on what the Giants would/should do with the #1 or #2 pick if they got it, but thought it was a bit premature.
Will Johnson - Deonte Banks - Dru Phillips would be an elite CB group - passing up on that to roll the dice on Beck or Ewers feels like a disaster waiting to happen.
...so according to Connor Hughes, sounds like this team needs to get to at least 4 wins!
Interesting; where did you hear him say that?
I don't get this. Of course Schoen expects to be here next year. He should think that. You think he's saying, 'Oh well. I'm going to get fired so I might as well not scout players?' I'm sure Gettleman was scouting players in '21.
I honestly do believe that, barring him morphing into something he's never been, Jones won't be on the roster in '25.
I won't believe it until it's done. We are paying half his cap hit either way. Makes it easier to talk themselves into it. If he plays a few games like he did in Washington, it's definitely in the realm of possibilities that we draft McMillian and we have a prove it year for Jones next season.
DeSean Watson where they quote a former NFL exec who names Ewers and Nussmeier like they were the two top QB prospects. I wonder if that’s the current consensus among the scouts.
DeSean Watson where they quote a former NFL exec who names Ewers and Nussmeier like they were the two top QB prospects. I wonder if that’s the current consensus among the scouts.
I have been hyping Nussmeier around here for about a month. Because so many players opt out of bowls, especially the non-playoff bowls, they are much less interesting, and I just don't watch as many.
I was on YouTube a month ago and watched a condensed version of the ReliaQuest Bowl between LSU and Wisconsin. Nussmeier was playing QB because - wisely - Daniels opted out. And, man, did his arm talent jump off the screen. Kid was throwing darts all over the field - short, mid and deep.
So, I did some more research and thought he might be a hidden gem going into this year. He can really spin it.
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
I'm a BC alum so been keeping track of any draftable guys when I watch. He's played center and guard, looks solid but I don't really know much about scouting OL. He has worked with Snee at BC already who is now onboard as a scout so they have all the info on him they need.
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
He had a very average game against Kentucky’s good defense.
But at crunch time he was 5 for 7 with several completions in tight windows on the TD drive. He did miss a wide open WR on a deep pass.He made mistakes that game.It’s a long season and he intrigues me with his tool set.
It’s a long season but Beck and Ewers will be high on multiple teams boards.
I do worry a bit that Ewers always seems to be nicked up with injuries the last several years.
Ward and Sanders are also getting a lot of interest by draft analysts.
It might turn out to be a good QB group headed to the draft.
Glad that Schoen and scouts on the road checking out the QB’s.
It’s a top priority for the Giants.
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
Who says they aren’t as good? The season has barely started and there look to be another handful of WBs at the top. It’s anyone’s guess how these guys transition to the pro game as we’ve seen countless times.
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
To suggest none of these QBs can be as good as JJ freakin McCarthy is laughable. As is your strange idea that since they didn’t love any of the QBs remaining last year so they should punt the QB position for all of eternity now
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
To suggest none of these QBs can be as good as JJ freakin McCarthy is laughable. As is your strange idea that since they didn’t love any of the QBs remaining last year so they should punt the QB position for all of eternity now
This is his way of being able to shit on whateber QB they select next year even though he has been begging for a new QB...
The Giants finish bottom 3. Some teams want to come up for a QB. Giants trade down, take a D lineman or CB and build up draft capital for the following year. Arch in '26.
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
To suggest none of these QBs can be as good as JJ freakin McCarthy is laughable. As is your strange idea that since they didn’t love any of the QBs remaining last year so they should punt the QB position for all of eternity now
You're confusing what GT wants to happen with what he believes will happen.
