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Inside BBI: Big Blue Clown Show Is Back! (also Connor Hughes weighs in)

Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/17/2024 7:21 am
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RE: The problem the Giants have is continuity  
Go Terps : 9/17/2024 11:47 am : link
In comment 16614075 Sean said:
Quote:
Resetting every 2-3 years makes it difficult for any kind of cohesion. Especially with the OL.

We are dealing with a new DC now which looks bad. The OL is playing better with a new coach, but we are potentially looking at another new OL coach next year.

Schoen brings in Wink players only for Wink to leave.

This is how bad teams stay bad.

jvm said it and he's right. It's on Daboll that these coaches aren't working. They overhauled a huge part of the coaching staff. As Terps have said, if a change was possible then it should just have happened after last season. Because now it's possible you'll have new position coaches AGAIN after this season.

It's hard for crappy franchises to get out of this rut.


Imagine the Giants had cleaned house after last season and hired the Jim Harbaugh/Joe Hortiz combo in January. How would we be feeling? The only argument against doing that was that Daboll/Schoen didn't deserve that fate after only two years.

Too much thought goes into what people deserve, and not enough goes into how we can improve.
First time  
Giantsbigblue : 9/17/2024 11:52 am : link
Watching. Some good stuff from Connor. I think I'm mostly on the same page with Jon and Eric. With that said... After multiple bone head mistakes on Dabolls part. Anything short of the playoffs he should be gone. Schoen I'm indifferent about at this point.
RE: RE: The problem the Giants have is continuity  
jvm52106 : 9/17/2024 11:55 am : link
In comment 16614104 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 16614075 Sean said:


Quote:


Resetting every 2-3 years makes it difficult for any kind of cohesion. Especially with the OL.

We are dealing with a new DC now which looks bad. The OL is playing better with a new coach, but we are potentially looking at another new OL coach next year.

Schoen brings in Wink players only for Wink to leave.

This is how bad teams stay bad.

jvm said it and he's right. It's on Daboll that these coaches aren't working. They overhauled a huge part of the coaching staff. As Terps have said, if a change was possible then it should just have happened after last season. Because now it's possible you'll have new position coaches AGAIN after this season.

It's hard for crappy franchises to get out of this rut.



Imagine the Giants had cleaned house after last season and hired the Jim Harbaugh/Joe Hortiz combo in January. How would we be feeling? The only argument against doing that was that Daboll/Schoen didn't deserve that fate after only two years.

Too much thought goes into what people deserve, and not enough goes into how we can improve.


That to me is too easy to say now as Harbaugh brings a lot of questions too. Yes, he is a very good coach and they are off to a great start but I am not sure you wipe the slate clean after last season considering how bad injuries killed two different position groups for us.

Daboll knows he is on thin ice (based on Connor's report) but, I am inclined to give him the season. The one he hasn't done is lose the team (we saw that happen with Shurmur and McAdoo and to some extent Judge).

The kicker piece was a VERY damning thing Sunday but, I do think he deserves to win and keep or lose and lose...

RE: RE: Great Job getting Connor on  
Dankbeerman : 9/17/2024 11:57 am : link
In comment 16614003 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 16613978 Dankbeerman said:


Quote:


Both his reporting and opinions seem very straight forward and give a good perspective of how the team is viewed without any fandom and or hot take garbage.

I know the kicker business dominates the train of thought but there were critical mistakes that blew this game as well. The drop, the fumble, the 2 point pass Slayton couldn't bring down. And the missed sack, Pinnock penalties extending drives and lack of stops outside the redzone.

There is a slew of things that cost you a one score game you could do 3 hours on what ifs.

in addition to Phillips I do feel that Nubin is close to breaking out. I feel like this Defense is playing on its heels and not downhill enough and I just pray that will change as guys get comfortable.



If you caught it, I harped big time on the defense, plus talked about those two bad miscues on offense.
Wasn't trying to imply you didn't.

Just lamenting on how you could make a top 10 ways the Giants blew the game list.

That was as beatable a team you could face in the NFL.
If they give Daboll the season  
Sean : 9/17/2024 11:59 am : link
They may lose out on Belichick. At minimum, you need a head start there through back channel conversations.

