In the eli era better than he was. I think he deserves to just be a giant great with an amazing/unusual legacy and left at that. The story of football can be told without eli manning but certainly not without the 07/11 giants (even considering how good eli was in 11)
This doesn’t make sense. If you can tell the story of football without Eli than 07-11 is irrelevant as well then.
Was about to post damn near the same thing as you. Spot on. No sense at all.
In the first one, that was Tom and the Pats greatest season ever. With everything on the line, Eli Manning drove his team down the field, with the pressure of planet earth on him, comes up with the greatest play in Super Bowl history. And he shouldn’t be first ballot??? And 4 years later he did the game winning drive again to a Pats team that was I believe 14-2.
Lest we forget the allllllll the teams Eli beat on the way to each run? 13-3 Dallas, 13-3 Favre led Green Bay in possibly the greatest game ever. 13-3 9ers. 15 AND 1 looking to repeat Aaron Rodgers prime led Green Bay. And two speed bum NFC south teams in Tampa and Atlanta.
Yes the defense helped, but what Super Bowl team doesn’t have good players all around. And it could be argued the 2007 Giants weren’t on anyone’s radar as a contender. And he did it with them as a wild card which was never done before.
First team to start 0-2 and win the Super Bowl I believe as well.
Shouldn't it be about passing numbers? Which Eli definitely has.
How about elevating your game in the playoffs and winning SBs? Check, check.
Except he doesn’t have the passing numbers. Yes he has the counting numbers: Total yards, completions, TDs. But voters recognize that those mostly only say that you had a long career. His efficiency numbers: Rating, completion %, Yards per attempt etc. do not stack up well.
He also doesn’t stack up well as far as awards/league leaders. Never voted All-Pro. Only 4 Pro Bowls, and twice it was as a replacement. Never received 1 vote for leauge MVP or Offensive Player of the Year. Never led the leauge in any stat except interceptions. There’s really no stretch of his career where he was one of the 5-6 best QBs in the game.
The 2 postseasons seasons runs are huge, no question. It’s really the only reason he’ll get serious consideration. But voters will also note he never won a postseason game outside of those 2 years.
Those 2 MVPs are absolutely a big deal. But do you put a guy in the Hall based pretty much totally on 2 postseasons?
I’m not saying he absolutely won’t get in. But I don’t think it’s close to the slam dunk a lot of you think it is.
Stafford is catching up to him and I think Russell Wilson is around him somewhere.
#3 all time consecutive starts by a QB
If Kurt Warner is in, then Eli gets in. Slam dunk.
If you’re banking on the counting numbers mattering a lot you may be disappointed.
Warner was MVP of the leauge twice. All-Pro twice. Among career leaders in efficiency numbers - rating, yards per attempt, etc. Went to three Super Bowls.
Only thing Eli can his hat on here is one more game MVP.
He continues to be amongst the top ten quarterbacks in NFL history in each of the primary passing stats. That alone would probably get him in, albeit not on the first ballot.
But his two Super Bowl runs are among the most extraordinary achievements in sports history. Winning Super Bowl MVPs by beating the greatest quarterback and head coach in NFL history, TWICE in four years, is unprecedented. It is a virtual certainty that an achievement like this will never happen again by anyone. Could someone come along in five years and not only beat Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes twice assuming they overtake Belichick and Brady as the GOATs of the sport, but also win two MVPs in doing so? Maybe. But I highly doubt it.
Just as the early history of the NFL's Super Bowl Era could not be written without Joe Namath, the 21st century NFL story could not be written without Eli Manning.
Induct Antoine Bethea as a Football Giant. Make it happen!
Darren Sproles is a weird one, but he won't get in. He was a good player, but Tiki has a MUCH better case.
Darren Sproles is not as odd of a choice as you think. It happened with some subtlety, but Sproles rose to 6th all-time in career all-purpose yards - and he was on the Eagles team that won the super bowl.
Tiki is 17th all-time in all-purpose yards (and no super bowl). He's also 15th in scrimmage yards, which is remarkable and keeps him in the conversation for HOF. But again, him retiring a year too soon and missing out on the SB is likely what will keep him out.
thing is so stupid IMO. You are either a HOFer or not. I do think the veteran's thing is useful. That's only baseball, right? Or it WAS useful because players without exposure a long time ago should possibly be revaluated, but that gets less and less necessary.