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
Pay attention to how NYG operate over the last 50 years or so. I said it once ill say it again, for all this talk of Mara meddling or forcing Schoen/Daboll's hand in signing Jones to that contract, to me that was always a stretch to believe because Mara is known to NOT force players on his GM or HC. He lets them choose who to draft and sign with maybe a few guard rails in there (character issues or what not)
BUT...what everyone around here amazingly seems to have missed is Mara quite possibly said no way in hell are you cutting Jones or signing an expensive FA QB. You signed Jones to that deal...you fucking fix him or wait until April 25 to draft the next guy. Now, I do think they tried to trade up and get Maye so I don't think Mara was against drafting a QB last April, but I wouldn't be shocked in the least to learn that MAra said no fucking way to any DJ cut talk or any vet FA pushing him talk.
IN short, there won't be as many obstacles in finding a QB next off-season either via the draft or FA. Jones will be more cuttable and have failed to win an acceptable number of games for 2 straight seasons.
I keep saying it. Follow the money. Don't follow the rumors or speculation. Follow the money.
forget obstacles next offseason. One could predict that the Giants will HAVE to draft or sign a QB as Jones could very well be off the team.
I still think a VET FA is quite possible next offseason. Again, look at how the Giants operate over the years. They followed up the Dave Brown era with a FA vet in Kerry Collins and he was far from a sure thing when signed here. They did this in the 70s as well.
LIst of FA QBs to be as of now--obviously this could change.
Darnold and Garoppolo jump out. And don't be shocked if it's someone like that or even a bigger project like Wentz. Giants love to try and fix broken QBs. Daboll may try to save his own ass by proclaiming he can fix someone on the relative cheap. See Fassel and Kerry Collins 1999.
Giants won't be going 2-15 you can pretty much bank on that. They will win games at some point because even bad teams win games at some point. It's a long season. Even if they go 5-12 that's probably around 4-th or 5th in any typical draft. What does that guarantee? Some flawed but decent QB prospect that's what. Don't be shocked if they sign a vet QB and draft BPA.
My point is watch how quickly all the people who spouted "you can't draft a QB just to draft a QB" change their tune when the Giants do exactly that.
I know I hear you. I wasn't calling out your take just saying this is how they might operate. Your take just sort of sparked my belief since you you mentioned QB and the draft. I could see NYG going vet QB but things can change. I mean you could do worse than Jimmy G and maybe draft a development QB in rounds 2-3. Knowing the Giants they fuck it up.
He is very fast and dynamic, especially after he's caught the ball...and yet the Giants have scored 24 points in two games.
Two things:
1. Good WRs can't cover up for bad QBs
2. WRs are easy to find in the draft; QBs are not
Re #2 did you mean to say good QBs? Because QBs are certainly easy to find. The Giants could have easily drafted McCarthy, Nix, Penix, etc.
This past draft, I'd say there were 3 QBs the Giants would have taken over Nabers: Williams, Daniels, and Maye.
I don't at all see what is unreasonable about that approach. They weren't high enough and couldn't make a deal to get one of the 3 QBs they liked. So you don't reach for a QB you aren't high on. Instead, you take a Pro Bowl level player at WR. Good team building approach IMO.
Next season, I would expect the same, though I expect them to be drafting higher unfortunately. That is, if they don't get a starting QB through draft or trade, or Jones somehow miraculously stays healthy all year and shows to be a good starting QB. Again, I don't expect that to happen at all.
They will do the same this year. They may not have any QBs on par with some of the top other players grade-wise, but if there is a QB they like when they pick, they will get him. I don't see what is remotely controversial about that. The Giants shouldn't have taken a QB for the sake of taking a QB this year, and they shouldn't any other year.
The question is why trust them? Their big moves at QB have been to pay Jones and replace Taylor with Lock.
There is no reason to believe they could evaluate their way out of a paper bag.
So by those statements, it tells me you agree that the current regimes evaluations of QBs have been terrible. So wouldn't you want them to add a Nabers type talent, rather than miss badly on throwing another high asset at their 4th favorite QB in a draft?
The question is why trust them? Their big moves at QB have been to pay Jones and replace Taylor with Lock.
There is no reason to believe they could evaluate their way out of a paper bag.