Both Dallas & Philly are 1-1 with head coaches on very thin ice. Belichick may have his pick.

I get the concern over Belichick's age, but if you want him it's not a given he'll want to even come here. Those conversations need to happen asap.
jvm  
Go Terps : 9/17/2024 12:00 pm : link
I apologize if I'm misreading, but I take that as "Daboll didn't deserve to be fired after an injury-riddled 2023". I'm not even thinking about that; I'm saying only that Harbaugh is indisputably a better head coach than Daboll...and he was available (as were Belichick and Vrabel, also indisputably better coaches than Daboll).

So are we trying to get better, or are we wrapped up in what people deserve?
RE: If they give Daboll the season  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 9/17/2024 12:02 pm : link
In comment 16614132 Sean said:
Quote:
They may lose out on Belichick. At minimum, you need a head start there through back channel conversations.

Both Dallas & Philly are 1-1 with head coaches on very thin ice. Belichick may have his pick.

I get the concern over Belichick's age, but if you want him it's not a given he'll want to even come here. Those conversations need to happen asap.


They should be happening behind the scenes.
Also, this is not hindsight on my part  
Go Terps : 9/17/2024 12:02 pm : link
I said this back in December. If I were Mara I would have let Schoen and Daboll go and hired one of these three indisputably better options.
RE: Also, this is not hindsight on my part  
section125 : 9/17/2024 12:50 pm : link
In comment 16614136 Go Terps said:
Quote:
I said this back in December. If I were Mara I would have let Schoen and Daboll go and hired one of these three indisputably better options.


Bullshit - if you were Mara, you would have fired yourself out of spite!
This is absolutely laughable and embarrassing still further  
GiantBlue : 9/17/2024 12:54 pm : link
that the Beats were discussing how bad Gano looked in warm-ups and yet we trot him out there without a back-up and essentially lose the game when the 37 year old walks off limping!

Where is Mara????

Where is the accountability.

Daboll at the very least should have been shown the door! Schoen too. This is team is a train tumbling down the cliff and there is nothing from ownership????????

I am blown away by this.
RE: RE: Also, this is not hindsight on my part  
Go Terps : 9/17/2024 12:54 pm : link
In comment 16614182 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 16614136 Go Terps said:


Quote:


I said this back in December. If I were Mara I would have let Schoen and Daboll go and hired one of these three indisputably better options.



Bullshit - if you were Mara, you would have fired yourself out of spite!


If I were in Mara's shoes the Giants would be in a much better place. And that's not because I'm some kind of expert, it's because Mara has had a knack for choosing the worst possible path. A random number generator would have been a better CEO over this last 15 or so years.

Don't forget, Mara is also responsible for the stadium - a colossal failure.
RE: RE: RE: Also, this is not hindsight on my part  
BillKo : 9/17/2024 12:56 pm : link
In comment 16614190 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 16614182 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 16614136 Go Terps said:


Quote:


I said this back in December. If I were Mara I would have let Schoen and Daboll go and hired one of these three indisputably better options.



Bullshit - if you were Mara, you would have fired yourself out of spite!



If I were in Mara's shoes the Giants would be in a much better place.


BOLD!

I would love to see this on many levels.
RE: RE: RE: Also, this is not hindsight on my part  
section125 : 9/17/2024 12:56 pm : link
In comment 16614190 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 16614182 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 16614136 Go Terps said:


Quote:


I said this back in December. If I were Mara I would have let Schoen and Daboll go and hired one of these three indisputably better options.



Bullshit - if you were Mara, you would have fired yourself out of spite!



If I were in Mara's shoes the Giants would be in a much better place. And that's not because I'm some kind of expert, it's because Mara has had a knack for choosing the worst possible path. A random number generator would have been a better CEO over this last 15 or so years.

Don't forget, Mara is also responsible for the stadium - a colossal failure.