I'd argue Carl Banks has been long overlooked & is certainly a HOFer!
Darren Sproles is not as odd of a choice as you think. It happened with some subtlety, but Sproles rose to 6th all-time in career all-purpose yards - and he was on the Eagles team that won the super bowl.
Tiki is 17th all-time in all-purpose yards (and no super bowl). He's also 15th in scrimmage yards, which is remarkable and keeps him in the conversation for HOF. But again, him retiring a year too soon and missing out on the SB is likely what will keep him out.
Yeah, no. His entire case is built on kick return yardage which doesn’t hold a lot of coin. Their not putting ia RB in the Hall with 3500 yards of rushing.
so he will probably get in first ballot. Jim in fairfax had it right his counting numbers are there but his efficiency is average and in some cases sub average.
He’s in because of the playoff and super bowl success. Top 10 in completions and yards means little he also had way more starts than qbs from previous eras.
Is he hof worthy yes. but not the slam dunk some are suggesting. Most qbs in the hall have a better case than him.
Should be first ballot but can see him waiting a year
One of the few HOF QB's who did not play with another HOF player on offense. Tiki possibly but Eli made his mark after he left. Many HOF QB's had multiple. Ben played with DeCastro, Pouncey, Bell and Brown the back end of his career. HOF players his first few years as well.
The Manning Inc. stuff is stupid and disrespectful but not surprising. Eli will earn it on merit.
so he will probably get in first ballot. Jim in fairfax had it right his counting numbers are there but his efficiency is average and in some cases sub average.
He’s in because of the playoff and super bowl success. Top 10 in completions and yards means little he also had way more starts than qbs from previous eras.
Is he hof worthy yes. but not the slam dunk some are suggesting. Most qbs in the hall have a better case than him.
Agreed. The weak class might get him in, but there’s enough good holdover finalists from last year that a lot of voters will probably decide to punt on him for now. And then the QB parade starts:
5-6 QBs per generation have been getting in. Peyton is already in from Eli’s generation. Brees, Roethlisberger, Brady and Rodgers are slam dunks. That’s 5 already. Favre and Warner overlapped the first 1/3 of his career and are in. Russell Wilson is on the edge but could be a shoe iIn if he finishes his career string. Rivers doesn’t have the playoff success (bad teams around him), but put up better numbers. Voters may start looking squinty eyed at how many of these guys get in.
In the eli era better than he was. I think he deserves to just be a giant great with an amazing/unusual legacy and left at that. The story of football can be told without eli manning but certainly not without the 07/11 giants (even considering how good eli was in 11)
Stafford is catching up to him and I think Russell Wilson is around him somewhere.
#3 all time consecutive starts by a QB
If Kurt Warner is in, then Eli gets in. Slam dunk.
If you’re banking on the counting numbers mattering a lot you may be disappointed.
Warner was MVP of the leauge twice. All-Pro twice. Among career leaders in efficiency numbers - rating, yards per attempt, etc. Went to three Super Bowls.
Only thing Eli can his hat on here is one more game MVP.
Then all that glory was gone by 2002 after he LOST the second Super Bowl to New England. There are plenty of MVPs not in the pro football HOF.
His little 1999 story was cute and everything, but I'm sure the Rams have no problem winning the Super Bowl with Trent Green.
Warner's career was insignificant for 5-6 years until his revival in Arizona.
I'm saying if Warner's "feel good movie story" and achievements for those few years is what got him in, you can count Eli in as well for those 2 Super Bowls.
The Eli numbers, like I said, aren't bad either. The yards, the TDs, the consecutive starts.
Who is above him in the yards and TD stats besides Brees, Big Ben, Brady, Peyton, etc?
But, to me, in either case, I hate this 1st ballot question or obsession. If I am voting, the only question is, does this guy belong in the HOF. Period. If the answer is yes, then I vote yes. I don't care what ballot it is, will it be unanimous, etc.
RE: I know football works differently than baseball for HOF voting
But, to me, in either case, I hate this 1st ballot question or obsession. If I am voting, the only question is, does this guy belong in the HOF. Period. If the answer is yes, then I vote yes. I don't care what ballot it is, will it be unanimous, etc.