So by those statements, it tells me you agree that the current regimes evaluations of QBs have been terrible. So wouldn't you want them to add a Nabers type talent, rather than miss badly on throwing another high asset at their 4th favorite QB in a draft?
I'd rather they were good at evaluating QBs. If they were, I think they would have taken one last year.
At this point my hope is that they aren't around to pick the next QB.
My point is watch how quickly all the people who spouted "you can't draft a QB just to draft a QB" change their tune when the Giants do exactly that.
Say what you want about their talent evaluations but they didn’t “draft a QB just to draft a QB” this past season, did they? They had 3 they liked and none were available so they didn’t just take any ole QB. That should tell you that if they do in fact take one this next season it is because they actually like him, no? So no, if they take a QB it doesn’t mean they are taking one just to take one. They drove you insane because they didn’t do that this past year so you don’t get to accuse them of doing it when they do finally take one
If the Giants pass on Tetairoa McMillan for a lesser-than-last-year QB
They are talking about this kid and his tools in the same breath or notch below Calvin Johnson. That would be like passing on Calvin Johnson for Daniel Jones in 2019. The sad part is I see how they would justify it caving to fan pressure and embarrassment like they usually do. All reactive and no plan.
If they do something like this they doubly confirm to everyone they are weak and spineless at 125 Giants Way. No North Star. No plan.
My point is watch how quickly all the people who spouted "you can't draft a QB just to draft a QB" change their tune when the Giants do exactly that.
Say what you want about their talent evaluations but they didn’t “draft a QB just to draft a QB” this past season, did they? They had 3 they liked and none were available so they didn’t just take any ole QB. That should tell you that if they do in fact take one this next season it is because they actually like him, no? So no, if they take a QB it doesn’t mean they are taking one just to take one. They drove you insane because they didn’t do that this past year so you don’t get to accuse them of doing it when they do finally take one
But if the QBs aren't graded as high as other players, they would be taking one just to take one. They're going to go from "not shopping hungry" to shopping while starved half to death.
Terps point is that everyone who said they couldn't pass on a superior talent at another position to take a qb in April 2024 is likely going to be saying how they have to take a qb and pass on superior talent at another position in April of 2025.
And further, everything I read coming into this year was about how this QB class was weaker than last year's. I've seen nothing thus far to change that opinion, but you can sense people already talking themselves into this year's class.
It comes back to what I've said for years: the Giants could draft an inanimate carbon rod and there'd be fans taking themselves into it.
And further, everything I read coming into this year was about how this QB class was weaker than last year's. I've seen nothing thus far to change that opinion, but you can sense people already talking themselves into this year's class.
It comes back to what I've said for years: the Giants could draft an inanimate carbon rod and there'd be fans taking themselves into it.
It is weaker in the sense that there isn't a Williams/Daniels level prospect. That being said, Ewers and Ward have shown progress this year that could get them on McCarthy/Nix/Penix level by the end of the season.
I dont think they can bring DJ back with his contract being what it is
There are those of us who have mentioned something along the lines of him playing like he's never played before. Even if he did, the Giants have to treat that as an outlier and look at his injury history, his cap impact and his average performance over the course of his career and make the correct 'analytical' call to cut him. That said who do you get back into the 'room'. Daboll had me on board with his ability to win with a 3rd string qb last year. Problem is, he seems to be a better QB coach than a HC. I like some of what he has done but a HC needs to be on top of all aspects of his team or delegating to the right people . He doesn't strike me as being that guy. So I feel we will best be served with a new QB and New HC. and the cycle starts....again.
And you can say that so far Schoen or Schoen/Daboll look to have
made the right call with Nabors. McCarthy lost one year off his rookie contract and Nix is struggling with a QB 'whisperer' HC. Penix hasn't been seen and I know it was a win, but when Cousins starts launching balls into the 10th row of the endzone seats, I think that time will come this season. Still not sure I trust our two to choose the next QB. I think their are a few guys I trust....of course Shanahan, O'Connell in Minn., and LaFluer. I think I trust Daboll as much, just want more success as a HC and not just victories.