Like I said, you'd fire yourself.
Great episode!  
truebluelarry : 9/17/2024 1:07 pm : link
John’s idea of doing old games during the off-season would be awesome.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Also, this is not hindsight on my part  
LawrenceTaylor56 : 9/17/2024 1:13 pm : link
In comment 16614195 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 16614190 Go Terps said:


Quote:


In comment 16614182 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 16614136 Go Terps said:


Quote:


I said this back in December. If I were Mara I would have let Schoen and Daboll go and hired one of these three indisputably better options.



Bullshit - if you were Mara, you would have fired yourself out of spite!



If I were in Mara's shoes the Giants would be in a much better place. And that's not because I'm some kind of expert, it's because Mara has had a knack for choosing the worst possible path. A random number generator would have been a better CEO over this last 15 or so years.

Don't forget, Mara is also responsible for the stadium - a colossal failure.



Like I said, you'd fire yourself.


Yeah, the Giants wouldn't stand for continuous improvement.
The trade deadline is 11/5/2024  
The Mike : 9/17/2024 1:14 pm : link
If the Giants are 0-8 or 1-7 after week eight (which is the 10/28/2024 Monday night game against Pittsburgh), they need to fire both Schoen and Daboll on 10/29/2024 (ironically the 95th anniversary of Black Tuesday) to ensure proper decisions are made at the trade deadline this year and effective planning is in place for the future BEFORE this season ends. And precisely to ensure that meaningless wins DO NOT happen this year! This silly "Giants Way" philosophy that major changes are not made in season makes zero sense.

And I agree with Sean. The back channel discussions with Belichick among others should be happening right now. The idea that Mara is waiting to see how many meaningless wins this team gets at the end of the season before making a judgment on the future leadership of this football team is lunacy.
RE: The trade deadline is 11/5/2024  
Sean : 9/17/2024 1:20 pm : link
In comment 16614204 The Mike said:
Quote:
If the Giants are 0-8 or 1-7 after week eight (which is the 10/28/2024 Monday night game against Pittsburgh), they need to fire both Schoen and Daboll on 10/29/2024 (ironically the 95th anniversary of Black Tuesday) to ensure proper decisions are made at the trade deadline this year and effective planning is in place for the future BEFORE this season ends. And precisely to ensure that meaningless wins DO NOT happen this year! This silly "Giants Way" philosophy that major changes are not made in season makes zero sense.

And I agree with Sean. The back channel discussions with Belichick among others should be happening right now. The idea that Mara is waiting to see how many meaningless wins this team gets at the end of the season before making a judgment on the future leadership of this football team is lunacy.

100%. I'd like to see Schoen trying to trade for Bryce Young today. Can he be better than Drew Lock or Tommy DeVito? Isn't Daboll supposed to be a QB whisperer?

Try to buy low and have a cheap cost controlled QB for a few years. What's the risk? Do something. Be proactive for once at QB.
I wouldn't expect the Giants to be proactive in any way  
Go Terps : 9/17/2024 1:33 pm : link
I can't, off the top of my head, recall them ever being proactive or innovative about anything. I think Connor nailed the vibe. All it's going to take is a few wins for them to run it back.
Looks like Schoen  
TheBlueprintNC : 9/17/2024 2:29 pm : link
rebuilt the OL too.. 2 new guards and 2nd yr C kept pocket clean
Some people still have an unreasonably high opinion of Jones  
Gary from The East End : Admin : 9/17/2024 2:43 pm : link
The idea that Daniel could win 11 games under center for the Eagles is just insane.
Another quality segment and guest  
JonC : 9/17/2024 3:11 pm : link
well done. Hard to believe we're still drilling the same convos three years later.
two things of note  
BigBlueCane : 9/17/2024 3:48 pm : link
the note on Physicality from the jets and them saying the Giants aren't Physical, is a big deal IMO.

also the description of the feeding frenzy of the press after this game illustrates why the Giants are correct to vent all these people to see if they can handle the strain.
RE: So we have a Defense  
gridirony : 9/17/2024 4:15 pm : link
In comment 16614023 TheBlueprintNC said:
Quote:
that seems to thinking instead of reacting - that will change.. We have an OL that is actually doing its job thank you Father Carmen.. We have a QB that is starting to look a little comfortable and finding his receivers.. We have added players of significance and are starting to show it. We have a coach that needs to remember he was coach of the year and lets win some games. Now we see if it comes together the next few games will be telling.
Looking a little comfortable finding one receiver? In one game? Against a league co-bottom feeder?