How many times did Eli march the Giants down and score, give the lead back to a D that couldn't hold it? (many)
Shouldn't it be about passing numbers? Which Eli definitely has.
How about elevating your game in the playoffs and winning SBs? Check, check.
He'll get in. It's just a matter of whether the voters will be dicks about the 1st ballot -- like they were when they made Strahan wait a year.
Quote:
In the eli era better than he was. I think he deserves to just be a giant great with an amazing/unusual legacy and left at that. The story of football can be told without eli manning but certainly not without the 07/11 giants (even considering how good eli was in 11)
This doesn’t make sense. If you can tell the story of football without Eli than 07-11 is irrelevant as well then.
Was about to post damn near the same thing as you. Spot on. No sense at all.
Lest we forget the allllllll the teams Eli beat on the way to each run? 13-3 Dallas, 13-3 Favre led Green Bay in possibly the greatest game ever. 13-3 9ers. 15 AND 1 looking to repeat Aaron Rodgers prime led Green Bay. And two speed bum NFC south teams in Tampa and Atlanta.
Yes the defense helped, but what Super Bowl team doesn’t have good players all around. And it could be argued the 2007 Giants weren’t on anyone’s radar as a contender. And he did it with them as a wild card which was never done before.
First team to start 0-2 and win the Super Bowl I believe as well.
What more does a man have to do?!
Shouldn't it be about passing numbers? Which Eli definitely has.
How about elevating your game in the playoffs and winning SBs? Check, check.
Except he doesn’t have the passing numbers. Yes he has the counting numbers: Total yards, completions, TDs. But voters recognize that those mostly only say that you had a long career. His efficiency numbers: Rating, completion %, Yards per attempt etc. do not stack up well.
He also doesn’t stack up well as far as awards/league leaders. Never voted All-Pro. Only 4 Pro Bowls, and twice it was as a replacement. Never received 1 vote for leauge MVP or Offensive Player of the Year. Never led the leauge in any stat except interceptions. There’s really no stretch of his career where he was one of the 5-6 best QBs in the game.
The 2 postseasons seasons runs are huge, no question. It’s really the only reason he’ll get serious consideration. But voters will also note he never won a postseason game outside of those 2 years.
Those 2 MVPs are absolutely a big deal. But do you put a guy in the Hall based pretty much totally on 2 postseasons?
I’m not saying he absolutely won’t get in. But I don’t think it’s close to the slam dunk a lot of you think it is.
Top 10 all time passing touchdowns
Stafford is catching up to him and I think Russell Wilson is around him somewhere.
#3 all time consecutive starts by a QB
If Kurt Warner is in, then Eli gets in. Slam dunk.
Top 10 all time passing touchdowns
Stafford is catching up to him and I think Russell Wilson is around him somewhere.
#3 all time consecutive starts by a QB
If Kurt Warner is in, then Eli gets in. Slam dunk.
If you’re banking on the counting numbers mattering a lot you may be disappointed.
Warner was MVP of the leauge twice. All-Pro twice. Among career leaders in efficiency numbers - rating, yards per attempt, etc. Went to three Super Bowls.
Only thing Eli can his hat on here is one more game MVP.
If they need to do a little charm offensive, they have the outlets.
But his two Super Bowl runs are among the most extraordinary achievements in sports history. Winning Super Bowl MVPs by beating the greatest quarterback and head coach in NFL history, TWICE in four years, is unprecedented. It is a virtual certainty that an achievement like this will never happen again by anyone. Could someone come along in five years and not only beat Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes twice assuming they overtake Belichick and Brady as the GOATs of the sport, but also win two MVPs in doing so? Maybe. But I highly doubt it.
Just as the early history of the NFL's Super Bowl Era could not be written without Joe Namath, the 21st century NFL story could not be written without Eli Manning.
+1
Does anyone really think his colleagues and others who work at outlets with strong financial ties to the Mannings are voting no?
Quote:
Vernon Davis? Lol.
Induct Antoine Bethea as a Football Giant. Make it happen!
Darren Sproles is a weird one, but he won't get in. He was a good player, but Tiki has a MUCH better case.