RE: RE: Guess Schoen is planning to be here next year...
And further, everything I read coming into this year was about how this QB class was weaker than last year's. I've seen nothing thus far to change that opinion, but you can sense people already talking themselves into this year's class.
It comes back to what I've said for years: the Giants could draft an inanimate carbon rod and there'd be fans taking themselves into it.
It is weaker in the sense that there isn't a Williams/Daniels level prospect. That being said, Ewers and Ward have shown progress this year that could get them on McCarthy/Nix/Penix level by the end of the season.
Well Schoen and Daboll had the chance to draft a prospect like that and decided to pass, so why should we believe they would draft that player now?
This actually furthers GT's point. So many on here were saying you couldn't take a QB at 6 because they weren't slam dunk prospects, so you should take the "stud" WR instead. If this years crop of QBs tops out at the same level as the QBs available at 6, should we again pass on QB for the next "stud" and punt QB again?
And further, everything I read coming into this year was about how this QB class was weaker than last year's. I've seen nothing thus far to change that opinion, but you can sense people already talking themselves into this year's class.
It comes back to what I've said for years: the Giants could draft an inanimate carbon rod and there'd be fans taking themselves into it.
The problem with this is that at this point last season it was Williams and Maye being the apples of everyone’s eyes. There was little chatter of any of the others being worthy of top 10 picks. Daniels got on the radar rather quickly but it took a long time for McCarthy, Nix and Penix to enter the conversation.
There very likely will be some good QBs rising as the year goes on, just like last year but I wouldn’t expect you to come around on any of them, regardless of how good they become because you’ve already decided that all the QBs suck. Two weeks in…
I'm going based on what I've read and seen - including from Sy and Colin on the BBI podcast.
I'll be fine with it if the Giants take a QB in round 1 (though I hope it isn't Beck because I'm pretty sure he stinks). I've said a million times they should take a QB at some point in every draft.
My point is you can already feel the tide of optimistic bullshit about this year's class starting to rise, even though like you said it's only been a couple weeks.
And why is it starting to rise? To justify the decision to pass on QB last year.
This feels like 2018/2019 all over again. The main difference is that Arch Manning looms in 2026. who's up for a 4-13 2025???
like was said above there are a bunch of players at other positions that figure to grade higher than the highest quarterback. So by last year's rationale the Giants should pass on QB again, right?
like was said above there are a bunch of players at other positions that figure to grade higher than the highest quarterback. So by last year's rationale the Giants should pass on QB again, right?
I don't think that is necessarily accurate. Teams don't have a numerical list from 1 to X and say who is the highest. At least as it pertains to Nix and Penix there were a fair number of people who did not have them as definite first rounders. If you look at Bob McGinn's compilation, the only QB's with 1st Round grades were Williams, Daniels, Maye and McCarthy. Penix had a 1st-2nd Grade and Nix had a 2nd-3rd Grade. Personally I would have given strong consideration to McCarthy at 6 because he was a 1st Round graded QB. If we are picking in the Top 2 or 3 in the 2025 Draft and have a QB who we have a 1st Round grade on we really should be looking at that (assuming no surprises between now and then).
I'm going based on what I've read and seen - including from Sy and Colin on the BBI podcast.
I'll be fine with it if the Giants take a QB in round 1 (though I hope it isn't Beck because I'm pretty sure he stinks). I've said a million times they should take a QB at some point in every draft.
My point is you can already feel the tide of optimistic bullshit about this year's class starting to rise, even though like you said it's only been a couple weeks.
And why is it starting to rise? To justify the decision to pass on QB last year.
This feels like 2018/2019 all over again. The main difference is that Arch Manning looms in 2026. who's up for a 4-13 2025???