And, of all things, the coach needs to completely forget about the coach of the year award. Resting on one's single laurel, gets everyone but owners fired.
I did want to say that this is a wonderful podcast and we are  
GiantBlue : 9/17/2024 4:38 pm : link
lucky to have it!

Eric, you always strike the right tone! When we're frustrated and/or angry; you are frustrated and angry.

When there are positives to point out, you do it.

You both put into word what we feel and you do it so well!

Thank you!

Your guests are marvelous too! If you don't have time to catch the whole podcast, listen to the part with Conor! Really, really good stuff! Thank you, Eric!!!
RE: RE: The trade deadline is 11/5/2024  
BillKo : 9/17/2024 5:04 pm : link
In comment 16614208 Sean said:
Quote:
In comment 16614204 The Mike said:


Quote:


If the Giants are 0-8 or 1-7 after week eight (which is the 10/28/2024 Monday night game against Pittsburgh), they need to fire both Schoen and Daboll on 10/29/2024 (ironically the 95th anniversary of Black Tuesday) to ensure proper decisions are made at the trade deadline this year and effective planning is in place for the future BEFORE this season ends. And precisely to ensure that meaningless wins DO NOT happen this year! This silly "Giants Way" philosophy that major changes are not made in season makes zero sense.

And I agree with Sean. The back channel discussions with Belichick among others should be happening right now. The idea that Mara is waiting to see how many meaningless wins this team gets at the end of the season before making a judgment on the future leadership of this football team is lunacy.


100%. I'd like to see Schoen trying to trade for Bryce Young today. Can he be better than Drew Lock or Tommy DeVito? Isn't Daboll supposed to be a QB whisperer?

Try to buy low and have a cheap cost controlled QB for a few years. What's the risk? Do something. Be proactive for once at QB.


I don't think he's for sale.

But, maybe we should confirm with Terps.

Please hold............
RE: RE: RE: The trade deadline is 11/5/2024  
Go Terps : 9/17/2024 5:08 pm : link
In comment 16614373 BillKo said:
Quote:

I don't think he's for sale.

But, maybe we should confirm with Terps.

Please hold............


You wish. I'm not moving back to Jersey anyway.
I think he is right about Belichick  
moespree : 9/17/2024 5:20 pm : link
I won't say a guarantee but if the job opens up, I am positive Mara will offer It to him. Probably the GM job too.

And Belichick doing both jobs sounds like a recipe for disaster, but what else is new with the Giants.
Excellent episode  
arniefez : 9/17/2024 5:22 pm : link
I think the podcast is a great extension of BBI.
RE: I did want to say that this is a wonderful podcast and we are  
jvm52106 : 9/17/2024 6:49 pm : link
In comment 16614352 GiantBlue said:
Quote:
lucky to have it!

Eric, you always strike the right tone! When we're frustrated and/or angry; you are frustrated and angry.

When there are positives to point out, you do it.

You both put into word what we feel and you do it so well!

Thank you!

Your guests are marvelous too! If you don't have time to catch the whole podcast, listen to the part with Conor! Really, really good stuff! Thank you, Eric!!!


Appreciate it. Things will keep getting better. I am truly enjoying myself again.
Oh, so we take everything that Connor Hughes and the Jets as Gospel  
tblax : 9/17/2024 7:02 pm : link
Listen, I'm as fed up as everyone with where this team stands. But Hughes has been anti Giants for as long as I can remember andi certainly don't see the Jets being world beaters right now.
RE: Oh, so we take everything that Connor Hughes and the Jets as Gospel  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/17/2024 7:04 pm : link
In comment 16614478 tblax said:
Quote:
Hughes has been anti Giants for as long as I can remember


Huh?
RE: On the Jones contract  
Jerry in_DC : 9/17/2024 7:05 pm : link
In comment 16613905 Blue The Dog said:
Quote:
He is still giving the company line that they had no choice, which is ridiculous. He mentioned that there was no one available who they could have gotten, so of course they had to give Jones that contract, even through Darnold, Minshew, and Baker have all been available.

