
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However, I don't think anyone could have predicted have far Jones has fallen for whatever reason. Forget franchise QB, he is virtually unplayable now.
There were a LOT of posters who said this guys is not a franchise QB before, during and after the 2022 season. Let's not pretend he was a really good player who's play fell off a cliff. He was a poor QB who compiled what could genuinely be described as an average year in a simplified offense that was not sustainable long term.
Plenty said it in April of 2019 too
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Bitey, the thing is after the playoff win in 2022 Schoen was in a tough spot with Daniel Jones. I think everyone forgets the entire stadium chanting Daniel Jones' name when we sealed our playoff spot.
I'm not sure how much Mara pressured Schoen to resign Jones. In hindsight, Schoen should have over payed Barkley to lock him up long term and franchise tag Jones. However, I don't think anyone could have predicted have far Jones has fallen for whatever reason. Forget franchise QB, he is virtually unplayable now.
It is year 3, this is on Schoen and Daboll. They could have drafted McCarthy at 6. They stuck with Jones and didn't get us a better backup going into this year.
I don't think it is fair to blame Mara for this year. For the Gettleman era sure, but this is Schoen's team. He and Dabooll need to own it.
I'm not sure I 100% agree. While I'm not going to argue the point that after this franchises lone playoff win in the past 10 years moving off of Jones would have been hard, I fully believe that Mara's involvement at the very least influenced the contract negotiations.
As I said in point one, Jones' agents had have known and leveraged the fact that Mara openly supported Jones and wanted him as the franchise QB. Even if no "sign Jones or else" mandate, John's public positions cost the team money in this case. I also think Barkley's camp dug in and played hardball thinking John would swoop in last minute and force a contract.
So to the point I made about not commenting publicly, his past statements and public appearances influenced the contract negotiations.
Bitey, I hope you have put this in a letter, marked it “certified” and sent to Giants Way
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In comment 16605393 Spartan10 said:
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However, I don't think anyone could have predicted have far Jones has fallen for whatever reason. Forget franchise QB, he is virtually unplayable now.
There were a LOT of posters who said this guys is not a franchise QB before, during and after the 2022 season. Let's not pretend he was a really good player who's play fell off a cliff. He was a poor QB who compiled what could genuinely be described as an average year in a simplified offense that was not sustainable long term.
Plenty said it in April of 2019 too
Yessir. Third round talent coming out of Dook.
The only way forward for this franchise, is to get John to relinquish control and whoever comes in ( to play the George Young role), have the power to fire ANYONE (including any family members).
Then, this franchise can move forward. Until then as fans we are screwed.
Maybe the Tisch family can force this to happen.
Third round talent....at best.
No particular order but I had a sense a lot of people would gravitate towards that one
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There are 12 teams that have never won the Super Bowl?
Giants have 4.
The Maras ARE The Giants, so get used to it.
And this is relevant in 2024 because?
If it were still Wellington, then sure there's some historical connection and gravitas.
Youre telling me John and Tim Mara hold a special place in your heart that would keep you away if they were gone? I need someone to explain that.
Well said Sir.
I'm realizing more and more that green, inexperienced people will not fix this. The likes of Ben McAdoo, Pat Shurmur, Joe Judge & Brian Daboll have no chance. Is Joe Schoen really equipped for this task?
Someone like an Andy Reid, Sean Payton or Jim Harbaugh is needed for this. Those candidates don't come around often. I think that's what Mara will need to do.
Some people think Mara would never do it. Maybe he won't. But, there will be a time when he needs to buy credibility. It's why I can really see Belichick here.
There it is! That will help. Bitey makes some decent points and then..
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For all his warts as president and CEO, I'd stop watching the giants if they sold. They represent nothing at that point. Just a team that plays in a jersey swamp wearing the uniforms and with the name of a different franchise they inherited, but aren't really. I've moved out of NY decades ago, I wouldn't have any link with the team anymore at that point. We'd become the jets.Team would likely wind up moving out of market within a decade.
Which family moved the team to a swamp?
Be careful what you wish for. Do you want to root for Jeff Bezos? How about Josh Harris? Someone who owns the Devils, Sixers and Commanders. That seems obnoxious.
I want Mara to hire smarter, more experienced people to run football operations. Selling to some hedge fund guy like Tepper? Fuck no.
We’re all told he reads his mail and often answers it. Put the post office to work for us. He’s an old school guy and it’s a good bet it’ll make it to his inbox.
Thanks, good luck, and keep up the great posts.