Could it be possible that the opinions of this years class is starting to change because people are seeing QBs they knew absolutely nothing about playing extremely well? Nussmeier for example. That dude can spin it. But he was behind Daniels last season so nobody knew who the hell he was. He was fantastic in their bowl game when Daniels sat out but that was a one game sample size. Or what about Cam Ward? He was an afterthought coming into the season. He looks incredible so far. Should people not change their opinions as they become more informed and more evidence is provided?
Sure, it’s possible all of these QBs suck. It’s also possible that all of this past drafts QBs suck. Daniels is the only one we’ve seen even a shred of evidence that he can play so far so let’s not act like the story has already been written on either draft class
treat the QB position like a monarchy, I'm getting to the point where I maybe don't want to pick a guy at the top of the draft. The next guy might not be good and I can't do this 6 year thing again.
Maybe McMillan, Nabers, decent OL, and a rotating cast of cheap characters at QB is enough on offense.
Tattoo or not, I'm less and less convinced he should be on top of anybody's board.
Of course, that assumes Jones won't be going into his 14th year here...
Will Johnson - Deonte Banks - Dru Phillips would be an elite CB group - passing up on that to roll the dice on Beck or Ewers feels like a disaster waiting to happen.
I still think Giants will go the Vet QB route
Interesting; where did you hear him say that?
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...so according to Connor Hughes, sounds like this team needs to get to at least 4 wins!
Interesting; where did you hear him say that?
I don't get this. Of course Schoen expects to be here next year. He should think that. You think he's saying, 'Oh well. I'm going to get fired so I might as well not scout players?' I'm sure Gettleman was scouting players in '21.
Schoen will be here until he's not.
I won't believe it until it's done. We are paying half his cap hit either way. Makes it easier to talk themselves into it. If he plays a few games like he did in Washington, it's definitely in the realm of possibilities that we draft McMillian and we have a prove it year for Jones next season.
I have been hyping Nussmeier around here for about a month. Because so many players opt out of bowls, especially the non-playoff bowls, they are much less interesting, and I just don't watch as many.
I was on YouTube a month ago and watched a condensed version of the ReliaQuest Bowl between LSU and Wisconsin. Nussmeier was playing QB because - wisely - Daniels opted out. And, man, did his arm talent jump off the screen. Kid was throwing darts all over the field - short, mid and deep.
So, I did some more research and thought he might be a hidden gem going into this year. He can really spin it.
Not if he forces his way to NY like his uncle 😌
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NYG does get #1 overall
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
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In comment 16615389 Scooter185 said:
Quote:
NYG does get #1 overall
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
Which is possible.
Otherwise, Ewers health issues is gonna be a big problem.
But at crunch time he was 5 for 7 with several completions in tight windows on the TD drive. He did miss a wide open WR on a deep pass.He made mistakes that game.It’s a long season and he intrigues me with his tool set.
It’s a long season but Beck and Ewers will be high on multiple teams boards.
I do worry a bit that Ewers always seems to be nicked up with injuries the last several years.
Ward and Sanders are also getting a lot of interest by draft analysts.
It might turn out to be a good QB group headed to the draft.
Glad that Schoen and scouts on the road checking out the QB’s.
It’s a top priority for the Giants.
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In comment 16615401 Go Terps said:
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In comment 16615389 Scooter185 said:
Quote:
NYG does get #1 overall
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
Who says they aren’t as good? The season has barely started and there look to be another handful of WBs at the top. It’s anyone’s guess how these guys transition to the pro game as we’ve seen countless times.
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In comment 16615401 Go Terps said:
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In comment 16615389 Scooter185 said:
Quote:
NYG does get #1 overall
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
To suggest none of these QBs can be as good as JJ freakin McCarthy is laughable. As is your strange idea that since they didn’t love any of the QBs remaining last year so they should punt the QB position for all of eternity now
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In comment 16615630 BestFeature said:
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In comment 16615401 Go Terps said:
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In comment 16615389 Scooter185 said:
Quote:
NYG does get #1 overall
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
To suggest none of these QBs can be as good as JJ freakin McCarthy is laughable. As is your strange idea that since they didn’t love any of the QBs remaining last year so they should punt the QB position for all of eternity now
This is his way of being able to shit on whateber QB they select next year even though he has been begging for a new QB...