Then the more egregious part is the line "they couldn't have gotten Okereke if they tagged Jones". Bullshit. Sure, they might have had to choose between Saquon and Okereke last year, but what about all of the players they couldn't sign this year, and might not be able to sign next year because of the Jones contract? The bottom line is by choosing to give him that contract, they committed 52 million more dollars to him than if they tagged him and then let him walk after the disaster last year. Even if you account for the cost of signing a bridge starter this year (about 10-12 million), it still nets the Giants 40 million in extra cap space over 2 years without sacrificing QB play (any of those guys would play as well or better than Jones has over the past 2 years). So instead of talking about how we wouldn't be able to sign Okereke last year if we tagged him, how about we talk about the fact that we don't have a CB2 this year because they signed him to that contract. Or how we don't have a DT2, or swing tackle, or competent backup QB this year because they signed him.


Yeah I'm just listening now and that is absolutely maddening. Baker Mayfield who is significantly better than Daniel Jones signed for 1 year and $4 million. This is just complete insanity and ignorance.
RE: Oh, so we take everything that Connor Hughes and the Jets as Gospel  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/17/2024 7:09 pm : link
In comment 16614478 tblax said:
Quote:
Listen, I'm as fed up as everyone with where this team stands. But Hughes has been anti Giants for as long as I can remember andi certainly don't see the Jets being world beaters right now.


Connor worked for this site for a full year, back in Odell's first season.
RE: RE: RE: Also, this is not hindsight on my part  
gridirony : 9/17/2024 8:10 pm : link
In comment 16614190 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 16614182 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 16614136 Go Terps said:


Quote:


I said this back in December. If I were Mara I would have let Schoen and Daboll go and hired one of these three indisputably better options.



Bullshit - if you were Mara, you would have fired yourself out of spite!



If I were in Mara's shoes the Giants would be in a much better place. And that's not because I'm some kind of expert, it's because Mara has had a knack for choosing the worst possible path. A random number generator would have been a better CEO over this last 15 or so years.

Don't forget, Mara is also responsible for the stadium - a colossal failure.
Colossal

I saw what you did there.
great show  
The Jake : 9/17/2024 9:51 pm : link
i listened to the entire thing in the car.

one comment by Connor jumped out at me. i don’t know if he misspoke or what but he said “Daniel Jones is a good deep ball thrower” or something along those lines. i almost drove my car off the road.
"Organizational decision" to re-up Jones after 2022  
GiantTuff1 : 9/17/2024 10:03 pm : link
watch Connor's expression after John asks whether the rumors that the Jones contract was all on Schoen and Daboll... His expression helps absolve Schoen and Daboll to a good degree.

There is zero chance in hell the Jones signing was not heavily influenced by ownership. Zero.
RE: great show  
GiantTuff1 : 9/17/2024 10:03 pm : link
In comment 16614623 The Jake said:
Quote:
i listened to the entire thing in the car.

one comment by Connor jumped out at me. i don’t know if he misspoke or what but he said “Daniel Jones is a good deep ball thrower” or something along those lines. i almost drove my car off the road.

0-4 Sunday.

When has he hit a deep ball last, and one of consequence?
Great episode…few comments:  
FranknWeezer : 9/17/2024 10:42 pm : link
1. Surprised Connor and the fellas didn’t mention Ojulari as possible trade bait. He’s not that far removed from the draft, so a lot of teams did plenty of work on him him and surely think they could make something out of him. Maybe that he just hasn’t had the right coaching or motivation with the Giants. Young pass rushers (ones who have flashed talent like AO) don’t grow on trees, either.
2. That line about Jones winning 11 games for the Eagles made me laugh out loud. Was he kidding?!
3. John must be the friendliest podcast host I’ve ever heard in my life. Every time Eric gets out of line, John. always says “no, no, no, no…you’re good!”
4. Y’all are crushing it. Bravo!
I'm clearing my schedule on 10/28  
BlackLight : 9/17/2024 11:02 pm : link
for Giants @ Steelers on MNF. I really want to hear what Belichick has to say about this team on the Manningcast.
Great insight from Connor  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/18/2024 6:32 am : link
You can tell he knows his stuff and isn’t smug about like other beat reporters (Jordan Ranaaan)
Interesting hearing the Jets' assessment on Jones  
Lambuth_Special : 9/18/2024 8:09 am : link
Which is that he can be ok if you don't ask him to do post-snap reading of defenses.