Darren Sproles is not as odd of a choice as you think. It happened with some subtlety, but Sproles rose to 6th all-time in career all-purpose yards - and he was on the Eagles team that won the super bowl.
Tiki is 17th all-time in all-purpose yards (and no super bowl). He's also 15th in scrimmage yards, which is remarkable and keeps him in the conversation for HOF. But again, him retiring a year too soon and missing out on the SB is likely what will keep him out.
I'd argue Carl Banks has been long overlooked & is certainly a HOFer!
Darren Sproles is not as odd of a choice as you think. It happened with some subtlety, but Sproles rose to 6th all-time in career all-purpose yards - and he was on the Eagles team that won the super bowl.
Tiki is 17th all-time in all-purpose yards (and no super bowl). He's also 15th in scrimmage yards, which is remarkable and keeps him in the conversation for HOF. But again, him retiring a year too soon and missing out on the SB is likely what will keep him out.
Yeah, no. His entire case is built on kick return yardage which doesn’t hold a lot of coin. Their not putting ia RB in the Hall with 3500 yards of rushing.
He’s in because of the playoff and super bowl success. Top 10 in completions and yards means little he also had way more starts than qbs from previous eras.
Is he hof worthy yes. but not the slam dunk some are suggesting. Most qbs in the hall have a better case than him.
The Manning Inc. stuff is stupid and disrespectful but not surprising. Eli will earn it on merit.
Disrespectful to whom? You?
He’s in because of the playoff and super bowl success. Top 10 in completions and yards means little he also had way more starts than qbs from previous eras.
Is he hof worthy yes. but not the slam dunk some are suggesting. Most qbs in the hall have a better case than him.
Agreed. The weak class might get him in, but there’s enough good holdover finalists from last year that a lot of voters will probably decide to punt on him for now. And then the QB parade starts:
2026: Brees, Rivers
2027: Roethlisberger
2028: Brady
5-6 QBs per generation have been getting in. Peyton is already in from Eli’s generation. Brees, Roethlisberger, Brady and Rodgers are slam dunks. That’s 5 already. Favre and Warner overlapped the first 1/3 of his career and are in. Russell Wilson is on the edge but could be a shoe iIn if he finishes his career string. Rivers doesn’t have the playoff success (bad teams around him), but put up better numbers. Voters may start looking squinty eyed at how many of these guys get in.
Huh?
Top 10 all time passing touchdowns
Stafford is catching up to him and I think Russell Wilson is around him somewhere.
#3 all time consecutive starts by a QB
If Kurt Warner is in, then Eli gets in. Slam dunk.
If you’re banking on the counting numbers mattering a lot you may be disappointed.
Warner was MVP of the leauge twice. All-Pro twice. Among career leaders in efficiency numbers - rating, yards per attempt, etc. Went to three Super Bowls.
Only thing Eli can his hat on here is one more game MVP.
Then all that glory was gone by 2002 after he LOST the second Super Bowl to New England. There are plenty of MVPs not in the pro football HOF.
His little 1999 story was cute and everything, but I'm sure the Rams have no problem winning the Super Bowl with Trent Green.
Warner's career was insignificant for 5-6 years until his revival in Arizona.
I'm saying if Warner's "feel good movie story" and achievements for those few years is what got him in, you can count Eli in as well for those 2 Super Bowls.
The Eli numbers, like I said, aren't bad either. The yards, the TDs, the consecutive starts.
Who is above him in the yards and TD stats besides Brees, Big Ben, Brady, Peyton, etc?
Then all that glory was gone by 2002 after he LOST the second Super Bowl to New England. There are plenty of MVPs not in the pro football HOF.
Every retired player who has won multiple MVPs is in the HOF. Except Brady who obviously will be.
Who is above him in the yards and TD stats besides Brees, Big Ben, Brady, Peyton, etc?
Rivers and Matt Ryan.
Lol. Rivers and Matt Ryan.
I know what you said. Winning multiple times matters.
Lots of QBs have won a single Super Bowl and aren’t in the Hall of Fame.
Lol. Rivers and Matt Ryan.
Exactly. Yet you’re using Eli’s numbers to burnish his claim.