He wants to keep his schtick going no matter what
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In comment 16615630 BestFeature said:
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In comment 16615401 Go Terps said:
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In comment 16615389 Scooter185 said:
Quote:
NYG does get #1 overall
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
To suggest none of these QBs can be as good as JJ freakin McCarthy is laughable. As is your strange idea that since they didn’t love any of the QBs remaining last year so they should punt the QB position for all of eternity now
You're confusing what GT wants to happen with what he believes will happen.
So, they'll get first pick of the QB's in next year's draft.
So, they'll get first pick of the QB's in next year's draft.
Idk, Dalton is going to be an improvement over Young
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In comment 16615401 Go Terps said:
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In comment 16615389 Scooter185 said:
Quote:
NYG does get #1 overall
There's a WR graded higher than all the QBs, who do you take?
Exactly. If the Giants have the top pick are they supposed to pass on Tetairoa McMillan, Travis Hunter, Will Johnson, James Pearce, Mason Graham, etc. so they can take Carson freaking Beck? No way.
I can't tell if that's you mocking similar takes or serious. If serious, how is that different from what happened last year where the top 3 QBs were taken and Nabers was available?
That's my point. If taking a QB wasn't ok last year how is it OK this year when the QBs aren't as good?
Pay attention to how NYG operate over the last 50 years or so. I said it once ill say it again, for all this talk of Mara meddling or forcing Schoen/Daboll's hand in signing Jones to that contract, to me that was always a stretch to believe because Mara is known to NOT force players on his GM or HC. He lets them choose who to draft and sign with maybe a few guard rails in there (character issues or what not)
BUT...what everyone around here amazingly seems to have missed is Mara quite possibly said no way in hell are you cutting Jones or signing an expensive FA QB. You signed Jones to that deal...you fucking fix him or wait until April 25 to draft the next guy. Now, I do think they tried to trade up and get Maye so I don't think Mara was against drafting a QB last April, but I wouldn't be shocked in the least to learn that MAra said no fucking way to any DJ cut talk or any vet FA pushing him talk.
IN short, there won't be as many obstacles in finding a QB next off-season either via the draft or FA. Jones will be more cuttable and have failed to win an acceptable number of games for 2 straight seasons.
I keep saying it. Follow the money. Don't follow the rumors or speculation. Follow the money.
I still think a VET FA is quite possible next offseason. Again, look at how the Giants operate over the years. They followed up the Dave Brown era with a FA vet in Kerry Collins and he was far from a sure thing when signed here. They did this in the 70s as well.
LIst of FA QBs to be as of now--obviously this could change.
Darnold and Garoppolo jump out. And don't be shocked if it's someone like that or even a bigger project like Wentz. Giants love to try and fix broken QBs. Daboll may try to save his own ass by proclaiming he can fix someone on the relative cheap. See Fassel and Kerry Collins 1999.
Giants won't be going 2-15 you can pretty much bank on that. They will win games at some point because even bad teams win games at some point. It's a long season. Even if they go 5-12 that's probably around 4-th or 5th in any typical draft. What does that guarantee? Some flawed but decent QB prospect that's what. Don't be shocked if they sign a vet QB and draft BPA.
Link - ( New Window )
I know I hear you. I wasn't calling out your take just saying this is how they might operate. Your take just sort of sparked my belief since you you mentioned QB and the draft. I could see NYG going vet QB but things can change. I mean you could do worse than Jimmy G and maybe draft a development QB in rounds 2-3. Knowing the Giants they fuck it up.
Two things:
1. Good WRs can't cover up for bad QBs
2. WRs are easy to find in the draft; QBs are not
Re #2 did you mean to say good QBs? Because QBs are certainly easy to find. The Giants could have easily drafted McCarthy, Nix, Penix, etc.