No surprise Daboll is running a "just throw to Nabers" offense.
Some very interesting stuff in this interview  
HardTruth : 9/18/2024 9:09 am : link
#1- the Gano decision was so bad and obvious that Hughes and Duggan are using binoculars in warmups to scout his injury and noticed he didn’t look good and needed his groin wrapped

#2- he clearly states the Giants “defense “ of having to sign Jones for 4/160 instead of a 1/32 tag is that they “couldn’t have rounded out the roster” specifically meaning the signing of Okereke

How can you think if commiting so much cap space to the most important position by leveraging it with the signing of a solid if unspectacular Inside Linebacker?

This is just absolutely ridiculous and incompetent decision making coming from Schoen/Daboll

Just where is the long term strategic thinking?
RE: Interesting hearing the Jets' assessment on Jones  
Greg from LI : 9/18/2024 10:08 am : link
In comment 16614758 Lambuth_Special said:
Quote:
Which is that he can be ok if you don't ask him to do post-snap reading of defenses.


I'm a great driver, as long as I don't have to turn and can just keep driving in a straight line.
RE: RE: Interesting hearing the Jets' assessment on Jones  
Mike from Ohio : 9/18/2024 10:26 am : link
In comment 16614868 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 16614758 Lambuth_Special said:


Quote:


Which is that he can be ok if you don't ask him to do post-snap reading of defenses.



I'm a great driver, as long as I don't have to turn and can just keep driving in a straight line.


Our QB is good, as long as he doesn't need to understand what he is seeing, make decisions or think.

Thank you Joe and Brian. Good job not letting a guy like that get away in free agency.
RE: Interesting hearing the Jets' assessment on Jones  
HardTruth : 9/18/2024 10:42 am : link
In comment 16614758 Lambuth_Special said:
Quote:
Which is that he can be ok if you don't ask him to do post-snap reading of defenses.

No surprise Daboll is running a "just throw to Nabers" offense.



Citation Daniel Jones post game comments

“Dabs told me what he wanted, and like always I followed the plan”
Sneak peek at the Giants offensive play book  
Mike from Ohio : 9/18/2024 10:56 am : link
if things blow up  
TyreeHelmet : 9/18/2024 11:41 am : link
Then obviously they need to clean house. I don't care about continuity- they need to find the right people.

Vrabel or Belichick are strong options- but they are going to have a lot of suitors. Will the Giants be all that attractive?
Of course the Giants will be attractive  
Jerry in_DC : 9/18/2024 11:48 am : link
According to our CEO, we have an established franchise QB on a good contract and two of the most respected football personnel evaluators in the league in Chris and Tim. It's hard to imagine a better landing spot.
RE: Interesting hearing the Jets' assessment on Jones  
The Jake : 9/18/2024 3:23 pm : link
In comment 16614758 Lambuth_Special said:
Quote:
Which is that he can be ok if you don't ask him to do post-snap reading of defenses.

No surprise Daboll is running a "just throw to Nabers" offense.


is there a more damning "kiss of death" than the Jets thinking that DJ is a good quarterback?

what more evidence do you need MARA!?!?!?
Clown stuff is stupid  
bc4life : 9/18/2024 4:46 pm : link
You want to rip teh franchise, have at it. But...

The kicker was a dumb move - but defense lost that game.

Hughes said the thing about Jones that everyone forgets - lack of options, showed some ability, and had a nothing to work with especially OLine. Is he the answer - wouldn't bet on it. But....

Would like to see a stat on missed tackles.
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