This past draft, I'd say there were 3 QBs the Giants would have taken over Nabers: Williams, Daniels, and Maye.
I don't at all see what is unreasonable about that approach. They weren't high enough and couldn't make a deal to get one of the 3 QBs they liked. So you don't reach for a QB you aren't high on. Instead, you take a Pro Bowl level player at WR. Good team building approach IMO.
Next season, I would expect the same, though I expect them to be drafting higher unfortunately. That is, if they don't get a starting QB through draft or trade, or Jones somehow miraculously stays healthy all year and shows to be a good starting QB. Again, I don't expect that to happen at all.
They will do the same this year. They may not have any QBs on par with some of the top other players grade-wise, but if there is a QB they like when they pick, they will get him. I don't see what is remotely controversial about that. The Giants shouldn't have taken a QB for the sake of taking a QB this year, and they shouldn't any other year.
There is no reason to believe they could evaluate their way out of a paper bag.
There is no reason to believe they could evaluate their way out of a paper bag.
So by those statements, it tells me you agree that the current regimes evaluations of QBs have been terrible. So wouldn't you want them to add a Nabers type talent, rather than miss badly on throwing another high asset at their 4th favorite QB in a draft?
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The question is why trust them? Their big moves at QB have been to pay Jones and replace Taylor with Lock.
There is no reason to believe they could evaluate their way out of a paper bag.
So by those statements, it tells me you agree that the current regimes evaluations of QBs have been terrible. So wouldn't you want them to add a Nabers type talent, rather than miss badly on throwing another high asset at their 4th favorite QB in a draft?
I'd rather they were good at evaluating QBs. If they were, I think they would have taken one last year.
At this point my hope is that they aren't around to pick the next QB.
Say what you want about their talent evaluations but they didn’t “draft a QB just to draft a QB” this past season, did they? They had 3 they liked and none were available so they didn’t just take any ole QB. That should tell you that if they do in fact take one this next season it is because they actually like him, no? So no, if they take a QB it doesn’t mean they are taking one just to take one. They drove you insane because they didn’t do that this past year so you don’t get to accuse them of doing it when they do finally take one
They are talking about this kid and his tools in the same breath or notch below Calvin Johnson. That would be like passing on Calvin Johnson for Daniel Jones in 2019. The sad part is I see how they would justify it caving to fan pressure and embarrassment like they usually do. All reactive and no plan.
If they do something like this they doubly confirm to everyone they are weak and spineless at 125 Giants Way. No North Star. No plan.
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My point is watch how quickly all the people who spouted "you can't draft a QB just to draft a QB" change their tune when the Giants do exactly that.
Say what you want about their talent evaluations but they didn’t “draft a QB just to draft a QB” this past season, did they? They had 3 they liked and none were available so they didn’t just take any ole QB. That should tell you that if they do in fact take one this next season it is because they actually like him, no? So no, if they take a QB it doesn’t mean they are taking one just to take one. They drove you insane because they didn’t do that this past year so you don’t get to accuse them of doing it when they do finally take one
But if the QBs aren't graded as high as other players, they would be taking one just to take one. They're going to go from "not shopping hungry" to shopping while starved half to death.
Terps point is that everyone who said they couldn't pass on a superior talent at another position to take a qb in April 2024 is likely going to be saying how they have to take a qb and pass on superior talent at another position in April of 2025.
It comes back to what I've said for years: the Giants could draft an inanimate carbon rod and there'd be fans taking themselves into it.
It comes back to what I've said for years: the Giants could draft an inanimate carbon rod and there'd be fans taking themselves into it.
It is weaker in the sense that there isn't a Williams/Daniels level prospect. That being said, Ewers and Ward have shown progress this year that could get them on McCarthy/Nix/Penix level by the end of the season.
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...so according to Connor Hughes, sounds like this team needs to get to at least 4 wins!
Interesting; where did you hear him say that?
Inside BBI - Eric and John's interview of Connor Hughes!
BTW always glad to see your posts. One of the best Asshats on BBI!
Start at about 1:03:00 where John asks Connor for win totals needed - ( New Window )
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And further, everything I read coming into this year was about how this QB class was weaker than last year's. I've seen nothing thus far to change that opinion, but you can sense people already talking themselves into this year's class.
It comes back to what I've said for years: the Giants could draft an inanimate carbon rod and there'd be fans taking themselves into it.
It is weaker in the sense that there isn't a Williams/Daniels level prospect. That being said, Ewers and Ward have shown progress this year that could get them on McCarthy/Nix/Penix level by the end of the season.
Well Schoen and Daboll had the chance to draft a prospect like that and decided to pass, so why should we believe they would draft that player now?
This actually furthers GT's point. So many on here were saying you couldn't take a QB at 6 because they weren't slam dunk prospects, so you should take the "stud" WR instead. If this years crop of QBs tops out at the same level as the QBs available at 6, should we again pass on QB for the next "stud" and punt QB again?
It comes back to what I've said for years: the Giants could draft an inanimate carbon rod and there'd be fans taking themselves into it.
The problem with this is that at this point last season it was Williams and Maye being the apples of everyone’s eyes. There was little chatter of any of the others being worthy of top 10 picks. Daniels got on the radar rather quickly but it took a long time for McCarthy, Nix and Penix to enter the conversation.
There very likely will be some good QBs rising as the year goes on, just like last year but I wouldn’t expect you to come around on any of them, regardless of how good they become because you’ve already decided that all the QBs suck. Two weeks in…
I'll be fine with it if the Giants take a QB in round 1 (though I hope it isn't Beck because I'm pretty sure he stinks). I've said a million times they should take a QB at some point in every draft.
My point is you can already feel the tide of optimistic bullshit about this year's class starting to rise, even though like you said it's only been a couple weeks.
And why is it starting to rise? To justify the decision to pass on QB last year.
This feels like 2018/2019 all over again. The main difference is that Arch Manning looms in 2026. who's up for a 4-13 2025???
I don't think that is necessarily accurate. Teams don't have a numerical list from 1 to X and say who is the highest. At least as it pertains to Nix and Penix there were a fair number of people who did not have them as definite first rounders. If you look at Bob McGinn's compilation, the only QB's with 1st Round grades were Williams, Daniels, Maye and McCarthy. Penix had a 1st-2nd Grade and Nix had a 2nd-3rd Grade. Personally I would have given strong consideration to McCarthy at 6 because he was a 1st Round graded QB. If we are picking in the Top 2 or 3 in the 2025 Draft and have a QB who we have a 1st Round grade on we really should be looking at that (assuming no surprises between now and then).
I'll be fine with it if the Giants take a QB in round 1 (though I hope it isn't Beck because I'm pretty sure he stinks). I've said a million times they should take a QB at some point in every draft.
My point is you can already feel the tide of optimistic bullshit about this year's class starting to rise, even though like you said it's only been a couple weeks.
And why is it starting to rise? To justify the decision to pass on QB last year.
This feels like 2018/2019 all over again. The main difference is that Arch Manning looms in 2026. who's up for a 4-13 2025???
Could it be possible that the opinions of this years class is starting to change because people are seeing QBs they knew absolutely nothing about playing extremely well? Nussmeier for example. That dude can spin it. But he was behind Daniels last season so nobody knew who the hell he was. He was fantastic in their bowl game when Daniels sat out but that was a one game sample size. Or what about Cam Ward? He was an afterthought coming into the season. He looks incredible so far. Should people not change their opinions as they become more informed and more evidence is provided?
Sure, it’s possible all of these QBs suck. It’s also possible that all of this past drafts QBs suck. Daniels is the only one we’ve seen even a shred of evidence that he can play so far so let’s not act like the story has already been written on either draft class
Maybe McMillan, Nabers, decent OL, and a rotating cast of cheap characters at QB is enough on offense.